oh its probably a little from column and a little from column b
― Shakey Mo Collier, Friday, 18 July 2008 17:11 (fifteen years ago) link
column A bah
40 grand for all of eclipse's creative rights sounds like a total fucking steal; I'm astonished that idiot hasn't done something profitable with it.
― forksclovetofu, Friday, 18 July 2008 17:25 (fifteen years ago) link
He caught Dean Mullaney's nuts in a vise at just the right moment. Eclipse lost their back issue stock in a flood in '93, Mullaney and Cat Yronwode divorced about the same time, and then there was the direct market collapse/speculator bubble-pop that shrank the whole industry.
― Rock Hardy, Friday, 18 July 2008 17:35 (fifteen years ago) link
not exactly - I was pointing out that blueski's criteria for enjoying this film makes no sense
representation of and tribute to != emulating or matching particularly
― blueski, Friday, 18 July 2008 17:48 (fifteen years ago) link
"40 grand for all of eclipse's creative rights sounds like a total fucking steal; I'm astonished that idiot hasn't done something profitable with it."
Not getting Miracleman sort of deflates it though.
― Alex in SF, Friday, 18 July 2008 17:57 (fifteen years ago) link
T Ewing sez
― blueski, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:01 (fifteen years ago) link
I don't think its unfilmability has anything to do with "complexity" or flashbacks (?!) but with the way different narratives are laid on top of each other and interlaced - the juxtaposition of recurring images, dialogue, narrative text boxes that refer to different things on the page at the same time, etc. The comic revels in simultaneous and symmetrical narrative strains in a way that simply cannot be achieved with film (maybe it could be done with a lot of split-screening, which Snyder has apparently not bothered with...?) Moore deliberately exploited comics' unique potential as a medium.
I don't think the Lolita or Naked Lunch comparisons are particularly apt - Lolita is not particularly unfilmable in any way (it has a linear narrative and an unreliable narrator, both of which cinema is well equipped to handle). Naked Lunch is, strictly speaking, nothing like the book, and succeeds because it was made by a master director with the input of the author and largely just uses the text as an inspiration for imagery juxtaposed over the author's own autobiography. The thing is, both of those novels were considered unfilmable due to their sexual content and not because of any structural complexities - neither of them is a book about books (a la Nabokov's "Pale Fire" or Calvino's "If On A Winter's Night a Traveller" is) in the way that Watchmen is a comic book about comics.
― Shakey Mo Collier, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:13 (fifteen years ago) link
I mean someone could've made a movie of Lolita or Naked Lunch at any time - the problem is they would've been censored and/or banned.
― Shakey Mo Collier, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:14 (fifteen years ago) link
shakey can you just wait till you see the goddamned movie before you disprove it
― s1ocki, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:24 (fifteen years ago) link
lol, obviously no!
― HI DERE, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:26 (fifteen years ago) link
http://www.theonion.com/content/node/31478
― s1ocki, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:26 (fifteen years ago) link
Shakey read that link to Tom's piece and, you know, think a bit.
― Ned Raggett, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:39 (fifteen years ago) link
Nicely condescending, Ned.
― Alex in SF, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:44 (fifteen years ago) link
nicely condescending ned is one of the new supehero characters they've added
― s1ocki, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:45 (fifteen years ago) link
I think un-filmable in this case = unlikely to be very good or very interesting in cinematic form. I think Tom touches on one very good reason why this is the case (and it's the one Moore is likely to be the most concerned with) but it's far from the only reason and most of Shakey's points seem to me to be entirely valid ones.
― Alex in SF, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:47 (fifteen years ago) link
yes
we all agree that it probably wont be good and the reasons why
at this point we are not interested in hearing it shouted at us a billion more times
― s1ocki, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:48 (fifteen years ago) link
Well then stop arguing with him then.
― Alex in SF, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:50 (fifteen years ago) link
I read it. Rorschach is repulsive, I don't buy his "but he made them even more badass!" tack.
If you lose the Black Freighter sequence you’ve got a relatively straightforward story, albeit one with a somewhat eyebrow-raising tonal shift at the end.
Except that this whole sequence is essentially the key to the entire story (as pointed out on some other Watchmen thread by someone else)
x-posts
― Shakey Mo Collier, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:50 (fifteen years ago) link
costume needs more nipples
― Shakey Mo Collier, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:52 (fifteen years ago) link
you can strip the black freighter layer off no problem. obv that weakens the original story but it's not as if the whole thing falls apart without it.
― blueski, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:53 (fifteen years ago) link
let us list the ways in which the film will be better than the book
1) shit moves
ya everyone pretty much admitted they didnt "get" it anyway xp
― s1ocki, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:54 (fifteen years ago) link
I should follow your kind and thoughtful example in all things.
― Ned Raggett, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:55 (fifteen years ago) link
Hey if it works for you, go for it.
― Alex in SF, Friday, 18 July 2008 18:57 (fifteen years ago) link
"ya everyone pretty much admitted they didnt "get" it anyway xp"
Everyone = who?
― Alex in SF, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:00 (fifteen years ago) link
Eclipse licenses that could easily be made profitable again with a bit of effort:
* Adolescent Radioactive Black Belt Hamsters (give it to kyle baker or phil foglio or ty templeton or... * Airboy by Chuck Dixon (I'd buy new issues) * Area 88 (I want manga books for this goddamit!) * Axel Pressbutton by Pedro Henry, Steve Dillon, and Brian Bolland (easy film conversion) * Aztec Ace (ditto) * Brought to Light (due for a reprint) * California Girls (1987) by Trina Robbins (easy cartoon for WB) * Cynicalman by Matt Feazell (xkcd owes royalties) * Detectives, Inc.by Don McGregor and Gene Colan (easy movie) * Killer ... Tales by Timothy Truman * Mai the Psychic Girl (easy reprint cash) * Miracleman by Alan Moore, Neil Gaiman, and others. * Ms. Tree by Max Allan Collins and Terry Beatty (movie) * Mr. Monster (all time favorite) * The Prowler (great book, due for a revival) * Reid Fleming, World's Toughest Milkman (nuff said) * The Rocketeer (due for a sequel) * Scout by Timothy Truman (has movie written all over it) * Tales of the Beanworld by Larry Marder (is this out in reprint?) * Winterworld (another easy film) * Zot! by Scott McCloud (another one that I'd buy in two or three reprint books)
― forksclovetofu, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:00 (fifteen years ago) link
thanks for interrupting what would have been a great your mama joke forks.
― s1ocki, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:00 (fifteen years ago) link
It's what I do.
― forksclovetofu, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:03 (fifteen years ago) link
know what i do?
― s1ocki, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:03 (fifteen years ago) link
* Cynicalman by Matt Feazell (xkcd owes royalties)
― Alex in SF, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:07 (fifteen years ago) link
wow Eclipse really had some great stuff, I had forgotten - would love to see another collected volume of Zot!
― Shakey Mo Collier, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:07 (fifteen years ago) link
I thought Zot! was collected?
― Alex in SF, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:08 (fifteen years ago) link
hey I'm just trying to save you guys from wasting yr hard-earned kopecks on this movie. You'll thank me later
― Shakey Mo Collier, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:09 (fifteen years ago) link
I have a collection of the first 6 issues, never seen any subsequent volumes. I admit I haven't looked in a long time.
(er x-post)
i'll probly get in free
― s1ocki, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:10 (fifteen years ago) link
Yeah it's all available now (even vol 4 has finally come out.)
― Alex in SF, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:10 (fifteen years ago) link
hey there they are on Amazon! never mind
― Shakey Mo Collier, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:11 (fifteen years ago) link
* Reid Fleming, World's Toughest Milkman (nuff said)
they could totally make a funny movie out of this (pitch "Bad Santa as a milkman!") and I'm pretty sure its been optioned multiple times but just never happened.
― Shakey Mo Collier, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:13 (fifteen years ago) link
Is he any relation to Ernie the fastest milkman in the West?
― chap, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:15 (fifteen years ago) link
I'm halfway positive Eclipse did not own the license to a lot of these characters when McFarlane bought them.
― Alex in SF, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:15 (fifteen years ago) link
Reid Fleming looks exactly like Harvey Pekar. Just putting that out there.
― Oilyrags, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:16 (fifteen years ago) link
Wonder exactly what McFarlane bought.
― forksclovetofu, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:17 (fifteen years ago) link
The spirit of Reid Fleming is alive and well and all over Adult Swim. (I'd rather see a short Milk & Cheese cartoon.)
― Rock Hardy, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:23 (fifteen years ago) link
Harper Collins just published the Zot! collection so I'm guessing McCloud owns the rights to that (since that's who also published Understanding/Reinventing/Poking a Stick @ Comix.)
― Alex in SF, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:24 (fifteen years ago) link
FACT: I have never actually read the black freighter stuff in Watchmen.
― HI DERE, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:29 (fifteen years ago) link
your loss
― Shakey Mo Collier, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:31 (fifteen years ago) link
btw rosebud was his sled
I do wake up at nights sobbing because of this.
― HI DERE, Friday, 18 July 2008 19:33 (fifteen years ago) link