Just going to go ahead and vote for Idiot Wind.
― What About The Half That's Never Been POLLed (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 18 April 2013 02:06 (ten years ago) link
Here he comes, the Man Who Didn't Like Blood On The Tracks
― charlie 4chan, internet detective (Hurting 2), Thursday, 18 April 2013 02:09 (ten years ago) link
and I don't love it. there are some good songs on it. I really dislike Idiot Wind -- it seems hateful and pointless to me. Meet Me In The Morning is my favorite track, and it's the least classically Dylan of the bunch.
― charlie 4chan, internet detective (Hurting 2), Thursday, 18 April 2013 02:10 (ten years ago) link
love the snap of guitar strings on this one
― the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 18 April 2013 02:11 (ten years ago) link
Voted "Shelter From the Storm," if only to keep it from being shut out.
Greatest album ever made about being in your 30s. And there's a lot of competition in that niche.
― something of an astrological coup (tipsy mothra), Thursday, 18 April 2013 02:12 (ten years ago) link
(Now that I'm in my 40s, I prefer albums he made both older and younger. But this is still classic start to end.)
― something of an astrological coup (tipsy mothra), Thursday, 18 April 2013 02:13 (ten years ago) link
I think one of the things that really puts me off is the constant clash of the busy basslines with Dylan's busy singing
― charlie 4chan, internet detective (Hurting 2), Thursday, 18 April 2013 02:14 (ten years ago) link
there's way too much going on for me in almost every track, and everything sounds so fucking tightly wound. It's a record I can't really relax and enjoy even when I appreciate it.
― charlie 4chan, internet detective (Hurting 2), Thursday, 18 April 2013 02:15 (ten years ago) link
all of it is great except idiot wind which for some reason annoys the SHIT out of me
voting for If You See Her Say Hello bcz it's beautiful but Simple Twist of Fate soooo close, and Lonesome, and Tangled and ughhh i love this album
― set the controls for the heart of the sun (VegemiteGrrl), Thursday, 18 April 2013 02:52 (ten years ago) link
'idiot wind' is so uncomfortable to hear -- it feels like you're eavesdropping on someone's worst fight with his spouse. can't really think of another moment when dylan let it all hang out like that. it's like the horrible flip-side of all those great dylan hate-songs where he's taunting someone and he's obviously the winner, the cool guy, the one who's gonna walk away unscathed -- here he's just ranting, spiteful, and defeated.
i'm slightly burned out on 'tangled,' but any of the others is liable to get stuck in my head on any given day. and the whole thing just sounds so lush, so beautiful in a way i don't typically associate with dylan. if i had to pick one, probably 'buckets of rain.'
― (The Other) J.D. (J.D.), Thursday, 18 April 2013 03:06 (ten years ago) link
'i can't even touch the books you've read' -- for some reason this line always hits me in the gut.
― (The Other) J.D. (J.D.), Thursday, 18 April 2013 03:09 (ten years ago) link
Tbh. Idiot wind feels like you are eavesdropping on some abusive asshole. I would probably take that with more of a grain of salt if he didn't have so many songs that seem to relish putting down a lover or ex lover.
― charlie 4chan, internet detective (Hurting 2), Thursday, 18 April 2013 03:26 (ten years ago) link
B-b-but doesn't he turn it all on its head by the end like in one of those Randy Newman songs?
― What About The Half That's Never Been POLLed (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 18 April 2013 03:30 (ten years ago) link
do u see?
― What About The Half That's Never Been POLLed (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 18 April 2013 03:32 (ten years ago) link
Re. "Idiot Wind," I get all the objections, but the way he sings
I can't help it if I'm lucky
just knocks me out every single time--absolutely love it....
― Swag Heathen (theStalePrince), Thursday, 18 April 2013 03:34 (ten years ago) link
Yes, that is the best part
― What About The Half That's Never Been POLLed (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 18 April 2013 03:39 (ten years ago) link
'Idiot Wind' easily.
No hesitation.
― Austin, Thursday, 18 April 2013 03:43 (ten years ago) link
tangled up in blue is one of the only examples of a song that i would call "cinematic" or "widescreen," the line breaks are like edits, it really feels like a montage in a movie
― zero dark (s1ocki), Thursday, 18 April 2013 04:19 (ten years ago) link
I mostly prefer the NY Sessions presented on the bootleg called "Blood on the Tapes" for all these tracks (and its better sequencing). "Idiot Wind" and "Meet Me in the Morning" are exquisite on either version, and i'll have to refer back to both sets of those recordings to make a choice.
― bodacious ignoramus, Thursday, 18 April 2013 04:26 (ten years ago) link
Yes, I must admit that my love of 'Idiot Wind' stems from the initial demo from 1974.
― Austin, Thursday, 18 April 2013 04:28 (ten years ago) link
NY Sessions is better than the released album. Voting "If You See Her Say Hello", but "Lily, Rosemary And The Jack Of Hearts" is the only one I don't adore.
― EZ Snappin, Thursday, 18 April 2013 04:31 (ten years ago) link
the imagery in tangled is so crazily potent. hard not to vote for it. 'some are mathematicians, some are carpenter's wives' is the line that runs through my head all the time for some reason
the band on this is really good
― turds (Hungry4Ass), Thursday, 18 April 2013 04:33 (ten years ago) link
either tangled or say hello or lonesome or ugh. "i can't help it if i'm lucky" def a vocal highlight but my favorite such thing on the album is either "and i've never! gotten! UUUUUUSED to it! i've just LARNED to turn it OFF" or
i'm going OUTOFMYMINDWHOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWITHAPAINTHATSTOPSANDSTARTSLIKE A CORKSCREW TO THE HEART
― the white queen and her caustic judgments (difficult listening hour), Thursday, 18 April 2013 04:44 (ten years ago) link
Don't quite get the dislike of "Idiot Wind." I mean the title refrain and its environs are pretty nasty but there are also other elements that point away from this, all kinds of classic Dylan wordplay that isn't part of the put-down as well as the self-recrimination at the end. It's not nearly as relentless in its attack as, say, "Positively 4th Street."
― What About The Half That's Never Been POLLed (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 18 April 2013 04:52 (ten years ago) link
"Idiot Wind" is my favorite. Agreed that it has more going on to it than "Positively 4th Street" - it's a Dylan put-down track, sure, but the kind of put-down of a drunken sad sack who knows the whole time that he's the real asshole in this situation, he shows you the blusteryness rather than just let you relish the bluster. Yeah maybe it's a bit DO YOU SEE but it works, for me.
Voting "Jack of Hearts" since no one else will and I have to somehow atone for unwittingly creating a redundant retread of possibly the most unlikely and narrowly-defined ILM poll ever.
― Doctor Casino, Thursday, 18 April 2013 04:54 (ten years ago) link
love idiot wind. didnt even really feel the song until i gave it another listen a few years ago and suddenly i was like, damn u crazy for this one bob. and plus yeah, we're idiots babe
― turds (Hungry4Ass), Thursday, 18 April 2013 04:57 (ten years ago) link
wait a second... what the fuck... what the fuck. he says "split up on a dark sad night"? i thought it was THE DOCKS THAT NIGHT, holy shit
― turds (Hungry4Ass), Thursday, 18 April 2013 05:38 (ten years ago) link
37
― Bee OK, Thursday, 18 April 2013 05:42 (ten years ago) link
I really like the Rolling Thunder Revue version of Shelter From The Storm with the yelling and slide guitar etc., and the full-band, more country arrangement from the 90s that I think was posted here. I didn't like the album much, but that has to do with what a contrarian Dylan fan I am.
― kaleb h. (Everything You Like Sucks), Thursday, 18 April 2013 06:05 (ten years ago) link
xxp whoa so did i
― the white queen and her caustic judgments (difficult listening hour), Thursday, 18 April 2013 06:07 (ten years ago) link
always picture her turning around to look at him as he walks away down the dock
Got to be Tangled for me. Back in my teens Tangled felt impossibly full of the mysteries of life. Like, why is this woman in a topless place bending down to tie the laces of his shoe?? And what's up with guy who started into dealing in slaves?
― that's not my post, Thursday, 18 April 2013 06:08 (ten years ago) link
Probably one of my favourite Dylan albums.
Shelter from the Storm
― c21m50nh3x460n, Thursday, 18 April 2013 06:09 (ten years ago) link
xxxp I always heard it as "docks that night." With all the fishing boats etc later in the song, docks is way better than non-specific "dark sad night". You're killing me.
― that's not my post, Thursday, 18 April 2013 06:14 (ten years ago) link
xxxxp It has always been docks that night. Mind blown.
― Badmotorfinger Debate Club (MFB), Thursday, 18 April 2013 06:25 (ten years ago) link
is there an easy way to get ahold of the original version?
― (The Other) J.D. (J.D.), Thursday, 18 April 2013 06:53 (ten years ago) link
A toughie. Went with Shelter from the Storm, but it's pretty much tied with Simple Twist of Fate. Buckets of Rain and Meet Me in the Morning are second.
― Eggs and the marketing board behind them, Thursday, 18 April 2013 07:03 (ten years ago) link
Close call with Idiot Wind, but I voted for the big girl. "Like a corkscrew to my heart..."
― Dr X O'Skeleton, Thursday, 18 April 2013 09:44 (ten years ago) link
Meet Me in the Morning.
― Eyeball Kicks, Thursday, 18 April 2013 11:28 (ten years ago) link
Pete Hamill's original liner notes, removed at some point:
http://www.bobsboots.com/CDs/cd-b28_Hamilltext.html
Haven't read them--supposedly wildly pretentious.
― clemenza, Thursday, 18 April 2013 12:05 (ten years ago) link
"Neighborhood Bully" and "Is Your Love in Vain," to name two, are far more hateful and unpleasant and hysterical than "Idiot Wind."
― the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 18 April 2013 12:15 (ten years ago) link
also ballad in plain d
― the white queen and her caustic judgments (difficult listening hour), Thursday, 18 April 2013 13:01 (ten years ago) link
Shelter from the Storm is nearly as ascerbic as Idiot Wind, but I'm going for You're Gonna Make Me Lonesome as the bitterest and most lyrically deft: dragon clouds so high above / I've only known careless love is imprinted on my adolescent soul.
― POSTOBON Naranja (soda), Thursday, 18 April 2013 13:23 (ten years ago) link
wow great thread - and pretty much everybody OTM (except Mr. I don't like BOTT).Apart from Lonesome, Rosemary or Meet me in the Morning - I could vote for any of these songs.
For the longest time my favorite was Say Hello - which, if you're lovelorn like I was when I was obsessed with this album, perfectly captures that specific type of narcistic melancholy: back-patting your heartbroken self with bogus lines like "whatever makes her happy, I won't stand in the way"
― licorice oratorio (baaderonixx), Thursday, 18 April 2013 13:41 (ten years ago) link
This album is such a big long slog Jesus. Voted Simple Twist of Fate cos it's got a nice chord sequence but fuck was Dylan getting good at out-staying his welcome at this time in his career. Same as Desire (albeit my favourite of his that I've heard) - 9 or 10 good songs that go on about 6x too long.
― pssstttt, Hey you (dog latin), Thursday, 18 April 2013 13:54 (ten years ago) link
you go on about 6x too long
― zero dark (s1ocki), Thursday, 18 April 2013 13:59 (ten years ago) link
How is Desire a better album despite being 6 time too long
― the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 18 April 2013 14:00 (ten years ago) link
they both suffer from songs that go on too long is what i'm saying. i don't dislike any of these songs, but fuck listening to the whole of Hurricane again.
I think I get the same vibe from this album as Neil Young's On The Beach, which also has that long-song rainy day feeling but doesn't seem as boring.
― pssstttt, Hey you (dog latin), Thursday, 18 April 2013 14:02 (ten years ago) link
you're boring and go on too long
― beef richards (Mr. Que), Thursday, 18 April 2013 14:04 (ten years ago) link
i get the same vibe from you as i do from a lamppost
― beef richards (Mr. Que), Thursday, 18 April 2013 14:05 (ten years ago) link
also this has never been one of my favorite dylan albums (i bought it in high school and aggressively didn't get it) but... i get it very much now. maybe i had to get past 30
― american bradass (BradNelson), Sunday, 7 July 2019 17:42 (four years ago) link
"up to me" is too good of a lyric to have been left off this album but whatever bob
― american bradass (BradNelson), Sunday, 7 July 2019 17:43 (four years ago) link
blood on the tracks is my ride-or-die dylan
― Squeaky Fromage (VegemiteGrrl), Sunday, 7 July 2019 17:52 (four years ago) link
All things considered, “Idiot Wind” may be my favorite Dylan lyric.
― stan by me (morrisp), Sunday, 7 July 2019 18:10 (four years ago) link
yeah, i have a hard time picking a favorite but it's just stunning. as many times as I've heard it the "one day you'll be in the ditch..." verse never fails to stop me in my tracks.
― JoeStork, Sunday, 7 July 2019 18:24 (four years ago) link
I've always liked this album but not as much as many people do (never considered it one of his best, for instance).However, listening to the "more blood" single album version, I love it now since I consider the NY sessions are much better than the final original version (with the notable exceptions of "STOF" and "YABGN" which are stellar on the album). For instance "TUIB" (take 3 remake 3) in so much better than on the album.And yeah, it was crazy to leave out "Up to Me" !
― AlXTC from Paris, Monday, 8 July 2019 08:26 (four years ago) link
I think Up to Me / Shelter From the Storm are too similar, he probably had to pick just one(?)
― stan by me (morrisp), Monday, 8 July 2019 14:37 (four years ago) link
Yeah the music is pretty much the same and while the lyrics on "Up to Me" are great, I feel he already expressed that particular sentiment elsewhere on the album, while "Shelter" offers a nice - hopeful - counterpoint.
― licorice oratorio (baaderonixx), Monday, 8 July 2019 14:59 (four years ago) link
"shelter from the storm" is hopeful? i guess it's a good enough lyric you can get multiple things from it
― american bradass (BradNelson), Monday, 8 July 2019 15:03 (four years ago) link
I don't know but I prefer "Up to Me" and it's such a great track.Another example of how the NY sessions are mostly superior to the final album imo is how fantastic "Lily, Rosemary..." (take 2) is compared to the awful album version.It was revelatory to me. This "acoustic" take reminds of "Desolation Row" : a long, piece with complex stories and images. It's now one of my favorite Blood tracks whereas I never liked the original version.
― AlXTC from Paris, Monday, 8 July 2019 15:05 (four years ago) link
i def prefer the minneapolis "if you see her"
― american bradass (BradNelson), Monday, 8 July 2019 15:05 (four years ago) link
Aw I find his delivery more touching and emotional on take1. Same for « Idiot Wind » for instance.
― AlXTC from Paris, Monday, 8 July 2019 16:51 (four years ago) link
Similar to the "Up to Me"/"Shelter..." tip -- I find "Call Letter Blues" to be much more direct/affecting than "Meet Me in the Morning," but he could clearly only include one of those songs -- and maybe "Call Letter Blues" felt too "on-the-nose" or something? (I feel like someone made a similar comment on another thread, but it occurred to me now as I revisit some of these tracks.)
― stan by me (morrisp), Monday, 8 July 2019 20:59 (four years ago) link
Another example of how the NY sessions are mostly superior to the final album imo is how fantastic "Lily, Rosemary..." (take 2) is compared to the awful album version.It was revelatory to me. This "acoustic" take reminds of "Desolation Row" : a long, piece with complex stories and images.
I can relate to this, but I've always appreciated the weird, dense nature of the album version (and still do). It may be Dylan's most "difficult"/challenging album track?
― stan by me (morrisp), Monday, 8 July 2019 21:09 (four years ago) link
"If You See Her" is the dog of the album, IMO -- at least lyrically. I've always disliked this verse:
We had a falling-out, like lovers often willAnd to think of how she left that night, it still brings me a chillAnd though our separation, it pierced me to the heartShe still lives inside of me, we've never been apart
― stan by me (morrisp), Monday, 8 July 2019 21:11 (four years ago) link
Yeah these are not his greatest lyrics... but to me the worst is :
Time is a jet plane, it moves too fast
It's horrible imo... and it's from one of my favourite songs of his !The musical intro alone kills me everytime.
― AlXTC from Paris, Tuesday, 9 July 2019 08:31 (four years ago) link
Agreed with AlexTC that the "Lily, Rosemary" is a revelation in its bare-bone version (although it still lacks musicality to make it a favorite)."If You See Her" has always been one of my very faves, although - yes, seeing those lyrics printed is a bit embarrassing. For a 20 year old, however, they seemed very direct and powerful . These days, as a 40 something, "Tangled up in Blue" is probably my favorite lyrics of his entire career.
― licorice oratorio (baaderonixx), Tuesday, 9 July 2019 08:40 (four years ago) link
About "Lily, Rosemary" I like this story :
Dylan called up folk singer, Joan Baez, about this track. Baez told The Huffington Post: "He read me the entire lyrics to 'Lily, Rosemary and the Jack of Hearts' that he'd just finished from a phone booth in the Midwest." The phone call prompted Baez to write "Diamonds & Rust," which is about the relationship she had with Dylan in the '60s. Baez said she later lied to Dylan that "Diamonds and Rust" was about her husband, David Harris.
lol how "Diamonds and Rust" can ONLY be about Dylan !
― AlXTC from Paris, Tuesday, 9 July 2019 08:47 (four years ago) link
Yeah atm "Tangled up in Blue" (but the More Blood version) is my favourite Dylan song.
― AlXTC from Paris, Tuesday, 9 July 2019 08:48 (four years ago) link
what do y'all think about the new york versions of "tangled up in blue" starting off in third person? it's v interesting to me that he shifted it all to first person for the minneapolis recording
― american bradass (BradNelson), Tuesday, 9 July 2019 18:01 (four years ago) link
It’s ok but musically I prefer the bright rolling sound of the final version. Lyrically the switch between first and third person works too (hints of Lynch-ian time/person blurring) but the more straightforward final lyric still gets the essence of the story. I’m sure there are tons of academic papers on all this.
― licorice oratorio (baaderonixx), Tuesday, 9 July 2019 18:12 (four years ago) link
i agree!
― american bradass (BradNelson), Tuesday, 9 July 2019 18:14 (four years ago) link
With the possible exception of Tangled, I find the NY versions so much better: more raw, more conflicted between anger and sadness, or at least some of that anger is self-directed. A lot of that emotion seems drained on the MN versions, which are still good, just more one-dimensional, or the performance aspect veils the emotional core of the songs. Idiot Wind especially pales in MN.
― Mazzy Tsar (PBKR), Tuesday, 9 July 2019 18:14 (four years ago) link
Nah the NY version of TUIB is great (and better imo) !
― AlXTC from Paris, Tuesday, 9 July 2019 18:16 (four years ago) link
I think the pov switch is kinda awkward; but having lived with the album version for so long before hearing the alt. version for the first time (on the first Bootleg Series set), it's hard to say how I'd feel if it were the other way around.
― stan by me (morrisp), Tuesday, 9 July 2019 18:16 (four years ago) link
the way he delivers "and i'm just like that bird" on the ny sessions version of "you're a big girl now"... god, it's so bottomlessly sad. this gets lost in the minneapolis version (which has a gorgeous arrangement, so i like that we have both now)
― american bradass (BradNelson), Tuesday, 9 July 2019 18:17 (four years ago) link
Tangled is the one song that perhaps benefits from the bright MN sound, fitting for what is in essence a travelogue of a relationship. I sometimes prefer the ambiguity of the NY version, which fits into the long tradition of Dylan third-person shifting narratives.
― Mazzy Tsar (PBKR), Tuesday, 9 July 2019 18:48 (four years ago) link
i think this will always be my favorite dylan album
it just gets better as i get older and life starts sucking in new ways that blood on the tracks addresses
― i will never make a typo ever again (Karl Malone), Tuesday, 9 July 2019 18:53 (four years ago) link
the way he delivers "and i'm just like that bird" on the ny sessions version of "you're a big girl now"... god, it's so bottomlessly sad.
^^^^The way he moans just after that line it’s like his heart is going to burst. One of my favorite moments in his entire career.
― Mazzy Tsar (PBKR), Tuesday, 9 July 2019 18:54 (four years ago) link
going to buy MBMT rn, don't know why i' waited so long
― budo jeru, Tuesday, 9 July 2019 19:08 (four years ago) link
i've always found both "lily" and "idiot wind" to be such unbearable slogs and rather unfortunate tarnishes on a record that was otherwise deeply beautiful. the stripped-down versions are indeed a revelation; i'm hearing them as if for the first time and it's a punch in the gut for sure, these songs now feel like shimmering expanses rather than clumsy elephantine obstructions.
― budo jeru, Tuesday, 9 July 2019 19:16 (four years ago) link
found a decent vinyl rip of the test pressing that they released for record store day this year. mostly sought it out bc, iirc, tylerw said the official ny sessions takes on the box set are remixed (which is fine, they sound lovely) and i wanted to hear the burble of the organ in "idiot wind" as it was originally intended i guess, lol. and... yeah, now i'm really in love with this version of the record, but it's so fuckin weird to me that dylan nearly released a drumless album after planet waves
― american bradass (BradNelson), Thursday, 11 July 2019 13:07 (four years ago) link
(drumless aside from "meet me in the morning," the only song with a full band arrangement, which is ALSO very weird to me)
― american bradass (BradNelson), Thursday, 11 July 2019 13:08 (four years ago) link
I've been meekand hard as an oak
― TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 11 July 2019 13:12 (four years ago) link
i've seen pretty people disappear like smokefriends will arrivefriends will disappear
if you want me, honey baby i'll be here
― american bradass (BradNelson), Thursday, 11 July 2019 13:26 (four years ago) link
Big Jim was no one’s fool, he owned the town’s only diamond mine
― stan by me (morrisp), Thursday, 11 July 2019 14:11 (four years ago) link
Always imagine that refers to Jim Thompson’s dad.
― Vini C. Riley (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 11 July 2019 20:06 (four years ago) link
Idiot Wind is so good. I love that contrast of cosmic storytelling in the verses ("shot a man called Gray", "ran into the fortune teller") with the scathing frankness of the chorus. the attempt to weave a story that actually goes anywhere is reined in each time by Dylan's helpless anger. he acknowledges it himself when he concedes "the wheels have stopped".
there's also (of course) a gradual sense as the song goes on of Dylan being complicit in feeding the mindless emotional turmoil. I like it how it ends on "we're idiots, babe..." rather than "I'm an idiot, babe...". Seems more organic that he's only willing to go in for a half-compromise after so artfully -- and artlessly -- making others the subject of his vitriol.
― charlie rex, Thursday, 6 October 2022 03:18 (one year ago) link
there really aren't many albums better than this one.
― charlie rex, Thursday, 6 October 2022 03:19 (one year ago) link
^^^
― Bee OK, Thursday, 6 October 2022 04:40 (one year ago) link