Transport in London is shit

When I went to London it was shocking how much more efficient, effective, and functional (if not more expensive) than anywhere else I'd been (and what more in an enormous city that deals with enormous volumes of people).

As a little experiment, to see if opinions differ depending on where you live, I've made a collaborative Google map. Stick a red pin in if you think tfl is shit, or a green pin if you think it's great. If you are really unable to commit to either extreme I guess you could use a yellow pin.

Email me at tom dotttt ledger attt gmail dotttt com for an invite, once you're in you can invite other people too.

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&oe=UTF8&msa=0&msid=106594618650848772292.0004636ab35215c6d1d70

Ledge, London is more than Zone 1.

It's a HELL of a lot more than Zone 1, and it's totally arrogant and elitist to judge the entire system on a tiny sliver of an experience that is totally unaffordable to the great majority of people that live in London.

The fact that we've been promised a tube for years, and STILL never got one (where are they sending our promised line? Oh yeah, to Clapham - because they're *so* short of train lines) - the fact that we STILL are not on the Oyster card system after how many years? And the fact that this is true of vast swathes of South London (sorry, we *are* London, even though lots of people would like to pretend otherwise) is indicative of MASSIVE FAIL.

The bus service in London is far better than that of any other city. The Tube has its problems, but is still pretty good IMO.

And problems with the rail service can be blamed on the ludicrous franchising schemes when the Tories broke up British Rail in the arly 90s.

It's true, the buses are pretty great.

In fact, rail in S London would do well to be given over to TFL- the former Silverlink line in N London has improved immeasurably since this happened last year.

And there is going to be a similar orbital rail link in S London, from Surrey Quays to Clapham, run by TFL:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/7886008.stm

Whatever the problems with the Olympics, London travel will be significantly improved.

Do the buses in Birmingham still make you pay for your ticket by putting your coins into a dispenser that, in order to be more efficient, doesn't give change? That was always fun.

There's no lateral S London rail link extending into Lewisham, Bexley and beyond. Which has always irritated me a teeny bit. Everything, literally everything, passes through London Bridge/Charing Cross for us lot. Normally this isn't too much of a problem, to be fair.

lol Birmingham

I think the transport is fantastic, though shit if you live south of the river.
I also read an independent review a while ago that put our 'metro' system as the most cost effective/efficient considering its size and availability, and also considering the number of people that use it each day.

It's easy to complain but we actually have a very good underground network, consisting of one of the largest networks of stations, geographical coverage, number of lines and connections, speed, etc etc.

Ledge, London is more than Zone 1.

Noooo shiiiitttt

a tiny sliver of an experience that is totally unaffordable to the great majority of people that live in London.

I'm sorry I'll shut up and get back to stuffing my face with caviar in my five mill riverside penthouse suite.

don't live in south london guys

i can and i will

That south circular rail was supposed to go to Streatham - it's now not. We got sold this massive scheme whereby they are going to knock down our Leisure Centre and build a massive Tescos in its place, in preparation for putting the tube station in the complex - but now we're not getting the tube, and we're still getting the sodding Tesco. :-(

I swear, since the re-conglomeration of the trains, service is getting worse. I didn't think anything could be worse than Thameslink, but First Crapital Connect still manage to somehow be.

And as to what they're doing to "upgrade" the system - basically shutting down trains to South London at evenings and weekends - because why on earth would anyone need to leave South London at the weekend? And oh yeah, let's shut the Victoria line at the same time - and close Oval, which is the one station on the Northern Line where it's actually convenient to get Brixton bound busses? Yeah, someone didn't think that one through.

I admit, this is a lot of venting, but I have just so much built up anger about how TFL treats South London.

what about stockwell?

wtf they can't close the only cricket-specific tube station

they can't

By the sound of things getting in and out of Lewisham is absolutely fine compared to South London further west. I very rarely have problems tbh.

Kate, seriously, just get an Oyster card, you've been having this rant for two or three years now. I've had two PAYG Oysters that they've never charged me a deposit for, that may be their fuckup though. And even if you do have to pay a fiver, the deposit pays for itself in two journeys anyway. And it's fucking useful on buses, which really ARE overpriced for non-Oyster users.

Also this is worth reading.

Where did you buy your Oyster that you didn't have to pay a deposit for?

They don't even sell them at my rail station. :-(

also p.s.:

When you first get your Oyster card, you will need to pay a refundable £3 deposit if you are only adding cash to pay as you go.

xpost i think the deposit is three pounds rather than five?

The thing about transport in london is that ok the tubes are up the spout more often than not, and the rail system seriously needs to get joined up, but the buses are fantastic. On the other hand I am seriously pissed off that fares are set to go up like 6% this year, mostly cos boris johnson wants a budget that looks good?

that is insane, ldn transport is incredible...anyone complaining about it has never lived in another city

― Local Garda, Saturday, 21 February 2009 05:16 (8 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

qft

I mean, in Northampton, buses run between 7am and 6pm. Just as a comparison point.

xp Any newsagent who sells travel cards will sell Oyster cards too.

Even in a city as big as Bristol, there are no such things as night buses, and Manchester's will allow you to go down the Oxford Road, anywhere else you're screwed. It was a big deal when the bus system went down the other day due to snow- the first time this has ever happened apart from Xmas day.

Pretty much every major bus route in london will run every 15 mins throughout every night- amazing, IMO.

I have lived in other cities. I have lived in NYC, whose mass transit system is so much better than London's it's not even funny.

Pretty much every major bus route in london will run every 15 mins throughout every nigh

Just. Not. Fucking. True. The number of times I've waited half an hour to an hour in the freezing cold on London Bridge...

Well, compare the buses to the buses you get in the US, which are twice the size and hold half as many people.

Though I really liked last weekend when only three out of the 12 (?) Tube lines were running in full without any kind of closures.

I suppose timetabling might not match the reality, but even so.

lol if we have to compare to other UK cities to make london seem halfway decent...compare to tokyo or berlin, where the metro lines run to the minute.

the london bus system is good, yes, but in practical terms this is counterbalanced by the congestion on the roads.

I mean, in Northampton, buses run between 7am and 6pm. Just as a comparison point.

Northampton isn't exactly a global capital of 7 or 8 million people, though, is it? The best comparison is with other major Western European capitals, and frankly, I can't think of a single one that is as bad or as expensive as London. It took me an hour to get from Stoke Newington to Waterloo yesterday, hardly a huge distance.

and an hour from stoke newington to waterloo is REALLY GOOD for that route.

when i worked in soho i experimented with walking home to dalston a few times, and it took me 10 fewer minutes than my usual bus journey.

I grew up in London, then moved back here six months ago - I work to work, but take the tube to see friends/ go out etc, mostly on weekends.

I would say I get to where I want to go quickly and hassle free about 40% of the time, and am able to get to where I want to go, at all (without using an unexpected bus and being so late there's no point in going), another 35% of the time. I don't really think that's acceptable, maybe other people would? This is Zone 1 btw.

I live in Stoke Newington, and work in Waterloo, and my commute takes an hour. The problem with Stoke Newington is not the bus service, it's the lack of tube stations, but that's a choice I made when I moved here. When I lived in Maida Vale, I could get from home to work, door to door, in half an hour.

Anyway, I agree that public transport in London is not as good as it should be. Key reason, in my opinion, is the fact that London was without any cewntral government for about 15 years. I know it's a cliche to blame Mrs T, but her government bears responsibility for London's transport problems, I think.

when i worked in soho i experimented with walking home to dalston a few times, and it took me 10 fewer minutes than my usual bus journey.

The near-constant bottleneck of traffic on Kingsland Road is fucking soul-crushing. I really can't wait for the East London Line extension, it'll make my whole life so much easier. I did once manage to get from Blackheath to Dalston in half an hour, that must have been some kind of record.

The only major international city I've been to with a worse public transport system is New York, funnily enough. Although at least New York's seems to work most of the time but it's still annoying as hell.

compare to tokyo or berlin, where the metro lines run to the minute.

tokyo = no night buses, if you want to get home after about 1230 your options are expensive taxi, waiting until the trains start again at 6ish, or... walking! Plus, tokyo buses can have a pretty loose relationship with their timetables.

The best comparison is with other major Western European capitals, and frankly, I can't think of a single one that is as bad or as expensive as London.

Having experienced the overcrowded, overheated slog that is Lisbon's public transport system, I'm calling bullshit on this. Trams look lovely but good god I'd hate to have to use them every day.

The best comparison is with other major Western European capitals, and frankly, I can't think of a single one that is as bad or as expensive as London.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rome_Metro

Don't know Rome but I do know Lisbon, and I can imagine commuting might be tricky. Lisbon is small and poor with tricky geography. At least it's cheap though! But big wealthy cities like Paris, Madrid, Berlin etc... their public transport systems are so far ahead of London's it's not funny.

The near-constant bottleneck of traffic on Kingsland Road is fucking soul-crushing.

i find that kingsland rd is usually ok? unless you mean up by dalston junction itself, in which case otmfm.

other soul-crushing bottlenecks of london which kill me on a regular basis: liverpool street, angel, fucking HOLBORN, jesus christ i hate holborn circus so much. once on my way into work it took me 35 actual minutes to get around it. that day i arrived 1hr and 50 minutes late :(

The traffic going west on Holborn is the worst in the entire city I think. Going east it seems fine but as I work there, I actively try and avoid arranging any meetings west of my office.

Where does anyone live in London?
I am a Londoner born and bred (and proper London at that, none of this south of the river nonsense) and I love the place, but being there for more than a couple of days just wears me out. Getting around is very difficult. Except by foot which can be the greatest thing in the world. Except when it's raining.

TFL: I appreciate your concern for my transport needs but I can honestly do without an individual email for every sodding bus route that may be facing disruption.

Kindly stick your 521 up your 521.

first time with a new overground train this morning - no carriage walls so it's like a big long bendy bus! loads of aisle room as well, have to say i was pretty impressed.

gonna have to take the 242 from east into town later and i JUST FUCKING KNOW those lazy cunts will stop it after holborn viaduct LIKE THEY ALWAYS CUNTING DO.

too fucking hot to use the tube in the summer. esp when you have to wear a suit. hopefully the olympics will make TFL put in some AC.

Hey Londoners who have to get overground trains into work, are you all looking forward to the cut in the number of trains coming into effect on December 13th? Not to mention everyone else who's going to suffer from even more overcrowded tubes and buses as a result?

Having not cycled to work since I broke my leg two months ago I was looking for additional motivation to get back on my bike again. This'll be it, then. Thanks TFL!

I've just checked and there are now FOUR fewer trains going from my local station between 7 and 9am.

this is exactly the kind of thing that kicks my work ethic out of its default slumber - if i don't get on with this shit THIS IS THE ALTERNATIVE