defend the indefensible: glenn fucking greenwald

I fully agree with lampoon. I just don't see this particular imcident - which is what we are talking about on this thread - as something motived by race/racism.

― In the airplane over the .CSS (Le Bateau Ivre)

missing the point

it's like a cross between the paddy considine bits of bourne and idk, edward albee or something. what do you think their home life is really like??

dan's point in part is that these discussions have denied Greenwald's non-white husband autonomy as a human being.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_zSBav7yXqqg/TPsZR_n7z6I/AAAAAAAAAKI/c-1hsF4qLLU/S290/Ralph%2BEllison%252C%2Binvisible%2Bman.jpg

alfred i at least am on record in this thread calling miranda a total hottie. seriously confused by your disagreement on this issue tbh

he looks too much like an ex tbh, although the latter didn't use thin flip-flops.

once again, for the record:

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02647/guardian_2647256b.jpg

dan's point in part is that these discussions have denied Greenwald's non-white husband autonomy as a human being.

That Greenwald himself is one of the people doing this is icing on a very frustrating cake.

mashing of teeth

lol u need to brush up on your bible stories

― i am.. a maven (Matt P), Monday, August 19, 2013 3:52 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i do my own translations

anti-cargo shorts discussions are definitely denying miranda his autonomy as a human being

i understand that you disagree, lbi.

but "don't bring in skin colour", as though it's something self-indulgent or narcissistic or trolling, is not the way to express that.

apparently i have made my point to your satisfaction though so.

if i was mama miranda i'd be throwing shit at greenwald's head right now and chasing him around the room, is what i'm trying to say on this thread

in the movie, directed by Sean Penn, Glenn Greenwald (Bradley Cooper) will turn to David Miranda (James Franco) and explain before leaving to meet Snowden (Justin Timberlake) how "life's gonna get fucked up for the both of us" from now on.

dan's point in part is that these discussions have denied Greenwald's non-white husband autonomy as a human being.

― first I think it's time I kick a little verse! (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, August 19, 2013 3:55 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

eh idk not sure we need to get all gender studies on this, from the point of view of the story it makes a lot of sense to look at it like this, guy was acting as greenwalds gopher

xp I will watch the shit out of that movie tho

i...what...the last 50 posts

those flat-tops are more objectionable than cargo shorts imo

by picking on aspects of his look you are denying him agency over how terrible his look is as a whole

i understand that you disagree, lbi.

but "don't bring in skin colour", as though it's something self-indulgent or narcissistic or trolling, is not the way to express that.

apparently i have made my point to your satisfaction though so.

― caek, Monday, August 19, 2013 9:58 PM (17 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I didn't perceive it as self-indulgent or trolling. I just didn't see how it was relevant, but i see what you mean. I still don't think they detained Greenwald's partner "easier" or earlier because he isn't white (and I still don't understand why Dan said Miranda was white in the first place, if that was an error or not).

But I understand where you are coming from now. It's not about my satisfaction . But to be told, by Crut, that I am "shouting down a black person" is a shocker. It implicates a lot of things about me that are completely untrue. And with brute force, no less.

LBI does tend to say some tonedeaf race stuff, i chalk that up to being euro, and i'm certainly sympathetic to looking at events through a race-literate lens, but in fairness DJP's first post was at best a little vague

Do I know you?

"Tonedeaf race stuff"?!

Examples please...

And clusterfuckville right on schedule. Population: us

tempting to believe nakh's theory, including "they would be more likely to detain you because you're brown."

eh idk not sure we need to get all gender studies on this, from the point of view of the story it makes a lot of sense to look at it like this, guy was acting as greenwalds gopher

Having read the Guardian piece and the NY Times piece, I feel that this renders the "family should be off-limits" retort nonsensical. It is a given that this shouldn't have happened, regardless of who was traveling with the documents, but acting extra outraged because it was your husband and not you screams of having your cake and eating it, too. Like, either dude is helping you and is cosigning onto facing and weathering the static, or you are a gross user putting someone who didn't sign up for it in danger and then turning their discomfort and trauma into a ego piece about yourself. The "He's not even a journalist" line especially rankles, because why would you ask him to transport these documents for you if he was unwilling to take on the risk of being detained?

otm

spread the resulting paste between two intact teeth

― OH MY GOD HE'S OOGLY (DJP), Monday, August 19, 2013 7:53 PM (23 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

my god

LBI - Sorry for singling you out & saying you shouted. "Why bring up skin color?" is just a pet peeve of mine; I honestly do think saying such things stifles open discussion & I was honestly appalled that you would ask such a thing because I thought Dan was making an important point. I know that's not what you intended. I was trying to be gentle w/my response but I fucked it up.

Thanks Curtis, I appreciate that. I for one am sorry my reply came across that blunt. I didn't intend it that way. And I do think everything is on limits here, race too, for it is an interesting take on things I - and no one on this thread - had tread on before. I didn't recognize it as such at the time though, thought it was a brash interruption of what we had been speaking about for hours. The issue of race suddenly popping up. But that was my blunt way of responding. I didn't intend to insult anyone or dismiss it.

Group hug.

I do think Greenwald's biggest mistake today was saying he will write more aggressively and release more classified info now. He should have released the anyway.mnow it almost sounds like "ok guys I was going to give youse a break but you've gone too far now!' Which is nagl a motivation for a journalist.

here is what greenwald actually said:

http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1rm09tf

he will burn london to the ground

to the ground

hes gonna wear one of those masks and post to reddit everyday

greenwald and twitlonger are truly made for each other. btw i love how dude is shocked, shocked that reuters would interpret his answers as just a leetle vengeful??

I don't care if you're black, white, greenwald...

Speaking by phone from the couple's home in the Tijuca forest, Miranda said it felt "awesome" to be back. "It's really good to be here. I felt the weight lift off my shoulders as soon I got back. Brazil feels very secure, very safe,"

this is trolling at its most rarified level

drinking a caipirinha on the porch in his flip-flops, with his dog.

swimming with piranhas in cargo shorts, in a crime ridden favela *"knowledge" of brazil exhausted*

guardian editor alan rusbridger has now written his own article about this, and is responding to comments under the article:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/aug/19/david-miranda-schedule7-danger-reporters

A little over two months ago I was contacted by a very senior government official claiming to represent the views of the prime minister. There followed two meetings in which he demanded the return or destruction of all the material we were working on. The tone was steely, if cordial, but there was an implicit threat that others within government and Whitehall favoured a far more draconian approach.

The mood toughened just over a month ago, when I received a phone call from the centre of government telling me: "You've had your fun. Now we want the stuff back." There followed further meetings with shadowy Whitehall figures. The demand was the same: hand the Snowden material back or destroy it. I explained that we could not research and report on this subject if we complied with this request. The man from Whitehall looked mystified. "You've had your debate. There's no need to write any more."

And so one of the more bizarre moments in the Guardian's long history occurred – with two GCHQ security experts overseeing the destruction of hard drives in the Guardian's basement just to make sure there was nothing in the mangled bits of metal which could possibly be of any interest to passing Chinese agents. "We can call off the black helicopters," joked one as we swept up the remains of a MacBook Pro.

In a private viewing cinema in Soho last week I caught myself letting fly with a four-letter expletive at Bill Keller, the former executive editor of the New York Times. It was a confusing moment. The man who was pretending to be me – thanking Keller for "not giving a shit" – used to be Malcolm Tucker, a foul-mouthed Scottish spin doctor who will soon be a 1,000-year-old time lord. And Keller will correct me, but I don't remember ever swearing at him. I do remember saying something to the effect of "we have the thumb drive, you have the first amendment".

The fictional moment occurs at the beginning of the DreamWorks film about WikiLeaks, The Fifth Estate, due for release next month. Peter Capaldi is, I can report, a very plausible Guardian editor.

Speaking by phone from the couple's home in the Tijuca forest, Miranda said it felt "awesome" to be back. "It's really good to be here. I felt the weight lift off my shoulders as soon I got back. Brazil feels very secure, very safe,"

this is trolling at its most rarified level

― TracerHandVEVO (Tracer Hand), Monday, August 19, 2013 7:14 PM (43 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

damn that sounds like a cool ass place to live http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tijuca_Forest

i had this weird long daydream the other day about what it would be like to live in a rainforest.

alfred hey, the man knows his way around an seo-heavy lead graf, whatcha gon do

can we just say what this really is, which is now that ostensibly democratic governments are targeting and detaining white dudes for talking shit about them, it's finally unacceptable?

― OH MY GOD HE'S OOGLY (DJP), Monday, 19 August 2013 19:53 (Yesterday)

the reason i gave this short shrift is because you are describing miranda as white

and yeah miranda being described as 'white' was not implausible having scanned through maybe one photo of him, the uk is not the same as america or brazil, there's no equivalent category to 'latino' or 'pardo' so a lot of south americans are just sort of seen as 'white - other'

to the actual argument occluded by this, that miranda is a minority person whose victimization is not credited, or only credited by proxy because they have husband....sure, and yes it's unfortunate that greenwald's monomania only furthers this

/have a white husband/

slob imo:

Greenwald lives and works in a house surrounded by tropical foliage in a remote area of Rio de Janeiro. He shares the home with his Brazilian partner and their 10 dogs and one cat, and the place has the feel of a low-key fraternity that has been dropped down in the jungle. The kitchen clock is off by hours, but no one notices; dishes tend to pile up in the sink; the living room contains a table and a couch and a large TV, an Xbox console and a box of poker chips and not much else. The refrigerator is not always filled with fresh vegetables. A family of monkeys occasionally raids the banana trees in the backyard and engages in shrieking battles with the dogs.

Greenwald does most of his work on a shaded porch, usually dressed in a T-shirt, surfer shorts and flip-flops. Over the four days I spent there, he was in perpetual motion, speaking on the phone in Portuguese and English, rushing out the door to be interviewed in the city below, answering calls and e-mails from people seeking information about Snowden, tweeting to his 225,000 followers (and conducting intense arguments with a number of them), then sitting down to write more N.S.A. articles for The Guardian, all while pleading with his dogs to stay quiet. During one especially fever-pitched moment, he hollered, “Shut up, everyone,” but they didn’t seem to care

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/18/magazine/laura-poitras-snowden.html?hpw

glenn is an unusual cat

imagining him drinking and playing heads up poker v his husband after a long day of blogging

in the jungle