Eric Clapton stands by Enoch Powell

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Off-topic again, but wtf: a couple of years back I unavoidably had to sit through a show by ol' slowhand (comp tix, date-type scenario), at which the ONLY moment of remote interest was a solo turn by Billy Preston that got the oldies up dancin' to "Will It Go Round In Circles." Good thing BP and David Sancious were conned into accepting the gig.

briania, Monday, 26 April 2004 14:41 (nineteen years ago) link

who do you write for stelfox?

NRQ (Enrique), Monday, 26 April 2004 14:48 (nineteen years ago) link

I'm not making excuses for the guy (who, indeed, hasn't released anything interesting since quitting smack), but it's worth mentioning that terms like "nigger" were tossed around much more casually (by Lou Reed, Willie Nelson, Lester Bangs, etc.) in the pre-PC 1970s.

Myonga Von Bontee (Myonga Von Bontee), Monday, 26 April 2004 14:50 (nineteen years ago) link

It may have been a pre-PC era, but that sort of language was still seen as racist in the 70s: Lou and Lester were being 'edgy'. They were cockfarmers.

NRQ (Enrique), Monday, 26 April 2004 14:53 (nineteen years ago) link

wherever will take me, nrq, apart from time out, mixmag and the omm. they're the ones i rule out. i've written for most places at one time or another. prob not the guardian any more, tho. mostly off these shores and quite a bit in german!

Dave Stelfox (Dave Stelfox), Monday, 26 April 2004 15:00 (nineteen years ago) link

fair play, but if a mag is shit, then surely it's all about improving it by joining it, otherwise you get the petridishes defining shit for the punters? omm has had morley and reynolds, so can't be all bad. mixmag looks like a lad mag n'all.

i couldn't quite work out why clapton was on the cover of a newsstand publication in the 04 == who gives a shit about clapton?!?

ENRQ (Enrique), Monday, 26 April 2004 15:03 (nineteen years ago) link

Lots of people still do, sadly (not me though)

Pashmina (Pashmina), Monday, 26 April 2004 15:04 (nineteen years ago) link

As evidenced by the fact he's always in just about every guitarist magazine, for ever.

Pashmina (Pashmina), Monday, 26 April 2004 15:05 (nineteen years ago) link

Plus, you obviously haven't seen any pub bands round our way!!

Pashmina (Pashmina), Monday, 26 April 2004 15:05 (nineteen years ago) link

i couldn't quite work out why clapton was on the cover of a newsstand publication in the 04 == who gives a shit about clapton?!?

-- ENRQ (miltonpinsk...), April 26th, 2004.

hence my slamming ead against monitor.

the observer mm has had chris blue writing for it - arguably the biggest imbecile to turn on a word processor. it is bad.

marcello working 4 time out is a good thing. he will make it better, as i saad, by a long fucking chalk, without even having to metaphorically get out of bed. my experiences with it, not good, though.

Dave Stelfox (Dave Stelfox), Monday, 26 April 2004 15:44 (nineteen years ago) link

ah, see what you mean. mine've been good but i am rookie and live on 30p a day. i'm deeply suspicious of the guardian without all that much inside knowledge, but part of me thinks it needs to be taken over rather than avoided.

ENRQ (Enrique), Monday, 26 April 2004 16:42 (nineteen years ago) link

Clapton and Jagger (both of whom are utterly, utterly dislikeable people) did as much as Friedman, Hayek, Joseph or Wiener to create Thatcherism, in that they broke down the idea that all Right-wingers were self-conscious fogeys, a factor which once made the Tories seem inaccessible to even the most Right-wing of the post-war generation who defined themselves against the *culture* of old-school Tories even if they were anything but socialist politically (cf the Campaign for Free Radio, as we know). they made the Tories seem culturally "safe" to those who may have been Right-wing but were nevertheless culturally intimidated by the dominance of the Elgar/Vaughan Williams protectionists - you could never have had Thatcherism had the Tories not won the support of a generation who did *not* have the insular High English cultural tastes we associate with 1950s Conservatives, and Clapton has given these people a very convenient get-out clause whenever anyone tries to discuss the contradictions.

i wonder whether there is any connection between the current return to the headlines of all these pivotal moments in the creation of the cultural side of the New Right - Clapton's comments, the announcement today that HBO are to make a film of the Stones' 1967 drug busts and the events that followed (personally i reckon Rees-Mogg defended them when he wasn't expected to mainly because he didn't have the deep and profound cultural Americoscepticism of many other conservatives of his generation and ilk, cf his comments on Bush and Iraq), BBC4 showing the Scorsese documentary on the influence of the blues on mainly southern middle-class Brits - and the fact that we are a week away from the 25th anniversary of Thatcher's election.

phoebe dinsmore's bastard nephew (robin carmody), Monday, 26 April 2004 21:23 (nineteen years ago) link

I know who that whippersnapper is! ;-)

Yeah, I was rather irritated to see Uncut filled with nearly 30 pages IIRC on the man... Ironically, the same day I read the Uncut, I was going through some very old Q's (dreadful magazine, generally speaking) in the house and, flicking through, chanced upon an interview with Phil Collins from 1995 or 1996 in which Collins referred to a friendship with Clapton and IIRC said they'd both been talking about Powell supportively. Was a bizare coincidence to come upon this on the same day, and it has ever more turned me against Clapton; whose own music has always bored me anyway.

Tom May (Tom May), Tuesday, 27 April 2004 02:24 (nineteen years ago) link

ts: "the international rock star conspiracy" vs "the international jewish conspiracy"

amateur!st (amateurist), Tuesday, 27 April 2004 06:39 (nineteen years ago) link

hello robin

Dave Stelfox (Dave Stelfox), Tuesday, 27 April 2004 09:44 (nineteen years ago) link

;-) Well, yes, they may not have been planning a mid-1970s-anti-Wilson-Govt-style coup against the then-Major Government, but it sounded like they were clearly yearning for a politician like Powell.

Tom May (Tom May), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 01:29 (nineteen years ago) link

Marcello - while I don't in any way intend to get drawn into some kind of fishwives slagging match, some things need clearing up.

1. It's really kinda tatty to misrepresent private conversation between us in a public forum. When I realised that you - a regular freelance contributor to Uncut - had been slagging off the magazine and, at one point, me by name, called you immediately. Responding to the somewhat self-dramatising thing you'd said about 'maybe my time at Uncut is coming to an end', I said: "Marcello, when you're good, I really like your writing. However, the swiftest way to 'end your time at Uncut' is to continue post unprofessional shit about the mag and me on messageboards.' What was it you posted: "He tried it and I told him not to." Oh, please. Grow up man.

2. As I later wrote to you, you've had a substantial amount of work from me, including your first Album & Reissue of the month. It seems sad that you're so unconcerned about the end of a relationship with the first publication to give you print work.

3. I asked you to review the Bay City Rollers reissues because, as I told you, I felt you were one of the few writers who could provide some kind of insight and perspective without being cattily dismissive. That's hardly an 'indignity.'

4. Uncut isn't perfect. We exist in the marketplace, with all the vitiated imperatives that implies.

5. You also need to understand that if you intend to work in anyway in print media, you will have to follow a bassline of professionalism: one of the things this means is that if your editor asks you to tweak a line, you don't throw your toys out of the pram. Often it means that they're actually bothering to engage with your work, which is actually a compliment.

6. You also need to realise that Time Out and Uncut are very different magazines, and that if they are willing to run your copy unchanged, that may be for a whole range of reasons, and not simply because they see it as tablets of stone. I will be interested to see whether you're still as enamoured of TO in 6 months time; remember, 6 months ago, you were very happy to be working for Uncut.

7. I mailed you and said the door was still open here, but that you had to reply. You have chosen instead to continue this brittle carping. It is your choice that Uncut's reviews section is no longer home to your occasionally glorious subversion. I think that's a shame.

David

David Peschek, Wednesday, 28 April 2004 11:57 (nineteen years ago) link

From herons & crows, this thread has submerged to the level of basslines and brittle carping.

briania, Wednesday, 28 April 2004 12:09 (nineteen years ago) link

moderator, delete david peschek please.

(btw, uncut was not the first publication to offer me work)

Marcello Carlin, Wednesday, 28 April 2004 12:21 (nineteen years ago) link

Also, I take a very dim view of a former employer coming on a PERSONAL messageboard to commit what counts as professional libel.

Marcello Carlin, Wednesday, 28 April 2004 12:27 (nineteen years ago) link

i never heard this about elvis costello before (i'm not a fan, so there isnt really a reason i would have done), what was the context around this, why did he say that?

i like what robin has to say upthread in regard to clapton and, much more so, i would say, jagger

gareth (gareth), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 12:32 (nineteen years ago) link

costello called ray charles 'a dumb blind nigger'. from reading all the stuff on this thread, it looks like clapton, costello and morrissey would get on well.

thesplooge (thesplooge), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 12:35 (nineteen years ago) link

costello did apologize much more sincerely than Clapton ever did though, right?

Sym (shmuel), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 12:36 (nineteen years ago) link

i'm more interested in the personal turn this has taken - the costello thing was said a long time ago. it's pretty widely reported. i wouldn't have remembered it myself, but now it's been mentioned, i do.

Dave Stelfox (Dave Stelfox), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 12:38 (nineteen years ago) link

Costello was trying to wind some other musicians up by saying the most offensive thing he could think of, he says. It's in something called 'Horn Rims From Hell' I think it's Greil Marcus. Michael Jackson later said, 'I don't dig that guy.'

PJ Miller (PJ Miller), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 12:39 (nineteen years ago) link

A dim view? Professional libel? Really Marcello, it must be cramped up there in your ivory tower.

It speaks volumes, too, that you're unable to respond to the many positive points in my original post.

Oh, well, that would seem to be that.

Apologies to everyone else for this dreary exchange. It has depressed me hugely.

David

David Peschek, Wednesday, 28 April 2004 12:41 (nineteen years ago) link

i never heard this about elvis costello before (i'm not a fan, so there isnt really a reason i would have done), what was the context around this, why did he say that?

He said it from of Stephen Stills and Bonnie Bramlett, he claims to wind them up - what with him being a real hardcore punker and all (chortle). To her eternal credit, Bonnie Bramlett walloped the little weasel.

Dadaismus (Dada), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 12:43 (nineteen years ago) link

That should read:

He said it in front of Stephen Stills...

Dadaismus (Dada), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 12:44 (nineteen years ago) link

Um, Marcello? I'm not entirely sure you have a winning argument here.

(Could someone with a UK law degree give some legal perspective on this on the moderator board?)

(oops xpost)

MODERATOR (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 12:45 (nineteen years ago) link

re: costello, wow, what a ruse.

if his comment wasnt well received, he would never have apologised.

thesplooge (thesplooge), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 12:46 (nineteen years ago) link

'a dumb blind nigger'

wasn't it 'blind, ignorant nigger'?

as for the carlin/uncut dust-up.....Jesus H.Clapton.

..., Wednesday, 28 April 2004 13:21 (nineteen years ago) link

Don't worry, the dust has all settled now.

Jesus H. Clapton, Wednesday, 28 April 2004 13:52 (nineteen years ago) link

how does this explain Clapton dating Naomi Campbell? oh, wait, Strom Thurmond to thread

Donna Brown (Donna Brown), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 15:34 (nineteen years ago) link

"Some of my best sexual conquests are black!"

latebloomer (latebloomer), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 15:36 (nineteen years ago) link

if your editor asks you to tweak a line, you don't throw your toys out of the pram

Wait they asked HIM to tweak the line and he got pissed off?

Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 18:07 (nineteen years ago) link

It was a remix of the bassline of professionalism too far.

N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 18:14 (nineteen years ago) link

Let your free time be the bassline. (of professionalism)

Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 18:20 (nineteen years ago) link

MC Flex Best
On shorter texts
Closely inspects
David Essex
Views on Roy Wood perplex
Works for NHS
Hails from Inverness *
Longer texts can vex
Focuses on auteur
More than he oughta
Myths he'll debunk dem
Precisely pinpoints punctum
Barthes crossed with Gambaccini
His mama cook great linguini
Knowledge encyclopaedic
Style belle-lettristic
And memoiristic
(Thinks Petridis a right prick)
Tight with his links
Thinks
Junior Boys stinks
Likes
Improv a lot
Friends
Again with Woebot
Dates a gyal called Gail
Receives bare email
From Man Like John Cale
Loves Robert Wyatt
Just
Don't
Try
It

!!!

cozen (Cozen), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 18:24 (nineteen years ago) link

"Also, I take a very dim view of a former employer coming on a PERSONAL messageboard to commit what counts as professional libel."

As someone with some legal training I can confirm that this is every bit as valid as most of Marcello's opinions.

barry stir, Wednesday, 28 April 2004 18:25 (nineteen years ago) link

Isn't professional libel committed somewhere on ILM every week?

Barry Bruner (Barry Bruner), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 18:26 (nineteen years ago) link

Thanks Cozen, I think.

N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 18:27 (nineteen years ago) link

I hate Eric Clapton. HATE Eric Clapton.


However, he is by no means racist.

David Allen (David Allen), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 18:27 (nineteen years ago) link

Wait they asked HIM to tweak the line

http://www.clarence.com/contents/musica/speciali/030527him/images/intro.jpg

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 18:35 (nineteen years ago) link

david, i think you will find that the comments he made are infamous and that the guy he aligned himself with was a notorious figure in british politics back before you were born.

Dave Stelfox (Dave Stelfox), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 18:50 (nineteen years ago) link

That is amazing, Cozen.

El Diablo Curmudgeonbotico (Nicole), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 19:12 (nineteen years ago) link

thank simon. I still can't quite believe it.

cozen (Cozen), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 19:21 (nineteen years ago) link

He said it from of Stephen Stills and Bonnie Bramlett, he claims to wind them up - what with him being a real hardcore punker and all (chortle). To her eternal credit, Bonnie Bramlett walloped the little weasel.

Wasn't he also shitfaced when he said it? Not that that excuses it, of course, but I'd put it nearer to Bowie's coked-up nazi chic folly than Clapton's unapologetic Powell support.

Daniel_Rf (Daniel_Rf), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 19:35 (nineteen years ago) link

yeah he was drunk as hell - he apologized profusely and recorded get happy! as a 'some of my best friends are black' jesture

cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 19:37 (nineteen years ago) link

also he guested on "Free Nelson Mandela", and has written songs for Solomon Burke, and given props to everyone from Otis Redding to Destiny's Child. (I realise a similar sort of defense could be built fer Clapton, but as I said, Costello renounced his idiocy and Clapton didn't).

Daniel_Rf (Daniel_Rf), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 19:41 (nineteen years ago) link

According to some brief Googling, he also called James Brown a "jive ass nigger" during the same conversation.

He was the first musician to drop the N-bomb on a UK top 10 single as well, remember ("Oliver's Army").

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 28 April 2004 19:42 (nineteen years ago) link

A wop bob a loo bop a wop bang boom

Richard Armstrong, Friday, 26 May 2006 22:01 (seventeen years ago) link

six years pass...

refers to this thread in the article.

pssstttt, Hey you (dog latin), Thursday, 11 April 2013 00:03 (eleven years ago) link

one year passes...

were those quotes in that article reported at the time?

۩, Saturday, 3 May 2014 00:31 (nine years ago) link

Looks that way, as Rock Against Racism was formed, at least in part, in response to them:

Originally conceived as a one-off concert with a message against racism, Rock Against Racism was founded in 1976 by Red Saunders, Roger Huddle and others. According to Huddle, "it remained just an idea until August 1976" when Eric Clapton made a drunken declaration of support for former Conservative minister Enoch Powell (known for his anti-immigration Rivers of Blood speech) at a concert in Birmingham.[2] Clapton told the crowd that England had "become overcrowded" and that they should vote for Powell to stop Britain from becoming "a black colony". He also told the audience that Britain should "get the foreigners out, get the wogs out, get the coons out", and then he repeatedly shouted the National Front slogan "Keep Britain White".[3][4]

Huddle, Saunders and two members of Kartoon Klowns responded by writing a letter to NME expressing their opposition to Clapton's comments, which they claimed were "all the more disgusting because he had his first hit with a cover of reggae star Bob Marley's "I Shot the Sheriff" ... Come on Eric... Own up. Half your music is black. Who shot the Sheriff, Eric? It sure as hell wasn't you!". At the end of the letter, they called for people to help form a movement called Rock Against Racism, and they report that they received hundreds of replies.[2]

Montgomery Burns' Jazz (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Saturday, 3 May 2014 00:44 (nine years ago) link


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