"I'm a sovereign human being, I stand under common law only" - Thread of Freemen

she challenged me over the course of 15 scribbled pages to prove that she was a person

Touch of the Myles na Gopaleens about that story

He made up less than youd think i guess, as i do myself

fondly remember some of the letters i got back when i worked for the Inland Rev, especially one that made repeated reference to THE TRIALS by FRANK KAFFER

max has written some good stuff on these guys iirc

― creating an ilHOOSion usic sight and sound (BIG HOOS aka the steendriver), Wednesday, November 27, 2013 3:41 PM (32 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

the american ones i mean

i found a piece by max about illuminati nuts, not the Freemen yet tho

i say this like that isn't 2 largely overlapping sets

yeah, if anyone has a link to max writing about these guys, i'd love to read it.

this one's sort of related: http://gawker.com/5729241/why-was-jared-loughner-obsessed-with-grammar

love these guys. ive never written any at length about them tho

Are these ppl actually mildly mentally retarded or something? Their logic is so selective and tenuous as to be non-existent. Their understanding of common law is thoroughly defective and unhistorical enough as to render their judgment essentially null.

I wonder what their wergild is?

They tend to be ppl for whom chancing it has worked thus far ime, or else ppl who feel that everyone else is chancing it and theye been left out (ime this is down to a total lack of appreciation for how societal rules actually operate)

in the vids i've posted some of the guys seem to be hippie/anarchist types, some of them are obv as darragh describes, some of them strike me as being a bit neurodiverse

I wish these guys would get into D&D or Pathfinder or something for a more productive channeling of their energies and need for explicit rules and structure written out in manual form

this thread has presented me with a variety of british accents I never knew existed

my favorite british accent is from ulster.

how many people got killed by people into the 'freeman' movement ?

the Anti-Defamation League published a report that described the so-called “sovereign citizen movement” as “one of the most problematic domestic extremist movements in the United States,” attracting mostly middle-aged or older men who are financially stressed, angry at government regulation or who want “something for nothing.”

The report cited the 2010 shooting deaths of two West Memphis, Ark., police officers during a traffic stop. The suspects, a father and son who were later killed in a shootout with police, belonged to the sovereign citizen movement.

2 at least.

It seems sorta like morgellons to me.

my favorite british accent is from ulster.

Brits out

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_West_Memphis_police_shootings#Background

The day after the shootings, Arkansas State Police identified the suspects as 45-year-old Jerry R. Kane Jr. and his 16-year-old son Joseph T. Kane. Jerry Kane had expressed sentiment against federal and local government online, and was accused of doing the same in person. Kane served three days in jail near Carrizozo, New Mexico for driving without a license and concealing his identity. He posted a $1,500 bond. After that incident, he complained of a "Nazi checkpoint".[citation needed]

Based on a 2004 conversation with Jerry Kane, Clark County Sheriff Gene Kelly expressed concern that Kane would be dangerous toward law enforcement. According to Kelly, Kane had complained about being "enslaved" by a judge who had sentenced him to serve six days of community service for driving with an expired license plate and no seat belt.[citation needed]
Insurance analyst J. J. MacNab observed that Kane ran a debt evasion business.[6] Jerry Kane also posted $10,000 bond (which a judge later ordered forfeited) on charges of forgery and attempted grand theft of a motor vehicle filed in Miamisburg, Ohio. Although Kane was arrested in New Mexico, he was never extradited to Ohio

seems they were quite into that lifestyle and their crazy believes triggered the incident.

operation endearing freeman

i wonder if the shootings have informed this heavy emphasis the UK guys place on being peacable, or if it's just that the UK guys have nothing to defend themselves with if the cops decide to break out the batons

Kane had complained about being "enslaved" by a judge who had sentenced him to serve six days of community service for driving with an expired license plate and no seat belt.

it's always petty shit that drives these people nuts.

what a horrible story. i hope that son can break free of his dad's influence in whatever is left of his life.

What's a debt evasion business? Teaching people to evade their debts? And then mailing them a bill afterwards and hoping they didn't learn too much?

i'm shocked that this shit has made it over to the UK -- i thought that this was 100% American crackpottery that wouldn't translate to any other culture.

Yeah, we should get royalties.

it's as if the impulse to making up bullshit "historical" reasons to justify your personal selfishness was universal

Never underestimate the capacity of cretinous British ppl to copy American stuff verbatim off the internet and ignoring whether it is remotely applicable to their own context- like when British racists copy n paste whinges about being asked to press 1 for English or 2 for Spanish

and to ignore

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/24/us/citizens-without-a-country-wage-battle-with-liens.html?_r=0

But as Sheriff Stanek soon learned, the liens, legal claims on property to secure the payment of a debt, were just the earliest salvos in a war of paper, waged by a couple who had lost their home to foreclosure in 2009 — a tactic that, with the spread of an anti-government ideology known as the “sovereign citizen” movement, is being employed more frequently as a way to retaliate against perceived injustices.

Over the next three years, the couple, Thomas and Lisa Eilertson, filed more than $250 billion in liens, demands for compensatory damages and other claims against more than a dozen people, including the sheriff, county attorneys, the Hennepin County registrar of titles and other court officials.

“It affects your credit rating, it affected my wife, it affected my children,” Sheriff Stanek said of the liens. “We spent countless hours trying to undo it.”

lol fuck that sherrif.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojZr6k2ksls

Real England tbh but

I'm assuming the bailiffs went away, came back with the correct paperwork, and took this guy's house.

lol the end when they tell the attendant police "you're gonna be heroes online".

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/03/28/sovereign-citizen-killed-in-shootout-with-ohio-deputies-serving-arrest-warrant/

Live free, then die.

did they take his gun from his cold, dead hand?

So many good quotes, I can barely choose.

“He was approaching the law from what he thought was a studious basis,” said Middleburg Heights Prosecutor Peter Hull. “He seemed to have a real sense that an injustice was being done [to him].”

And Middleburg Heights isn't some back-country cowtown, it's a decent sized Cleveland suburb just east of where I went to college.

Commenter OTM:

Artor • 36 minutes ago
Huh. If he thought he was not governed by the laws of the US, why did he think his 2nd & 14th Amendment rights were violated? This is the funny part of the Sovereign Citizen movement. They think the law doesn't apply, but that there is somehow a loophole in the law that lets them avoid it. Which is it? Does the law not apply, or does the law provide a way to weasel out of it? You can't pick both options, but it takes two brain cells to rub together to be able to realize that.

Welllll, sort of. I don't know about this guy but he could simultaneously believe that he wasn't bound by US law but that local officials who weren't in on the secret parallel shadow government should still treat him according to its tenets.

Artor with the classic "as a rational person let me tell you how irrational your beliefs are" gambit

The common law largely springs from royal decrees and even if you adopt the modern idea of sovereignty as stemming from the crown in parliament, the obvious assumption is that no individual is sovereign, not even the monarch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFE7qpFq-G4

copper in this one is quite sweet

when you see it in action like that, it's p close to str8 evil isnt it

evil plus boneheaded, the deadliest combination

this seems like some extreme kind of psychosis in action, doesn't it?

in a way, so do most non-mainstream worldviews/conspiracy theories? i guess this is the bit that i find interesting about them - a creative elaboration of how the world is based on the same evidence that others draw more mundane conclusions from. problem with the Freemen iteration is that in the end their worldview is very stilted, repetitive, uncreative.