I kinda think the Curia is getting ready to kill the pope (again).
The Vatican issued an “explanatory note on the meaning of “salvation,” on Thursday, May 23, after media reports circulated indicating that Pope Francis” promised heaven for everyone engaged in good works, including atheists.
In response to the media attention, the Rev. Thomas Rosica, a Vatican spokesman, said that people who know about the Catholic church “cannot be saved” if they “refuse to enter her or remain in her.”
(Translation: Atheists are going to Hell if they don’t accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour.)
http://www.examiner.com/article/vatican-corrects-pope-atheists-are-still-going-to-hell
― ballin' from Maine to Mexico (Dr Morbius), Sunday, 2 June 2013 05:12 (ten years ago) link
Does the Church still believe in the existence of Hell, or does it define Hell ambiguously, as "total separation from God." If the former that seems pretty gauche.
― the strange and important sound of the synthesizer (Treeship), Sunday, 2 June 2013 05:47 (ten years ago) link
Sorry i see now that my question has been dealt with earlier. Anyway, i'm not a fan of this Vatican retraction.
― the strange and important sound of the synthesizer (Treeship), Sunday, 2 June 2013 05:49 (ten years ago) link
heh heh heh enter her or remain in her heh heh etc
― j., Sunday, 2 June 2013 06:00 (ten years ago) link
when to withdraw is a p big deal for us
― bob_sleigher (darraghmac), Sunday, 2 June 2013 09:46 (ten years ago) link
Saints Sergius and Bacchus were Roman soldiers, Christian martyrs and gay men who loved each other. They were killed around 303 in present-day Syria. Their feast day is observed on Oct. 7. The couple was openly gay, but secretly Christian — the opposite of today’s closeted Christians.
The close bond between the two men has been emphasized since the earliest accounts, and recent scholarship has revealed their homosexuality. The oldest record of their martyrdom describes them as erastai (Greek for “lovers”). Scholars believe that they may have been united in the rite of adelphopoiesis (brother-making), a kind of early Christian same-sex marriage.
http://blog.gaycatholicpriests.org/2011/10/gay-saints-and-lovers-sergius-and-bacchus/
― eclectic husbandry (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 8 October 2013 14:54 (ten years ago) link
Still no HBO miniseries on pornocracy :(
― guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 2 December 2014 17:59 (nine years ago) link
My priest relative-by-marriage concelebrated a Vatican Mass with Francis a few weeks ago. I guess he might be a bishop someday if he wants that.
― things lose meaning over time (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 2 December 2014 18:02 (nine years ago) link
Junipero Serra as a saint, si o no?
― skateboards are the new combover (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 23 September 2015 19:37 (eight years ago) link
I leave such matters to my lawyers.
― Aimless, Thursday, 24 September 2015 04:02 (eight years ago) link
it was bound to happen despite most evidence being that he's a shit. disappointed that Francis did that but if I agreed with absolutely everything Francis said and did it would be wrong.
― akm, Thursday, 24 September 2015 13:47 (eight years ago) link
https://twitter.com/mcmoynihan/status/646686363732066304
― nakhchivan, Thursday, 24 September 2015 14:22 (eight years ago) link
The Rev. John McNeill, an openly gay Roman Catholic priest who, from the 1970s onward, publicly pressed the church to welcome gay men and lesbians — and who was expelled from his order as a result — died on Tuesday in Fort Lauderdale, Fla. He was 90.
His death was announced by DignityUSA, an organization that supports gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender Catholics. Father McNeill had helped found its New York chapter in 1972.
A Jesuit who was ordained in 1959, Father McNeill was known in the decades that followed as an author, activist and psychotherapist specializing in the needs of gay clients. He first came to wide, explosive attention in 1976 with the publication of his book “The Church and the Homosexual.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/26/nyregion/john-mcneill-priest-who-pushed-catholic-church-to-welcome-gays-dies-at-90.html
― skateboards are the new combover (Dr Morbius), Saturday, 26 September 2015 13:30 (eight years ago) link
RIP
― akm, Saturday, 26 September 2015 16:36 (eight years ago) link
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/08/us/pope-francis-archbishop-joseph-tobin-newark-archdiocese.html
this seems like a positive development
― k3vin k., Monday, 7 November 2016 20:01 (seven years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yd54HzNI_Rk
― i n f i n i t y (∞), Monday, 26 June 2017 21:21 (six years ago) link
As always, the main cultural signifier here isn't religion so much as nationality, class and coming from a family that shoves you in front of a set that resembles a tidied up Rosemary's baby in order to answer questions about your sexual lack of history
― quet inn tarnation (darraghmac), Monday, 26 June 2017 21:37 (six years ago) link
haven't seen rosemary's baby
but yes, catholicism is definitely tied to local culture (i'm not sure i'd say nationality)
― i n f i n i t y (∞), Monday, 26 June 2017 21:46 (six years ago) link
Family first, then social circle then community then school then nationality
Church can fit in p much anywhere there depending on the severity of the infectiom
― quet inn tarnation (darraghmac), Monday, 26 June 2017 21:50 (six years ago) link
true
― i n f i n i t y (∞), Monday, 26 June 2017 21:55 (six years ago) link
was talking catholicism with an acquaintance the other night. we were remarking how we were still pretty earnest and believing, if with plenty of doubts, when we made our confirmations and had chosen confirmation names accordingly. i chose san martin de porres (mixed-race peruvian saint a sort of patron saint on anti-racism and the poor), and he chose st anthony - because his mother was always telling him to pray to st anthony as he was always losing things. he had a friend who chose zeno, because it was the funniest name of a saint other than homobonus that he could find and he knew he'd get in trouble if he said he was choosing homobonus
― -_- (jim in vancouver), Monday, 26 June 2017 22:08 (six years ago) link
haha
man having two confirmation saints is hard work lemme tell u
― i n f i n i t y (∞), Monday, 26 June 2017 22:48 (six years ago) link
to answer questions about your sexual lack of history
I thought we were talking about Catholic girls?
― pplains, Tuesday, 27 June 2017 00:57 (six years ago) link
Saint Dorkus is another classic
― droit au butt (Euler), Tuesday, 27 June 2017 07:07 (six years ago) link
what was it like backing frank black?
― Rodney Stooksbury for President (rushomancy), Wednesday, 28 June 2017 00:42 (six years ago) link
please help me understand the de Auxiliis controversy. the question is that god grants grace to man without man having to do anything but this doesn't sit right with jesuits bc man should participate in his own redemption or am i completely misunderstanding the point of contention?
― Mordy, Monday, 2 December 2019 22:55 (four years ago) link
From a quick read in Wikipedia, it appears to be more of a question of how the doctrine of free will affects a person's ability to accept or reject grace and hinges upon the intricacies of how god's omnipotence and omniscience would work in a system where god is trying to bestow grace, knowing ahead of time it will be rejected. It is the usual tying oneself in knots to overcome inherent flaws in the logic of church dogma and doctrine.
― A is for (Aimless), Monday, 2 December 2019 23:57 (four years ago) link
and determinism
― deems of internment (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 December 2019 00:00 (four years ago) link
kind of thing which i find too boring to get into too much - no disrespect to theology in general but this particular dispute has me yawning. seems like both sides kind of viewed causation as a zero sum game. the more god does the less the individual does and vice cersa. bañez and the dominicans believed in physical premotion, the influence of god on the will of the person who acts on that will, jesuits found this overly deterministic, though they did believe in god knowing everything that could happen including counterfactuals, and creating the world as it is while knowing all the options so that always seemed kind of deterministic to me also
― #FBPIRA (jim in vancouver), Tuesday, 3 December 2019 00:02 (four years ago) link
determinism vs free will obviously a very old question and lots of great apologetics out there reconciling omniscience and free will etc but this seems to be specifically be about the efficaciousness of grace specifically, and aiui specifically as relates to its conveyance automatically iow without the actual participation of the sinner but maybe w/ some level of his participation acc to jesuits? this is precisely the point i am trying to understand.
― Mordy, Tuesday, 3 December 2019 00:05 (four years ago) link
a quick google tells me this is "one of theologies most exciting debates"
― #FBPIRA (jim in vancouver), Tuesday, 3 December 2019 00:47 (four years ago) link
theology's. fuck.
i feel like this is something that you can't just make a pithy summation of that will explain too much. although if it were i would not be in such a position to do so
― #FBPIRA (jim in vancouver), Tuesday, 3 December 2019 00:48 (four years ago) link
especially because earlier debates in the church precede and inform it (the dominicans are augustinian thomists)
― #FBPIRA (jim in vancouver), Tuesday, 3 December 2019 00:49 (four years ago) link
i thought augustinianism and thomism were different?
― treeship., Tuesday, 3 December 2019 02:33 (four years ago) link
where are some underrated aerosmith bootlegs to enlighten me
― Mordy, Tuesday, 3 December 2019 02:48 (four years ago) link
Xp.Yeah they are. Thomas Aquinas both draws from and disagrees with Augustine, I guess I should've said that Dominican theological position on grace and predestination draws from aquinas and thomas
― #FBPIRA (jim in vancouver), Tuesday, 3 December 2019 02:50 (four years ago) link
i mean, no catholic believes in predestination
― treeship., Tuesday, 3 December 2019 02:56 (four years ago) link
right?
― treeship., Tuesday, 3 December 2019 02:58 (four years ago) link
Well the Jansenists did and they claimed to just be disciples of Augustine
― #FBPIRA (jim in vancouver), Tuesday, 3 December 2019 03:02 (four years ago) link
no catholic believes in predestination...right?
After you've been catechized, the church cares little about the private little heresies of its communicants, so long as they don't make a big issue out of them. If you are a priest or some other official of the church it's trickier, and you'd better be able to couch your determinism in the kind of theologically acceptable obscurantist terminology that won't get you in trouble with the church hierarchy.
― A is for (Aimless), Tuesday, 3 December 2019 04:20 (four years ago) link
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harrowing_of_Hell
― Lidsville U.K. (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 15 December 2019 18:02 (four years ago) link
^Because I was wondering went on during those three days.
― Lidsville U.K. (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 15 December 2019 18:24 (four years ago) link
metal as fuck
― WHEEL! OF! FORESKIN! (bizarro gazzara), Sunday, 15 December 2019 18:27 (four years ago) link
Martin Luther: [looks directly at the camera, Office-style] https://t.co/s9EFy1IZPe— Adam Kotsko (@adamkotsko) March 22, 2020
― j., Sunday, 22 March 2020 01:19 (four years ago) link
capitalism: this fuckin thing has exposed most of our activities as painfully blatant scams
catholicism: hold my bier
― thou shalt not covid thy neighbour's wife (darraghmac), Sunday, 22 March 2020 01:50 (four years ago) link
lol x 2
― budo jeru, Sunday, 22 March 2020 04:34 (four years ago) link
What a worldhttps://www.aod.org/sacramentsupdate
― 𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Sunday, 23 August 2020 15:11 (three years ago) link
peter at the pearly gates: i'm sorry, we can't let you in. looks like there was some sort of administrative error down there on earth. it's gonna take a while to clean up. don't worry, there's a waiting room *nods toward purgatory*
― The GOAT Harold Land (Karl Malone), Sunday, 23 August 2020 15:25 (three years ago) link
“Look it’s not a big deal, minor administrative snafu, well get it figured out, but in the meantime don’t die because of you do youre going to hell”
― 𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Sunday, 23 August 2020 17:26 (three years ago) link
so...if the priest wasn't technically baptized all that time, does that mean that the people he baptized are also at risk of eternal hell due to administrative error?
― The GOAT Harold Land (Karl Malone), Sunday, 23 August 2020 17:31 (three years ago) link