Literary Clusterfucks 2013

So, I just read every post to catch up on the thread. Not that my thoughts are that relevant, but:

People don't necessarily have a consistent view or presentation of their own thoughts and self-image. It's not my call to label that mental illness, a divergent personality, or "lying" and someone can regret what she said or, in fact, actually present herself as bisexual or having a certain philosophical opinion or belief and later either change her mind or regret that public disclosure. Consistency is necessary in factual journalism, but we're in a whole different realm when it comes to social behavior.

Impeaching Valdes's character or implying she's a horrible person due to some lack of consistency of vision is gross. Yes, ideally she would refuse to promote her book, but ideally she wouldn't have spent all her money and be broke. It's possible she still likes the writing in the book if she hates the content. It's possible she knows she was abused and treated like garbage but still has some fond feelings she feels conflicted about. She might pick and choose, or view things in a rosy light when doing interviews. Maybe she feels the book is a blueprint for an abusive relationship, but some relationships come with a lot of self-blame -- I would not pretend to put words in her mouth, but I can attest that there is often a feeling on the part of the abused that they were still somehow to blame, even if they can articulate why that is not the case.

She's an effusive writer without a strong sense of consistent self. That doesn't make me think she's a fake or phony, it makes me think she's a strong advocate for everyone other than herself.

It also has to be severely fucked-up for this lady to be reading positive reviews and hearing people talk about enjoying the book, validating her viewpoint that she held during this abusive relationship. She has recognized, or started to recognize, the facts of it, but people are inadvertently validating her views of the time every time they praise her portrayal.

really nice job, max

xp That's what happened in the interview I listened to for a bit--the show host started to talk about her husband, a "man's man" who insisted on opening doors for her blah blah sexist-sticks, and Valdes kind of got railroaded into giggling pleasantly and agreeing with her and then telling a story supporting that perspective.

sorry guys i was at les mis. who changed who's mind with a flawless argument this time?

http://rr-bb.com/images/smilies/attack.png

I don't think that's the point exactly. More like pushing ideas around and discovering where general location of the center of gravity. With clusterfuck threads that ideal doesn't often emerge, which is kind of what makes them clusterfucks. If anyone's mind was changed here it would have to be in terms of a shifting of emphasis rather than a 180 degree turnaround.

the first 400 posts or so were readable I think

max an asset to the human race in reportage

sorry guys i was at les mis.

sb

fu i had to bring le ms

le?

aimless, i think it's well established by now that a medium-to-good portait typist could have look at the last five or six threads on broadly similar topics and come up with something close enough to this thread to circulate to possible witnesses- down to the when and what which posters would say. No centring of gravity, not even any oxygen stirred in or an issue mildly thrashed, just identikit hostilities.

Fuckin raggett.

xp i figured la didn't sound enough alike for the pun and that masculinising her was better than insinuating a third party

I am amazed by the passive-aggressive barbs subtly strewn that invite sarcastic rejoinders and then hostilities. Reminds me of an abusive ex, tbh

respect to your ms, darragh

someone already made that joke upthread fwiw prob like five times

i cant unpick if thats all for me or whether its for thread in general mh

xp i figured la didn't sound enough alike for the pun and that masculinising her was better than insinuating a third party

― let's bitch about our stupid, annoying co-ilxors (darraghmac), Saturday, 12 January 2013 03:09 (4 minutes ago)

lol

Thread, but the respect is always for your lady. She puts up with the best of us, may as well be the worst

I didn't feel like I learned very much new in the last Gawker piece other than that I was right that the theory about the evil publisher silencing the abuse victim to sell books was a little overblown.

She either comes off as very confused about the whole thing or I just fundamentally do not agree with her entire worldview.

stop it hurting, just walk away, just walk away

(aimless gently slides his hand under hurting 2's elbow and guides him slowly but firmly to the exit. as hurting 2 slides through the door, aimless throws one bittersweet glance over his shoulder and then follows him into the darkness).

She either comes off as very confused about the whole thing or I just fundamentally do not agree with her entire worldview.

― space phwoar (Hurting 2), Friday, January 11, 2013 11:00 PM (10 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yah i guess i feel like i got some insight into her worldview; enough to suspect that i strongly disagree with it

the anticipated audience was not you, who have read this clusterfuck and her blog posts etc

max was . . . restrained, which is no doubt for the best

"A father who, when he was drunk, beat our mother in front of us"A father who, when he was drunk, beat our mother in front of us"A father who, when he was drunk, beat our mother in front of us"A father who, when he was drunk, beat our mother in front of us

expecting your own worldview to appear coherent and philosophically sound to others is a flawed perspective, expecting that of others, when they notably have a hard time pruning their public image, is too much

The more I live the more I think that people who pursue their lives in the public sphere successfully are more crafters of images than purveyors of personal truth

The more I live the more I think that people who pursue their lives in the public sphere successfully are more crafters of images than purveyors of personal truth

― mh, Friday, January 11, 2013 11:18 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

don't mean to be harsh but uh no shit?

well sure, but the people who are all "omg this is a horrible person" are judging on the fact this writer throws everything out there, not on the fact that she is actually pretty average and just not a good crafter of her image, for someone in her public position

see I was mentioning that to outline the inverse case, cad

max was . . . restrained, which is no doubt for the best

― mookieproof, Friday, January 11, 2013 11:17 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah I would agree with this

yeah mh i get it, certainly for valdes it does not seem like crafting a particular image is her prime motivation here, but her defense of her style of memoir is just kind of bizarre to those of us who, having now heard the whole story, are saying "uh there's really no value in you leaving things hanging in the middle"

it seems like she's a horrible human being who had something horrible happen to her and is now stuck in a terrible no-win position

― Solange Knowles is my hero (DJP), Friday, January 11, 2013 11:23 AM (11 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i think this is pretty perfectly put

NB have not read the rest of the thread yet so if there are new developments i am unaware of them

you should read it

;)

Not even sure I'd call it a defense as much as a series of kneejerk reactions and denials

richard dunne vs russia

still getting caught up on the thread; this was good:

feel like ambition should be in the dsm

― lag∞n, Friday, January 11, 2013 4:23 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

hasn't she been through enough?

― Mordy, Friday, January 11, 2013 5:17 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

she needs a strong message board to show her the way

― lag∞n, Friday, January 11, 2013 5:18 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

http://www.mamiverse.com/an-open-letter-to-demi-moore-4051/

http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd70/artnframing123/Framed%20Art/100_4734.jpg

haha

is it to soon to make a white knighting/race war connection btw

This is not meant to be a diagnosis of Demi Moore's health issues, as only a licensed professional can make such a diagnosis.

"I'm Brian Fellow"

http://missalisasplace.com/2013/01/12/lets-talk-about-this/

Max Read (what a great freakin' pen name, dude)

In the interest of being completely transparent, I’ve decided to host a Livestream chat on my website for anyone to join tomorrow. I’ll be live, on video, and you guys can ask me anything you want to. I want you to be able to see my eyes when I answer you, so that you can judge for yourself whether I’m telling the truth or crazy. I encourage you to join me, because I am genuinely interested in what you have to say, and hope that you will extend the same respect to me. Come to this link tomorrow, Sunday, January 13, at 6 p.m. MST (8 p.m. EST) and let’s talk about this, like civilized, intelligent people. Or at least not like idiots. Deal?