mets sux
― ice cr?m, Monday, 9 February 2009 18:20 (fifteen years ago) link
call me blinky...
― (*゚ー゚)θ L(。・_・) °~ヾ(・ε・ *) (Steve Shasta), Monday, 9 February 2009 18:46 (fifteen years ago) link
arod supposedly being interviewed by gammons later today
― johnny crunch, Monday, 9 February 2009 18:53 (fifteen years ago) link
yah i'm with morbz on the 'doesn't really make u better' idea. like someone said above 'roids are designed to shorten recovery times and yeah build muscle mass but until i see some real evidence that shows an appreciable change in the ability to PLAY BETTER, i'm not going to care that much. (not that no one should care--for example i think it sets a shitty example for kids, considering how terrible roids are for yr body and the fact that most kids who take roids in HS arent going to amount to anything in pro ball.)
it's like, a pitcher putting vaseline on the ball will be able to manipulate the ball better and thus have a real, tangible, DIRECT advantage on a micro level; a batter (or pitcher obvs) taking roids might have more muscle and might be in better shape than he would have, but it's an indirect advantage and doesnt necessarily make him better at baseball. does any of that make sense?
― jammed hymen (k3vin k.), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:11 (fifteen years ago) link
That makes perfect sense.
― nosotros niggamos (HI DERE), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:18 (fifteen years ago) link
i think that's a bit naive. i think PEDs make better players better... but it can't turn a nobody into a superstar... except for ken caminiti.
― (*゚ー゚)θ L(。・_・) °~ヾ(・ε・ *) (Steve Shasta), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:19 (fifteen years ago) link
guys strength is super important to hitting fyi
― ice cr?m, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:19 (fifteen years ago) link
But it's not of primary importance, which is why Gabe Kapler never hit 20 HR.
btw, Gene Orza denies tipoff angle.
“It’s not true,” Orza said in an e-mail message. “Simple as that.”
“It makes juicier stuff to suggest there were tip-offs,” Orza said about the SI.com report. “But there weren’t.”
He added: “I don’t care about the press coverage. It’s irrelevant.”
I was amused to see former NY Times hack Selena Roberts was apparently the lead SI reporter on this when Costas interviewed her on MLB. Wow, her AND Jon Heyman, SI really scoops up the best and brightest these days.
― Dr Morbius, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:22 (fifteen years ago) link
but it could be just a coincidence that bonds had the best seasons ever at an age when players are typically over the hill that mcguire et al were roided to the gills when they were breaking records etc etc
if yr good at baseball and want to hit the ball harder steroids can help
― ice cr?m, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:23 (fifteen years ago) link
well what's he gonna say? "yeah i completely tipped those guys off." xp
― John Hyman (misspelled intentionally) (omar little), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:24 (fifteen years ago) link
ice cr?m... you're buying into a lot of mythology dude.
― (*゚ー゚)θ L(。・_・) °~ヾ(・ε・ *) (Steve Shasta), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:24 (fifteen years ago) link
o plz enlighten me
― ice cr?m, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:25 (fifteen years ago) link
If you can't hit the ball, bulking up after taking steroids will not help you.
If you can hit the ball, bulking up after taking steroids may or may not help you.
― nosotros niggamos (HI DERE), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:26 (fifteen years ago) link
i-rod's career to thread
― velko, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:27 (fifteen years ago) link
yah i'm with morbz on the 'doesn't really make u better' idea. like someone said above 'roids are designed to shorten recovery times and yeah build muscle mass but until i see some real evidence that shows an appreciable change in the ability to PLAY BETTER, i'm not going to care that much.
beyond statistics, is there any way to actually prove if it makes a player better or not? i mean tbh looking at the stats on bonds or sosa or mcgwire and then assuming that they started using steroids around a certain time, it makes perfect sense for people to believe that their subsequent "best of all time" kinda seasons were assisted just a little bit. i mean sammy sosa was, despite his HR power, a pretty mediocre player up until 1998.
like i said i can't get too pissed off about this stuff but there is some proof there, in a certain way. i'm not going to do anything other than ¯\(°_o)/¯ at this point though.
― John Hyman (misspelled intentionally) (omar little), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:29 (fifteen years ago) link
― nosotros niggamos (HI DERE), Monday, February 9, 2009 2:26 PM (33 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
im not sure why people always bring up the 1st part of this formulation as its completely moot cause were talking abt guys getting an edge over other players who CAN hit the baseball
― ice cr?m, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:29 (fifteen years ago) link
icey, we're not denying that numbers for certain players were very likely inflated, but it's a fog. There's no "control group" -- ie, no players can ever be proven "clean" -- so ppl who claim that Player X's use of Substance Y affected his output by Z-factor are just whistlin' Dixie.
― Dr Morbius, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:31 (fifteen years ago) link
i mean are people so far gone on this thing that they're now saying that strength only has an indirect relation to hitting? any one physical factor only has an indirect relation to hitting. no one is suggesting that big muscles create bat speed and hand/eye coordination but come the fuck on. how many weird spiky brady anderson in '96 seasons would you need to see to conclude that this has impacted games on the field?
― call all destroyer, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:33 (fifteen years ago) link
eckstein is clean!
but morbs is otm
(xpost)
― jammed hymen (k3vin k.), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:34 (fifteen years ago) link
so because it's a fog we're just going to say it is what it is? i understand that to a certain point but i would like to see that list of 104 because it will increase my understanding of exactly what has been happening to the game.
― call all destroyer, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:35 (fifteen years ago) link
this isnt a court of law or a peer reviewed journal - i just looked at the aging comically inflated bonds demolishing the record books and lold @ the farce - sometimes things are pretty easily seen and understood that dont offer the right circumstances for statistical or forensic or whatever analysis
― ice cr?m, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:37 (fifteen years ago) link
i don't hate on the roiders because i guess the draw of taking the shit is the massive contracts, and i can sorta understand, but i feel for the really excellent players who don't take shit and get outclassed stats wise
― John Hyman (misspelled intentionally) (omar little), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:37 (fifteen years ago) link
will it? Waht about the guys who've been dodgy enough to pass tests but have still been using "something."
― Dr Morbius, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:37 (fifteen years ago) link
http://www.femmefan.com/site/images/lookerspics/lookers2/Brady-Anderson.jpg
― mookieproof, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:38 (fifteen years ago) link
well yeah it would be ridic of anyone to assume that we will fully understand the so-called steroid era but i would prefer to see this stuff start coming out, that's all.
― call all destroyer, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:40 (fifteen years ago) link
btw I know that sports is 'the Toy Department' of life but the media vocab on this issue is so McCarthyite it's crazy.
― Dr Morbius, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:41 (fifteen years ago) link
icey:
the mythology is that power hitters/HRs = the steroid problem in baseball. 70%+ of the PED busts since the MLB began enforcing have been largely mediocre middle-relievers, speedy 4th-outfielder types... not exactly making the difference in the outcome of the game.
the other thing that the media perpetuates is that steroids = muscle/bulk. there are far more skinny, lanky PED abusers in MLB than bulky sluggers. steroids do not automatically inflate your biceps and neck. when used in conjunction with weight training, yes steroids help you gain muscle mass. but the media oversimplifies it so that bulky slugger = roids. while there's some correlation, it is not 1:1.
― (*゚ー゚)θ L(。・_・) °~ヾ(・ε・ *) (Steve Shasta), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:44 (fifteen years ago) link
yah well there are a lot of mediocre middle-relievers in the world and most peds are not anabolic steroids - but steriods do build muscle mass thats what theyre for mr myth buster
― ice cr?m, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:47 (fifteen years ago) link
a-rod admits in an interview w/ peter gammons tonight on ESPN. his reasoning is "when i got to texas i was young and naive and felt like i had the weight of the world of my shoulders and i wanted to prove everyone right"
― nascar jesus (J0rdan S.), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:47 (fifteen years ago) link
His voice shaking at times, Alex Rodriguez met head-on allegations that he tested positive for steroids six years ago, telling ESPN on Monday that he did take performance-enhancing drugs while playing for the Texas Rangers during a three-year period beginning in 2001.
"When I arrived in Texas in 2001, I felt an enormous amount of pressure. I needed to perform, and perform at a high level every day," Rodriguez told ESPN's Peter Gammons in an interview in Miami Beach, Fla. "Back then, [baseball] was a different culture. It was very loose. I was young, I was stupid, I was naïve. I wanted to prove to everyone I was worth being one of the greatest players of all time.
"I did take a banned substance. For that, I'm very sorry and deeply regretful."
― John Hyman (misspelled intentionally) (omar little), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:48 (fifteen years ago) link
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3894847
― John Hyman (misspelled intentionally) (omar little), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:49 (fifteen years ago) link
all is forgiven alexander...
― (*゚ー゚)θ L(。・_・) °~ヾ(・ε・ *) (Steve Shasta), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:50 (fifteen years ago) link
someone please ask madonna how this has affected a-rod's junk
― mookieproof, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:50 (fifteen years ago) link
but the media oversimplifies it so that bulky slugger = roids. while there's some correlation, it is not 1:1.
― (*゚ー゚)θ L(。・_・) °~ヾ(・ε・ *) (Steve Shasta), Monday, February 9, 2009 2:44 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
this may be true but yr and morbs et al confusion at why people are focusing on the most successful players is def on some aspie shit
― ice cr?m, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:51 (fifteen years ago) link
i'm just saying you bought into the mythology dawg. no need for a dude who posts 5000 msgs a day on her to start throwing out the "aspie" card... ;-)
― (*゚ー゚)θ L(。・_・) °~ヾ(・ε・ *) (Steve Shasta), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:53 (fifteen years ago) link
im just saying that yr definition of mythology is based on some psychological disorder is all
― ice cr?m, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:56 (fifteen years ago) link
so the Rangers' clubhouse at that time was Steroid Heaven. Anyone have anything to ask Mark Teixeira?
― Dr Morbius, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:59 (fifteen years ago) link
wow *jaw drops* at him admitting it, dont know what to say really
― jammed hymen (k3vin k.), Monday, 9 February 2009 19:59 (fifteen years ago) link
i mean i assumed he did it and all, it's just...i cant believe he's admitting it
― jammed hymen (k3vin k.), Monday, 9 February 2009 20:00 (fifteen years ago) link
what else can he do, stonewall after seeing what it got Sosa and McGwire?
yeah icey, we know WHY they're focusing on the biggest stars. It's a nation of morons, and sports fans are the biggest of them all.
― Dr Morbius, Monday, 9 February 2009 20:01 (fifteen years ago) link
yeah you're right
enlightening discussion on first & ten, as always
― jammed hymen (k3vin k.), Monday, 9 February 2009 20:03 (fifteen years ago) link
I was going to crack a joke about cjbaseball.com reactivating, but it looks like it has never not been active (including today).
http://www.cjbaseball.com/
― Andy K, Monday, 9 February 2009 20:05 (fifteen years ago) link
Canseco was right all along... that's the greatest part.
― (*゚ー゚)θ L(。・_・) °~ヾ(・ε・ *) (Steve Shasta), Monday, 9 February 2009 20:05 (fifteen years ago) link
Danny Bonaduce bout excepted
― Dr Morbius, Monday, 9 February 2009 20:06 (fifteen years ago) link
http://deadspin.com/5149914/alex-rodriguez-admits-to-using-a-banned-substance
Gammons/A-Rod video
― Andy K, Monday, 9 February 2009 20:10 (fifteen years ago) link
― Dr Morbius, Monday, February 9, 2009 3:01 PM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
or cause those players have more or less the biggest impact
― ice cr?m, Monday, 9 February 2009 20:10 (fifteen years ago) link
i love how a-rod (or his people) borrowed last week's Michael Phelp's apology almost word for word.
― (*゚ー゚)θ L(。・_・) °~ヾ(・ε・ *) (Steve Shasta), Monday, 9 February 2009 20:13 (fifteen years ago) link
i always figured a-rod would admit it, ever since i heard the story initially. the dude would never allow himself to get caught up in the games that clemens and bonds have w/r/t denials and evidence suggesting that the denials are lies.
― John Hyman (misspelled intentionally) (omar little), Monday, 9 February 2009 20:16 (fifteen years ago) link
I wonder how Madonna feels about this new A-Rod information.
― Your heartbeat soun like sasquatch feet (polyphonic), Monday, 9 February 2009 20:33 (fifteen years ago) link
I think it was an incredibly savvy move for A-Rod to admit it.
― Your heartbeat soun like sasquatch feet (polyphonic), Monday, 9 February 2009 20:34 (fifteen years ago) link