an attempt at a general "What are you currently digging re. classical music" thread

i wish i liked lou harrison more. i like the idea of his music more than the actual offerings.

Yes I am never moved to seek more.

At the moment I am quite deeply into Ives: no4/Holidays/a CD worth of songs. And Finnissy is a bit like a latter day Ives, both of whom transform their own folk musics with the exception that Finnissy loves folk musics of every corner of the globe and he's far mroe subtle whereas Charles inserts quotation marks.

Vinko Globokar: Echange and Res - As - Eex - Ins - Pirer, both for trombone solo are quite something. His ensemble works aren't as interesting but I need to know more. His opera had Diamanda Galas in the lead role.

Rediscovering Xenakis' chamber works: Dmaathen, Charisma...Anaktoria has an outstanding ending. So punishing and good!

Berio: some of the sequenzas, esp the one for Recorder, Cello and Voice are p/great. As are the folk songs. I've been stuck into Coro for too long (not exactly a bad thing, it is still possibly his best)

Lachenmann's Accanto, where he drops a tape of Mozart in the middle of fierce concrete instrumentale. Very much like Kagel and Nono...the music that was can never be again. Its not about a notion of march of progress; this isn't necessarily better, but a "we can't repeat" msg is at work. The str trio; Dal Niente for Clarinet.

Berg's Lyric Suite is, in some ways, a counterpart to Accanto.

Birtwistle - Messiaen(ic) screams all round, in Triumph of Time its all delayed and er, well, timed.

A change of pace w/Les Barricades Mysterieuses by Couperin in the v well regarded recordings by Blandine Verdet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntxQHGv6SBs

the 'hexameron' youtube account is so great, full of slightly marginal but wonderful piano repertoire

I just started getting into the composer Örjan Sandred, a Swedish guy who now teaches at University of Manitoba. The album Cracks and Corrosion, which you can stream on Naxos Online, is pretty satisfying imo. "Cracks and Corrosion no. 2", for classical guitar with live electronics, was the initial draw and is still my favourite: some excellent processing, gets pretty intense at times. But the whole album is a good mix, with acoustic pieces opening and closing (piano + clarinet + string trio; flute and harp). In between, you also have "Amanzule Voices" for cello with live electronics, and "The Third Perspective", which is entirely computer-created but based on his analysis of cello sounds.

Some programme notes:
http://sandred.com/texts/amanzule-progr-note.pdf
http://sandred.com/texts/3rdpersp-progr-note.pdf
http://sandred.com/texts/Cracks-and-Corrosion-II.pdf

He actually offers software and Max patch downloads at his website too!

Also getting back into Ben Thigpen, an electronic/EA composer to whom I was exposed a great deal when I was at Buffalo. It's not the same without octatonic surround sound but there are some good samples/excerpts here:
http://thigpen.free.fr/pages/music/paths.html

I'm never sure whether electronic music counts as 'classical', unless it's scored.

How much interest would there be in a ballot poll of either string quartets or chamber music?

SQs would suit my habits of late.

Both would be good.

Actually we should amalgamate into one poll for chamber music that includes str quartets.

I was just thinking yesterday that ILM has never had a proper classical music ballot poll. Since I'm a diletantte when it comes to classical, I'd love to see this happen, so I can get recommendations. But I think the poll should include all of it, not just chamber music... Possibly it could have two different votes, one of chamber music and one for orchestral works? Kinda like the earlier polls have had different votes for singles and albums.

I can't, unfortunately, lend a hand to try and organise due to lack of time but its interesting to try and shape what it would look like. From what I've seen of how these are conducted can we have a top 50 countdown, seems weird to have stuff with a couple of votes in the poll.

Also don't think there is much point in an orchestral poll -- most of us know its 'classics'. Bit yawnsome, google.com job.

Then again I always had to work some enthusiasm for it: always been my feeling that, few orchestral-sized works aside, the seismic shifts etecetera have been in chamber/solo music repertoir. This is certainly true in the last 40 years. Mid-sized ensembles have done better and I wonder if that would be included as chamber or orchestral? If there are two polls, that becomes a question.

Well, it becomes a question even if there's just one poll; what size would the ensemble have to be so it's not "chamber" anymore?

Also don't think there is much point in an orchestral poll -- most of us know its 'classics'. Bit yawnsome, google.com job.

If we were to follow this logic, there wouldn't be any genre polls, since we all know well-known classics are gonna place high in any of them... But I think these polls can still be exciting, and those like me, who aren't well versed in genre in question, they can be a great way to get into new stuff, even if it isn't new to someone else.

Personally over 20 and it isn't chamber anymore. I'll go to a classical board I am a member of and ask actually.

As oposed to electronic/dance, the canon for orchestral music is an incredible bore. I've got a sinking feeling about it..

"Chamber music" is already a far broader category than "disco" or "heavy rock albums of the 1980s". If I'm running the poll, I'm not going to poll "all classical music", i.e. every genre of Western art music (solo, chamber, orchestral, choral, opera, electroacoustic, ...) from the Medieval era to the present day. Other people are welcome to do that if they want to, obv. It makes more sense to me to focus on one genre, as long as there is enough interest. The somewhat vague definition of "chamber music" does make me consider just doing "string quartets" instead.

xpost

Agree that coming up with a def to apply to a poll would be difficult, esp when it seems a lot of work when there might be only a dozen people voting.

re: quatets there is a big enough volume, shame it only became a thing in the last, what, 250 years? Chamber would mean Ars Subtilier songs and Zelenka's trio sonatas in the menu.

"Only the last 250 years"!

I don't think I'd include any vocal music in a chamber music poll, certainly not Medieval songs. If we went that way, I'd probably keep it to instrumental music for 2-10 instruments.

Wasn't it Haydn that got str quartets going...so that's 300 years or so...

Reading wiki now though: "The origins of the string quartet can be traced back to the Baroque trio sonata, in which two solo instruments performed with a continuo section consisting of a bass instrument (such as the cello) and keyboard."

So this would include Zelenka.

Ars Subtilier had instruments with a singer or two. Small set-up, less than 10.

As oposed to electronic/dance, the canon for orchestral music is an incredible bore. I've got a sinking feeling about it..

Agreed, but in what way does this mean orchestral music is a bore? IDG u sometimes.

Str quartet poll would be awesome, but it would be rightn natural if it could include quintets as well. Because Mozart k515, schubert d956 and the two Brahms are so fkin killer.

I wasn't commenting on the accuracy of the "250 years" comment. I just thought it was funny to say "only the last 250 years" when the entire history of rock and roll is about 60 years old (and we poll very specific subgenres of it all the time).

haha ok sorry I read a question mark which wasn't there.

I would include Finnissy's String Trio if we widened it on the string front. Or Aroura (for 12 str) by Xenakis (which is much btr than his str quartet imo)

so er, what's IDG :-)

Its not a big mystery. I often feel there is more exploratory work carried out in smaller ensembles/chamber, and a lot more of what an instrument can do is explored when its written for solos only as well.

I was listening to Xenakis' Persephassa earlier today and you look at the variety of sound and action (and this given that you're not getting the full 'surround sound' that you would in a hall, from a recording)...and think how orchestral composers completely ignored percussion, makes you furious really. A lot of it is one big show.

But as I said in some earlier post Xenakis' whole conception of sound-as-mass really suited the orchestra.

I was listening to Xenakis' Persephassa earlier today and you look at the variety of sound and action (and this given that you're not getting the full 'surround sound' that you would in a hall, from a recording)...and think how orchestral composers completely ignored percussion, makes you furious really.

Except for the many, many orchestral composers who didn't ignore percussion at all? The expanded role of the perc section is THE most characteristic thing abt 20c orch music!

(NB Persephassa in Central Park was the most powerful live music experience of this century for me so far)

Yes that was a rant against pre-20th century orchestral.

But even so the increase in size in numbers doesn't add a whole lot for much of the time.

So I've gotten answers back: "written for several instruments to play without a conductor" is the one there seems to be good agreement on so far.

The quote from the Grove dictionary does widen what can and can't be considered chamber but it still falls under the with/without conductor.

I can see we're going down str 4et route here :-)

I'm pretty familiar with that Grove article, yeah. I think what most people mean by chamber music is fundamentally "music for small instrumental ensemble" (generally not more than 10) with one player to a part and usually without a conductor. I wouldn't generally consider the solo and vocal pieces mentioned in Grove to be chamber pieces and, even if they are, I'd be comfortable with excluding them for the purposes of a genre poll. But, yeah, string quartets might be easiest!

Like, I've never seen the 19th-century lied described as chamber music anywhere else. I would never expect to see performances of Winterreise or Dichterliebe at a chamber music festival.

I was going to teach a chamber music history course last semester and was certainly not planning to include madrigals and lieds. (The course was cancelled due to low enrolment.)

Anyone have any thoughts on Alexander Tcherepnin? I've found myself streaming his orchestral and chamber music for several hours now. Disappointed I'd never even heard OF him before. There's an appealing, er, oddness infusing his mid-20-century-ness. [Yeah, I'm no musicologist.]

I started listening to his piano sonatas. This is pretty much in my sweet spot for acoustic 20th-century music.. Thanks for the tip.

I don't do ballot polls but I'd happily read the thread

Don't do many polls but if this ever gets off the ground it might be interesting.

Thinking about all the great 20th century chamber music, I've been leaning back towards doing a general chamber music poll. I'm waiting for more than two other people to express interest in nominating and voting, though.:P

That was always going to be a problem. I think there are about a dozen people here who would vote, just whether they'd be here or not, or would be inclined to do so, were it to go ahead at all.

I'd vote, but my ballot would be pretty gauche.

And also mostly piano music.

Thread needs more gauche IMO!

Also what'd you play at your recital
?

Debussy, 3 gauche selections from Children's Corner

Only because my Chopin etude was nowhere near performance ready

currently going through Weill's "Lost in the Stars" and "The Witness Cantata" by Swanee Hunt for an upcoming performance

Xpost étude pour le main gauche

it's the 100th anniversary of the premiere of The Rites of Spring and a radio station - QXR? not sure - was playing nothing but versions of that all day & Mrs. Aero had that goin' to the living room speakers so I took in two versions: one arranged for solo piano (tremendous), one orchestral - man oh man that conclusion. Always worth really listening to. In between versions, much talk about the premiere, of course, how accurate the legend is, etc. But idk, it doesn't really matter, having the excuse to take one piece of music that came along at a time of new ideas being put forward and really look hard at it, listen to it, and to do so via radio instead of sitting down with my records & CDs and curating my own experiement...really cool. Also aero jr. seemed to really enjoy the orchestral version and banged on stuff.

Yeah! I can see Le Sacre being diggable for a kid.

I saw a dance piece based The Rite... last night with only a few bits of it played at the end.

Always been much keen on Pierrot Lunaire (if we want to the whole Schonberg - Strav fite again, which we don't). Kind of want to see a perf @ the Proms in July. The Proms are usually not that good - the Albert Hall is such a stuffy venue - so I'll see if I'll bother with this.

Marais, in the Sophie Watillon versh. The piece I'm linking is something I've falled hard for today.

Pisendel's Violin Sonantas (Steck & Rieger)

Nono's Risonanze Erranti. Chamber music, indeed.

Working through more French Baroque chamber, played by Musica Antiqua Koln (Le Parnasse Francais) - you can see why they were legendary. The playing has such an energy to it, and I love how they pick on fairly obscure composers not just Bach (really the reverence for the man is so offputting), gives a much needed overview, and there is enough that it shows how the Renaissance flows into the Baroque, these aren't self-contained eras.