Bjork's new program "Vespertine" Total Victory or Total Failure?

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There isn't any good songwriting here. This album certainly merits the "all production, no songs" criticism so often wrongly doled out. I also think Tori Amos broke into the studio and wrote half the lyrics. And that drippy instrumental.

Melissa W, Tuesday, 18 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I actually adore that drippy instrumental. :) Part of that stems from being in Switzerland and spending a good amount of time looking at the insides of music boxes, though.

Dan Perry, Tuesday, 18 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

There are plenty of songs. That argument is as bogus in this case as it is in most cases. In fact, people who argue that usually are talking about straight-ahead (Verse-Chorus-Verse-Chorus etc) songs, of which Vespertine probably has more of than most Bjork records. Look at Undo, or It's Not Up to You. My personal favorites are the 2nd and the 11th song personally.

hans, Tuesday, 18 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

with bjork you either love her work, or the opposite... i believe

me, i think this is her best work yet. even if you hate or love bjork, you have to admit one thing.... it is her, and it is totally unique. its so personal... i dont know how the hell you people can say its just the other people doing her work for her, you really need to get a clue. Look at any other pop artist and you can find maybe 2 or 3 songs actually written by them (most of the time just cowritten) nevertheless produced. and i really dont care what anyone says, but her lyrics and her melodies are very original and interesting (not to mention they suit each other perfectly).

So i dont know... we are all entitled to our own opinions, but keep the facts straight -Rex

Rex Gregory, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

The more I listen to 'Vespertine' the more I love it. The minimalistic glitch and scratch balancing perfectly with her exquisite melodies. She morphs her voice in so many directions. Those complaining about the lack of song-structure completely miss the point. Utterly divine, I've not held Ms Gudmundsdottir is such high esteem since 'Birthday' was released.

stevo, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Vince Mendoza is the devil. I want Emir Deodato back. The arrangements of choir and strings on Vespertine are still dreadful and trite. And surely the melodies and chord progressions were picked out of a hat full of complimentary notes and chords?
I love Post and Homogenic dearly. But Vespertine has now officially taken its place as my least favorite Bjork release.

Melissa W, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

complementary*
I'm so tired.

Melissa W, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Melissa, I think we've got where you're coming from on this one - I didn't think this was an ILFMBoP thread. ;-)

Strangely, apart from the "no songs" accusation, most of what you say about Vespertine is true. But misses the point. I can't really explain it, but all the yardsticks by which one previously judged a Björk record just don't seem to be of any use with this album. AND it sounds gorgeous into the bargain.

Record of the year so far, then.

Jeff, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

ILFMBoP???

I guess I'm just more disappointed by this than I've ever been about a record...that's why I keep going on about it.
I expect a lot from Bjork and she usually delivers.
If I wanted to listen to the Empire of the Sun score over glitch beats...then I'd get two stereos and do just that.

Melissa W, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Vespertine is the most beautiful, intimate, and cosmic piece of music ever created. (my humble opinion)

Archer Krantz, Wednesday, 3 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

After reading your criticism of Vespertine, Melissa when I finally got it at the weekend I approached it with a bit of trepidation. Listening to it I've came to the conclusion you're listening to a different record. It must be the most vulnerable, passionate record I've heard this year and the tunes are as good as anything she's done.

On a slightly different topic what is the thing on the front of the CD it looks like a stone or maybe top of a crutch? Any ideas?

Billy Dods, Wednesday, 3 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

The cover looks neat, but neither I nor anyone I know has said it's a good album. It's crap. It's barely even music. Of course, I don't really like her anyway.

Nude SPock, Wednesday, 3 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

On a slightly different topic what is the thing on the front of the CD it looks like a stone or maybe top of a crutch? Any ideas?

I was wondering about that too, until I saw a promotional shot of Bjork wearing the same dress as on the cover. If you look at it very closely, you'll notice it's the head of the swan.

JC, Wednesday, 3 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

You 'know' a few here at least who adore it Nude Spock. Seems to have split opinion more strongly than any other recent release I can think of.

stevo, Wednesday, 3 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Where are all the Björk fans that hate Vespertine? I can't possibly be the only one!

Melissa W, Wednesday, 3 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Anything worth really loving is worth really hating too.

Ryan A White, Wednesday, 3 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

one month passes...
if you're a björk fan and you don't like vespertine then its only becuase you're a fucking moron and have to be told how to have emotion....

tyler durden, Tuesday, 20 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Where are all the Björk fans that hate Vespertine?
I would love to join you there Melissa but I can't. I hate Björk AND Vespertine. Though I did only listen to a track or two. Are there any Björk haters who love Vespertine would be a much more interesting question from my point of view...

alex in mainhattan, Tuesday, 20 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

*fucking moron*
Emotion is not all there is to music. Staind are pretty emotional.
Cut-rate glitch + cheesy strings and choirs + warbling Björk + cringe- worthy lyrics + flat melodies does not a good Björk album make.

Melissa W, Tuesday, 20 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

i know it's cheesy andrew lloyd webber pap but i loves it i does. (can't listen to merzbow ALL day, now, can we...)<-- well of course we can but one gets a royal headache.

bob snoom, Tuesday, 20 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I think "Vespertine" is brilliant.

Sean, Tuesday, 20 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

'whoosh' is the sound of Vespertine flying over your head.........

Jeremy Reinbolt, Monday, 26 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

No. There's nothing on that that would fly over anyone's head. Every card is on the table. It's just dull. Or perhaps you could tell me what's so mindboggling about schmaltzy John Williams-style cinematic strings and choirs with glitch effects and a few music boxes and underachieving melodies?

Melissa W, Monday, 26 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Geez, Melissa, anyone would think you didn't like Vespertine much.

Tim, Tuesday, 27 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I hate Vespertine passionately because it's like waking up one morning to find someone has replaced a beloved family member with an evil clone, and I'm the only person who can tell the difference.

Melissa W, Wednesday, 28 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I would argue that there's nothing inherently wrong with schmaltzy John Williams-esque string arrangements and by reining in some of her stylistic tendencies, Bjork is singing the songs on this album rather than letting them sing her.

Dan Perry, Thursday, 29 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Or, in other words, she has ceased to be Bjork.

Melissa W, Friday, 30 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Melissa, you're clearly a discerning and not a dismissive listener and I appreciate that you are disappointed, but I just can't see what your beef is. I think Vespertine is nearly as good as Homogenic, which means that it's nearly perfection.

Why is Vespertine un-Bjork-y? Why do you think she has ceased to be herself? Sounds like she's writing exactly the songs she wants to and doing it exactly the way she wants to to me, so I think Vespertine is Bjorky, but even moreso than normal.

Why is it OK for Radiohead to put out albums that don't sound like Radiohead but it's not OK for Bjork? (Okay, don't answer that one, that was a low blow, but I'm still curious about the first question.)

EdwardO, Friday, 30 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

a) I hate the strings. They're vile, Saving Private Ryan concoctions.
b) Björk warbles like a wibbly, in-love child. None of the power of her former self. She sounds subservient, human, commonplace. Not alien and passionate.
c) The songs have no drive. They sort of meander about, reaching no particular melodic peaks. On all of her old songs...there were moments where the melody or chords went somewhere unexpected...became otherworldly... There's nothing, here. Just sounds like something pleasant I might hum to myself on a walk. And the songs have no energy. Even when it seems she wants them to break free a bit, they're just sluggish. Even live, the songs feel substanceless and indistinct from one another.
d) "I LOVE HIM! I LOVE HIM! I LOVE HIM! I LOVE HIM! (she loves him! she loves him! she loves him! she loves him!)" Very few albums approach the cringe-worthy lyrics and moments of Vespertine.

Not a single reason I ever listened to Björk is on this album. It's not that she's making music that is unlike her previous work, it's that she's making music I wouldn't like no matter who made it. There's not an inspiring moment on it. No electricity, no fire, no shimmer.
And besides, I wasn't an obsessive Radiohead fan until Kid A. I mean, I loved OK Computer, but I loved the aspects of it that alluded to Kid A more than I liked the ones that alluded to The Bends.

Melissa W, Friday, 30 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

You're nuts. It's Bjork's best album. Not even that different from her earlier stuff. To me it sounds like a mellow Homogenic, same kind of sound but more inward, less dissonant. Bee-utiful.

Ben Williams, Friday, 30 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

That's what I mean. It's a great record.

a) The strings are actually wonderful. No, the arrangements and compositions are all wonderful The opening few seconds of "Harm Of Will" are a triumph and maybe the best 5 seconds of pop this year. But I can't argue your point here so we'll have to agree to disagree.

b) Okay, I take exception to this. You seem to be boxing Bjork into what you think she should be here. Why does Bjork have to be the things you've said? I reckon if you're distilling and reducing the essence of Bjork's charm to "alien and passionate" then maybe you don't like the other albums so much. Surely she has more going for her than that? I find lots of things I love about Bjork on Vespertine in greater quantity than on, say, "Post".

c) The reason I bought up Radiohead is because this exact same criticism (which I imagined you might use) surely applies to half of Kid A and some of Amnesiac too. But it doesn't apply to Vespertine. "Heirloom", "It's Not Up To You" and "Unison" even have hooks for heaven's sake! HOOKS! Or are those verboten? Please further qualify "energy" - really how energetic is "Headphones"? Or "All Neon Like"? Not very energetic AT ALL but still great songs. The same applies to "Coccoon" and "Undo" or whatever other songs you think aren't energetic.

d) As for (B). You're boxing Bjork into your narrow pre-conceived perceptions of what she should be doing. Oh heaven forbid she should say, NAY EXCLAIM "I love him!". Of course, if it were "I just need to explode this body!" that'd be OK, I'm sure.

EdwardO, Friday, 30 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

but does she still have snaps from that little island where she'd snuck off to with her little ghetto blaster? i think about that island all the time.

Tracer Hand, Friday, 30 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I'm going to stick up for Melissa here. "Vespertine" seems to be an album which only reveals ever greater shallows with each listen; I think Mel has nailed it in the sense of it being, above everything else, melodically unsurprising and narrow.

HOWEVER, I reserve the right to completely change my mind about this, as "Post" took weeks and "Homogenic" possibly *months* to worm their way into my favour. I thought they were mostly rubbish at first (and I've only had the new one a fortnight or so).

Michael Jones, Friday, 30 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Thank you, EdwardO, for making the point about those Radiohead albums; I was going to do the same thing but didn't want to sound argumentative.

OK, so Melissa doesn't like "Vespertine". So what. I think it's amazing. So do lots of other Bjork fans. That's enough for me.

Sean, Friday, 30 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I think a more pronounced dip has been in her videos for Vespertine... I haven't seen "Coccoon" yet but really... was "Hidden Place" that effective with all the psychadelic snot? One time in the movie theatre they showed the "Pagan Poetry" video in its entirety to advertise the album between film previews. Quite disorienting. As for the music, I think it's fine even if it does sound all soundtrackish and isn't very dynamic.

Honda, Friday, 30 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

What happened to Gondry? Directing Radiohead videos now?

Honda, Friday, 30 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

He is doing movies now. I think it was called Human Nature or something.

Ryan A White, Friday, 30 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Agree with Honda, videos of late have been crap. Actually, single choices have been exceedingly poor since Post. "Hidden Place" as a single instead of "It's Not Up To You"? Whatever it was that was up with the "Pagan Poetry" video? Maybe she has gone off the deep end a bit... what next, "An Echo A Stain" as a single with a video featuring the camera being inside her mouth and looking out? Bjork's music is still wonderful but it wouldn't hurt to pitch it a little less obscurely to the public. Certainly a video as stunning as "Bachelorette" would be appreciated.

And Sean, I'm fine with people not agreeing that Vespertine is a triumph, but I just can't understand Melissa's reasons for disliking it so. I'm genuinely curious.

EdwardO, Friday, 30 November 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

one month passes...
Engish isn't my mother language so excuse it.

I just wanted to say to all those who didn't like Vespertine : you don't have a heart!! This album is one of the most original and creative albums I have ever heard. To say that bjork is a genious is un understatement, because no other contemporary artist has been or is as innovative as she is especially since Homogenic, another great album. Sometimes I wonder if this lady is human, because I'm not sure that humans are capable of writing such amazing, touching, annoying but still incredibly human words, so if she's human then I'd say that she's surely unique and one of a kind. enough said about bjork, let me go back to Vespertine.

To begin with Hidden Place is an incredibly well done song, and I agree with her choosing it as the first single. This is my second favorite song on the album.

Cocoon : I found it disturbing in the beginning but after hearing it 4 or six times I started loving it and its explicit erotic lyrics.

It's not up to you : a beatiful song, one of the rare sing along songs of the album and the choir is just awsome.

Pegan Poetry : the hightlight of the album and my favorite one. It's a haunting, touching and powerful love song. I have never heard a woman singing about love in this way, it's deeply original. Even when she bursts out at the end saying I love him I love him.

well I can't go on reviewing the rest of the songs because I haven't heard them enough.

PLease don't hate bjork and be grateful that artists like her exist in a world full with purely commercial music and singers like britney spears and jlo

Peter SLEIMAN, Sunday, 30 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

one year passes...
Gorgeous, gorgeous, GORGEOUS!

mei (mei), Thursday, 2 January 2003 11:19 (twenty-one years ago) link

two months pass...
Melissa, you are nuts!

Cozen (Cozen), Saturday, 22 March 2003 21:49 (twenty-one years ago) link

In a nuts way of course.

Cozen (Cozen), Saturday, 22 March 2003 21:53 (twenty-one years ago) link

...yes...Melissa...your instinct is right...Vespertine is poor...so is Homogenic...so is Debut...come over to the dark side of Bjork-hayt0rz & join our tiny but righteous party...give up the struggle...you know you're one of us...

J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Saturday, 22 March 2003 22:13 (twenty-one years ago) link

You're nuts too.

Cozen (Cozen), Saturday, 22 March 2003 22:15 (twenty-one years ago) link

...Cozen...don't resist...deep in your soul you know you're one of us, too...something about that growl Bjork does secretly annoys the crap out of you...join us...join us...

J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Saturday, 22 March 2003 22:16 (twenty-one years ago) link

Hey, wait.

Cozen (Cozen), Saturday, 22 March 2003 22:18 (twenty-one years ago) link

...yes...yes...it is warm in the cavern of the Bjork-hayt0rz...and we have many delicious cookies besides...mmm...cookies...yours for the taking...we serve them with a particularly excellent tea...tell us your true feelings about Vespertine...don't be afraid...yes...yessss...

J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Saturday, 22 March 2003 22:21 (twenty-one years ago) link

Ooh... feels... kinda warm...

Cozen (Cozen), Saturday, 22 March 2003 22:22 (twenty-one years ago) link

...tickly...

Cozen (Cozen), Saturday, 22 March 2003 22:23 (twenty-one years ago) link

I like this album a lot but I never listen to it, whereas I go back to Post and Homogenic (and selected songs from Medulla and Volta) a lot.

this iphone speaks many languages (DJP), Monday, 17 July 2017 18:31 (six years ago) link

I think the original title for Vespertine gives us a nod to why it's so quiet - Domestica

Paisley Window Pane (Ross), Monday, 17 July 2017 18:53 (six years ago) link

two years pass...

Anyone heard the Vespertine opera, any good? It's now released on CD:

https://www.galileomusic.de/cover/400/oc978.jpg

Siegbran, Wednesday, 7 August 2019 07:46 (four years ago) link

Funny to see the intital lukewarm reaction to this now ILX certified classic.

chap, Wednesday, 7 August 2019 12:47 (four years ago) link

that is weird. IMO it's clearly her best album and also the last album of hers I really loved.

akm, Wednesday, 7 August 2019 12:59 (four years ago) link

I'd agree, except maybe with the 'clearly'.

chap, Wednesday, 7 August 2019 13:03 (four years ago) link


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