ZZ Top: C/D

ZZ Top and their 1st-RioGrandeMud-TresHombres period are like the American blue-collar worker and $20 buck/hour wages. The paradigm is gone and not coming back.

What paradigm is that? When was ZZ Top ever defined by the year they were recording in? I know you're talking about sound here -- too narrowly, I think -- but either way, that seems like a blank argument.

What's exactly is there -to do- with ZZ Top if you're a producer, anyway?

I don't know what line of work you're in, but I hope it's not producing records. What exactly can you *do* with 4/4 time and 12 bars? It's just so limited...

I know, maybe my hopes are too high. But there's a lot of ZZ Top to work with. There's some serious raw blues, as was said, and their affinity for pure sonics, which was all-time greatness on a couple albums before it got a little out of hand and cloudy, and there's always that genius/weird sense of humor that produces songs like "Cheap Sunglasses," which is a joke with no punch line, so instead of being funny, it decides to just fuckin' rock. There are a lot of places for ZZ Top to go or go back to, which of course is Rubin's speciality.

And while rationally I know better, I want to believe that there's such a thing as Huge Fuck-Off Beard Magic, and that Rubin and Billy and Dusty all have it in spades.

With all the southern rock haters I've seen on ILX I'm surprised at how positive this thread is.

This is the first band I can remember liking. Ecstatically at that. A tape of Eliminator that I think belonged to my dad.

Kenan, I made the same mistake with the new Stooges album.

:(

I'M BAD

I'M NATIONWIDE

They dumped all that when they went to RCA for Antenna.

There's still silly polish and f/x all over their last few records, including Antenna.

They need to release a for-real live album. I saw them at the Beacon Theater late last year and had my brain yanked out and hurled around the room.

I've heard they can still dominate live. No news on any of the old shit being remastered like fandango and 3 hombres, right? Too bad, I'd love to upgrade the first two.

No, none of the others are on the Rhino remaster list, as far as I know. You're right, they definitely should remaster the first two - hell, I'd like remasters of everything up through Eliminator (which is coming as a 2CD deluxe edition later in the year).

I sprang for the box set which has fabulous sounding remasters of the early records (and the rest too).

I burned the box set from a friend, it only made me hungry for more.

Some of the real early Moving Sidewalks stuff is great. Salt Lick is a fucking jam.

yeah, there are days where I think Tres Hombres is the only record by anyone I'll ever need, so I know what you mean.

that seems like a blank argument

A yawn is a silent shout.

ZZ Top haven't exactly been making bad albums. Other than name value on the marquee and in the press, having Rick Rubin working with you is no guarantee of anything. I would buy their next CD regardless of whether he had anything to do with it.

The reprints, such as they exist, of the first two albums get a bit of bad rap, particularly if one reads about the original ZZ Top box, not the Chrome Smoke and BBQ anthology of a few years ago. There are a number of customer reviews on Amazon of the original 6-LP-on-3-CD thing that are fairly vituperative.

But you can get it cheap now as used merch and if you turn the discs up loud they do sound great. The complaints stem from the replacement of the Seventies ambience in the mixes with something of a Nineties sheen here and there, most noticeably on the remix of Tejas.

However, I went back to it this year after I noticed distortion on my copy of the deluxe reissue of Fandango.

The newest Fandango sounds fine for most buyers but it is pushed a bit and mine has some digital clipping. The old remaster from the box does not and while it's not printed as loud, this is remedied by turning it up. Which is how I always listen to it, anyway.

There's still silly polish and f/x all over their last few records, including Antenna

That's a matter of taste. Mescalero is raw and brutal throughout much of it. Rhythmeen is a wall of guitar. And they definitely aren't doing the Eighties Rockman sound -- which is how most of the people who bought the hit records know them.

After reading reviews of all the RCA albums, I think Rhythmeen is the one I need. And I believe the complaints about the ZZ Top Sixpack (their first six albums, except Degüello, which was the best one post-Tres) stemmed from the replacement of the original 70s drum tracks with programmed rhythms to make 'em palatable to fans of Eliminator and Afterburner.

Mescalero is raw and brutal throughout much of it.

I'm sorry but there is nothing raw and brutal about any ZZ Top record from the last, what, 25-30 years? Which isn't a bad thing. I'm a huge fan of their 12" dance remixes. But those terms, regardless of relativity, don't seem accurate.

I was listening to them pretty closely, Phil, and all of the drums don't sound horribly butchered to me. My subjective opinion was that in remix they sometimes used the same reverbs they used ca. Eliminator and Afterburner, maybe indeed to make the rhythms sonically more in the same vein as the latter albums for the mass fans. And Tejas may have had some of its original drums yanked out -- it's on this LP that the changes are most apparent -- but if they were all redone for every LP, I can't tell. Much of it still strikes me as adequately vintage.

On balance, I'd still recommend it to someone who wanted a lot of ZZ Top on the cheap.

Re brutal and Mescalero:

But those terms, regardless of relativity, don't seem accurate

Green! No -- red! Purple! No, dammit, mauve! Warn off some more, quick!

You describing a recent ZZ Top record as raw and brutal is still the better joke.

boys, where is the love?

I think I'll give the newer records a try. I've held off thus far.

I'm re-listening to Mescalero right now. It's kind of absurd, really. Post-80s Gibbons has become obsessed with adding little gimmicks in order for the band to somehow sound "modern" and "hip." I'm mean, what the hell was he listening to when making this record -- nu metal?

Now I don't mind some gimmicks, but ZZ Top has to back it up with real rocking; that's what they excel at. Ever since Deguello (which I like, not love), the rock-to-gimmick ratio has slowly been shifting. I do like some modern ZZ Top. They're always reliable for a decent groove or two or a fun pop song (Antenna ain't bad). But these recent records don't touch the band's early output. And I wouldn't mind hearing ZZ Top try to match that again. I think they do have it in them.

I've seen ZZ Top twice in the last 10 years, and they delivered live. But I don't think that intensity is on the more recent albums.

yeah, based on that alone I'm stoked to hear a Rick Rubin-produced ZZ Top record.

The last revolution in tone they went through came with Eliminator when Billy started playing through Rockman equipment, Frank Beard was laced to sequencing and a click track and gated reverb was used on all the drums.

Among drummers, Frank Beard is a Stepford Wife.

I like to watch drummers doing little domestic chores. ;)

Pleasepleaseplease call it Licensed to Ill.

The only album I ever thought about pitching to 33 1/3 series, the only thing I could even fathom listening to 10000x times, was Tres Hombres.

I just saw that ZZ Top is opening for Aerosmith this summer. High potential for the headliner getting blown off the stage.

so fucking awesome

Amen. I am looking forward to their demolition of Aerosmith.

http://whatimg.com/images/2hf8qhi89ed02dlnixdw.jpg

http://www.1077thebone.com/Portals/2/Bone%20Bash%2010/zzTop2.jpg

SO FUCKING AWESOME

been going through all the VH1 Storytellers: ZZ Top stuff on Comcast - there's 90 minutes of some recent live show in Texas that is great

I think they just released that on DVD. With the clever title "Live in Texas".

Yeah, that DVD's great. Exact same set list I saw them play at the Beacon Theatre (at ferocious volume). Also available on CD, well worth picking up.

Found this cool thread with alot of comments by Terry Manning from Argent Studios on working on all of the ZZ Top albums they recorded (which is really most of the really good ones).

http://recforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/mv/msg/3849/0/0/0/

cool, fun to read about that stuff!

I could be on that thread for days.

wow I had never made the Ardent connection before

Are we hearing mostly fender tweed amps on this record?

Some, but some are also from BG's customised Marshall heads, which he renamed "Rio Grande" brand. The controls were all labelled in Spanish, and the logo was palm trees.

There is some cool stuff later on doing the drums for Eliminator. It's pretty much drum machine with some live percussion overdubbed to match on top.

Was just listening to Fandango and got to wondering what happened to the rest of the kickin' live show that made up the original a-side? The remaster has some live bounus tracks, but liner notes say they are from four years later.

Also: Dubya Tee Efff?

1. Sharp Dressed Man - Steven Tyler, Mick Fleetwood, Jonny Lang, and John McVie (The M.O.B)
2. Gimme All Your Lovin' - Filter*
3. Tush - Grace Potter & The Nocturnals
4. Legs - Nickelback
5. Cheap Sunglasses - Wolfmother
6. Got Me Under Pressure - Duff McKagan's Loaded
7. Beer Drinkers and Hell Raisers - Coheed & Cambria
8. Just Got Paid - Mastodon
9. Rough Boy - Wyclef Jean
10. Waitin' for the Bus / Jesus Just Left Chicago - Daughtry
11. La Grange - Jamey Johnson

I'm already hearing the Coheed lead vocal in my mind.

I foresee a "least appitizing performance" poll...

holy shit "Gimme All Your Lovin'" by Filter

I just picked up Afterburner and Recycler on vinyl for a dollar each this weekend. \o/

A couple of years ago I interviewed the singer from Coheed and he was talking about how their then-current album finished the multi-album sci-fi saga he'd been writing, and I asked him if he ever just wanted to sing songs about cars and girls - "you know, like ZZ Top," and he laughed and said no. Liar.

whatever happened to the new record produced by rick rubin?

they were on tour this summer in europe BTW iirc

Rough Boy - Wyclef Jean

NIIIICE

The Mastodon Just Got Paid has been around forever, is this a new version?

Good news, ZZ Top has actually put out a live CD from the good ole' days. It is mastered really hot, but overall the production quality is pretty good.

Live in Germany 1980

It is taken from a Rockpalast show from back before the wall fell. I guess you can get the DVD of the show too.

Now if the boys would just get with it and remaster the rest of their catalog, which I sadly think might not happen anytime soon.

Listening to the new album, La Futura, now. The first four songs were released as the Texicali EP earlier this year - the other six are just as noisy 'n' nasty. Sure, it took almost a decade to get here, but they really do sound energized and raucous. Gibbons' guitar work is disgusting in the best way, and it sounds like Frank Beard is actually playing drums on this album.

it's a fantastic record, isn't it?

Matt acquired all the old Guitar Moves eps from Vice/Noisey which are slowly being re-released but also (!!!) Matt started producing new eps

ah thanks, i wondered what was going on. never saw them the first time round for vice-avoidance reasons, hugely enjoying them now though

however i could definitely have done without kid rock in the billy gibbons one

I could do without Kid Rock on this earth.

kid go find another rock

Kids performance at Woodstock 99 is epic and undeniable

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsrMqnNxy1o

I read that and inferred that ZZ Top played in some sort of kids’ tent at Woodstock.

Okay yeah wow that woodstock 99 show is fantastic