severine's memory echoes in the movie long after she dies, slightly longer than the echo of silva's vintage firearm iirc.
― christmas candy bar (al leong), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 20:56 (eleven years ago) link
well, this is the James Bond who stated "the job's done and the bitch is dead," although he thought her not so innocent at the time
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:29 (eleven years ago) link
guys, i cd be off here, but i think the point is he doesn't want to let Silva know he's got to him so he fronts it out? i guess the delivery cd've been better maybe but it's pretty obvious.
― tochter tochter, please (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, February 19, 2013 3:51 PM (35 minutes ago) Bookmark
yeah that occurred to me but it still doesnt play very well
plus why did bond wait until he killed her to make a move. the way it plays out makes it look like he could've saved her life if he felt like it
― turds (Hungry4Ass), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:30 (eleven years ago) link
I have not read any of the books in years but IIRC Craig's utter bastard streak is the closest evocation to the Bond Fleming originally created? (written as a question because it's literally been 25 years since I read a Bond book and I barely remember them)
― This beat is TWEENCHRONIC (DJP), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:32 (eleven years ago) link
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Tuesday, February 19, 2013 4:29 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark
that was a really important character moment, also not a joke
― turds (Hungry4Ass), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:32 (eleven years ago) link
I think you're splitting hairs and over-analyzing this dumb scene in a well-shot but marginally-scripted film
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:33 (eleven years ago) link
it was a really important character moment showing that Bond overreacts verbally when his underdeveloped emotional intelligence is snubbed!
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:34 (eleven years ago) link
if i'm over-analyzing, what are your 30+ posts about how the film is a deconstruction of bond
― turds (Hungry4Ass), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:41 (eleven years ago) link
spread out over the whole film versus grinding on those two minutes?
touche, though
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:42 (eleven years ago) link
I guess I'm not wondering why you care as much as why I care
the quest continues
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:43 (eleven years ago) link
"the bitch is dead" is almost verbatim from the novel as i recall, the book of Casino Royale probly paces Bond's burgeoning relationship with the Eva Green-type character and she actually is a SMERSH agent in the book iirc - fieldcraft lesson learned
― tochter tochter, please (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:45 (eleven years ago) link
"the bitch is dead" is verbatim from the book. think the main problem w/ scotch line is they play it halfway between lol one liner bond and ice cold sociopath bond, same w/ shower howdy which in tomorrow never knows or moonraker or something would've been fine/consistent (if still creepy if you thought about it at all)(and the women are cannon fodder in those flicks also, that's been true from day one on w/ bond) but w/ serious adult bond is ridiculous even if she hadn't had the tragic background.
― balls, Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:45 (eleven years ago) link
why did bond wait until he killed her to make a move
can only assume he's stalling for the cavalry to turn up but yeah the script is the worst thing about this, and that's including Sam Mendes existing and Albert Finney playing Albert Finney
haven't seen this since the original cinema screening btw but still reckon it's hugely entertaining old bollocks
― tochter tochter, please (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:47 (eleven years ago) link
I wish they had included the section from the book where Bond joins a vegan health spa and finds all his aggression floating away.
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:51 (eleven years ago) link
problem (one of) this movie was its desperate eagerness to please in every second at the expense of making sense minute to minute or act to act. "waste of scotch" line read like "hey! you guys like the old misogynist bond, right??", momentarily throwing out a character impulse not hinted at beforehand and quickly forgotten. if the coldness had any tradecraft layering w/r/t bond getting in with silva it wasn't anything mendes thought fit to show.
"the bitch is dead" looked to me like an attempt to interrogate the bond character's historical misogyny. oh, see, he lost somebody, it's realy sad. excuse-making, maybe, but an idea purposefully executed.
― goole, Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:52 (eleven years ago) link
every time I have read "the bitch is dead" on this thread, I've gotten Elton John's voice stuck in my head
― This beat is TWEENCHRONIC (DJP), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:53 (eleven years ago) link
Casino Royale movie actually super-emphasises that by having some foreshadowing at the beginning where Bond claims to only smash married women cos it's complication-free
― tochter tochter, please (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:55 (eleven years ago) link
that was Paul Haggis at work, I think
still amazed the first one did so well with one of his scripts
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:56 (eleven years ago) link
that line gets worse and worse to me as time goes on. i cant think of any previous iteration of the character, even at his coldest and most heartless, that would crack wise about an innocent woman being murdered by the bad guy - much less joke that her life was worth less than a glass of scotch. its like the transformation of mcclane from guy who's scared to die and even fears for the life of a scumbag like ellis, to smirking poochy bruce who goes 'heh, that had to hurt' as he maims dozens of innocent people in a carnage-packed moscow car chase
― turds (Hungry4Ass), Tuesday, February 19, 2013 3:34 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
qft
― zero dark (s1ocki), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:56 (eleven years ago) link
i hated that moment so much
― zero dark (s1ocki), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:57 (eleven years ago) link
man this movie had so much loathsome things that the odium Albert Finney's inspired on this thread is so misplaced.
― the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:58 (eleven years ago) link
just imagine if they'd actually put Sean Connery in that role
the humor would have returned to the franchise
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 21:59 (eleven years ago) link
well... it's kind of unavoidably loathsome though, right? otherwise it's not a bond movie. it's already pretty close to turning into bourne without those things.
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 19 February 2013 22:00 (eleven years ago) link
― the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, February 19, 2013 4:58 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
qft too
― zero dark (s1ocki), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 22:01 (eleven years ago) link
who cares
I take back everything I said trying to be devil's advocate for that line and scene, btw
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 22:01 (eleven years ago) link
Finney thinking Dench's character is "Emma" is still great
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 22:02 (eleven years ago) link
at least Connery wd've had one of those rare career highlights where he cd do the accent
― tochter tochter, please (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 22:05 (eleven years ago) link
and Bond is in large part a celebration of loathsomeness, i cd really give a fuck about that aspect of it, i just like joshing on Finney cos he didn't just phone it in he sent it overland on the back of a beermat from Irkutsk
― tochter tochter, please (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 22:06 (eleven years ago) link
kinda feel like finney himself originally thought so and they were just like, let's keep it in
― железобетонное очко (mookieproof), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 22:08 (eleven years ago) link
oh god, I hope so
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Tuesday, 19 February 2013 22:11 (eleven years ago) link
i like how he said "mum"
― caek, Tuesday, 19 February 2013 23:20 (eleven years ago) link
what did y'all think of pingu as Kid Q?
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 19 February 2013 23:56 (eleven years ago) link
hot as fuck
― the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 00:00 (eleven years ago) link
hotter than pingu as scentless apprentice in Perfume?
― Philip Nunez, Wednesday, 20 February 2013 00:04 (eleven years ago) link
disappointed no one threatened Q with electrical zapping
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 00:42 (eleven years ago) link
The q shit was so shit
― lance armstrong will have been delighted (darraghmac), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 00:52 (eleven years ago) link
i was kinda surprised by how much i disliked this
― well if it isn't old 11 cameras simon (gbx), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 01:17 (eleven years ago) link
I do think that fixating on the awfulness of the line with the scotch might be pulling ppl's attention away from how stupid and lazily held together the rest of this really was
― lance armstrong will have been delighted (darraghmac), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 01:21 (eleven years ago) link
i feel like bond's final ploy to draw silva out should have been met with blank stares and termination of his employment.
― christmas candy bar (al leong), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 01:31 (eleven years ago) link
He'd just have refused to be sacked, like m earlier on
― lance armstrong will have been delighted (darraghmac), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 01:36 (eleven years ago) link
Silva's an expert at modern technology, Bond faces him in a no-technology area, and M still manages to die
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 01:37 (eleven years ago) link
it's so crazy it just might work*
(*it didn't, at all)
― christmas candy bar (al leong), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 01:38 (eleven years ago) link
Yeah we all seem to be forgetting that this movie just sucked
― Raymond Cummings, Wednesday, 20 February 2013 01:38 (eleven years ago) link
what would have been awesome is if Bond called in a drone strike, provided as a favor by his CIA friend Felix Leiter, blowing up his family home and Silva, as he and M hide in the chapel
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 01:39 (eleven years ago) link
Or even better, Bond and M make Silva think they're in the chapel, drone blows it and Silva, and he remodels the family home as a shaggin' pad
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 01:40 (eleven years ago) link
then there's an implied Oedipal scene where we figure out if he's really saying "mum"
― ☠ ☃ ☠ (mh), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 01:41 (eleven years ago) link
TURN OFF YOUR FUCKING TORCH YOU OLD FOOL THE CHURCH HARDLY FUCKING SHIFTED SINCE YESTERDAY
― lance armstrong will have been delighted (darraghmac), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 01:41 (eleven years ago) link
he should have turned off his flashlight, too
― that Django got me Nuages (Sufjan Grafton), Wednesday, 20 February 2013 01:43 (eleven years ago) link
ha yes, excellent tradecraft there
― goole, Wednesday, 20 February 2013 02:58 (eleven years ago) link