yeah agreed crut
this sort of abstract music can be laden quite heavily with extratextual associations to augment the desolate/unsettling atmospherics, which can come off as pretty cheap or glib but i don't really get that here
is there any prurient stuff that is worth hearing? i had an lp before but it didn't leave too great an impression, clearly
― things that are jokes pretty much (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Tuesday, 25 December 2012 22:13 (eleven years ago) link
are you saying he isn't into bondage/drugs? my heart is broken.
― mh, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 22:17 (eleven years ago) link
if you can get past the ridiculous words in the yelling, I like the Prurient album
― mh, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 22:18 (eleven years ago) link
dude is probably into bondage/drugs. and violence and war.
― crüt, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 22:38 (eleven years ago) link
(or at least he wants people to think that)
― crüt, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 22:40 (eleven years ago) link
academically
― mh, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 22:40 (eleven years ago) link
what is his okcupid url
― things that are jokes pretty much (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Tuesday, 25 December 2012 22:41 (eleven years ago) link
I quite liked the Prurient album from last year, but, this:
I can't tell if some of the things he's done/said as an artist are really po-faced or just meant to give that impression. Slippery slope, really.
This is SUCH a pet peeve of mine, and to me, it's rampant in his work. In general I really resent the tendency in noise/industrial/whatever that you have to have titles/concepts/whatever that match sonics in terms of darkness, to the point of becoming a dick measuring contest about how morbid you can come across. If the music is dark then it's dark; how insecure are you that you need to thrown in references to Chechnyan children for it to make sense?
― formerly EDB (ed.b), Tuesday, 25 December 2012 22:43 (eleven years ago) link
xp actually there are pictures of his old okcupid page on noize board somewhere, along with color commentary about him being a pedo
― mh, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 22:44 (eleven years ago) link
save the babies
― Tome Cruise (Matt P), Tuesday, 25 December 2012 22:46 (eleven years ago) link
ha i hadnt heard that mh
― things that are jokes pretty much (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Tuesday, 25 December 2012 22:47 (eleven years ago) link
Cairo is a haunted city is great but I do wonder what this guys deal is
― I am using your worlds, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 22:59 (eleven years ago) link
http://userserve-ak.last.fm/serve/500/56149197/Prurient+6676470438968806740.jpg
Prurient: C/D
:D
― mh, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 23:00 (eleven years ago) link
In general I really resent the tendency in noise/industrial/whatever that you have to have titles/concepts/whatever that match sonics in terms of darkness, to the point of becoming a dick measuring contest about how morbid you can come across.
haha I love this kinda shit tbrr
― crüt, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 23:11 (eleven years ago) link
I vacillate between "really, are you fucking kidding me" and "yesssssss"
― mh, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 23:13 (eleven years ago) link
the former leads to the latter tbh
only vatican shadow does it to this extent though, right?
i've only heard two albums by him, the two released this year; i fell in love w/ghosts of chechnya immediately but didn't like ornamented walls at all - i think i might like him better in his techno guise
"snipers..." is so fucking gorgeous
― lex pretend, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 23:16 (eleven years ago) link
Which of his releases are the most techno?
― I am using your worlds, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 23:19 (eleven years ago) link
ghosts of chechnya as far as i know
― lex pretend, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 23:19 (eleven years ago) link
Thanks
― I am using your worlds, Tuesday, 25 December 2012 23:21 (eleven years ago) link
Read a bit comparing his music/image to Muslimgauze
he says he started making Vatican Shadow tracks because... he wanted more Muslimgauze albums to listen to.
― 2am chopped top (brimstead), Tuesday, 25 December 2012 23:24 (eleven years ago) link
what else sounds like vatican shadow
― things that are jokes pretty much (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Wednesday, 26 December 2012 00:17 (eleven years ago) link
http://www.factmag.com/2012/04/01/prurient-and-still-wanting/
The tapes you released in 2009 as Vatican Shadow – Kneel Before Religious Icons and Byzantine Private CIA – sound to me like precursors to Bermuda Drain, in the sense that they’re rhythm-led, atmospheric and decisively electronic pieces. Is it fair to say that that what you’ve learned from that project has fed into the way you do things as Prurient?“Well, in some ways it has and in some ways it hasn’t. Quite simply, Vatican Shadow was the first time that I was experimenting with making beats, and in that sense it did lay some groundwork for Bermuda Drain. I love certain sides of Muslimgauze records, and I kind of ran out of that sort of music to listen to, so that’s partly why Vatican came about…I mean, a lot of what motivates me in general is that when I can’t find something I want, I try to create it, to satisfy that need. And in many ways that’s what Bermuda Drain is too – I’m looking for this thing and I can’t quite find it so I think, ok, so I’ll make it myself.“You could also say that Vatican is the total opposite and antithesis of Bermuda Drain, because it doesn’t address the personal world thematically. It’s really more about headlines…I like to describe it as being like a spy game, an espionage board game where you don’t know who’s winning or what side you’re on. I think that’s fair. I like the idea that there are multiple events happening simultaneously, and they may be unrelated, but somehow they’re creating a larger picture. I like the idea of things working behind the scenes, particularly in a sinister way. Even the name Vatican Shadow, and all the song titles, are based around this idea of fear and mistrust and…”Conspiracy?“I mean, it’s linked to conspiracy, but I actually have no real interest in that and am not advocating any of those theories. I find [conspiracy] interesting as a symbol for collapse, a total lack of trust, a total global failure – I think that’s what’s interesting. I have no agenda. I like the atmosphere of degeneration and fear that Vatican conjures. It’s very poetic. When you read the news and see these headlines sometimes you just think you’re reading poetry. They’re so absurd.” [laughs]
“Well, in some ways it has and in some ways it hasn’t. Quite simply, Vatican Shadow was the first time that I was experimenting with making beats, and in that sense it did lay some groundwork for Bermuda Drain. I love certain sides of Muslimgauze records, and I kind of ran out of that sort of music to listen to, so that’s partly why Vatican came about…I mean, a lot of what motivates me in general is that when I can’t find something I want, I try to create it, to satisfy that need. And in many ways that’s what Bermuda Drain is too – I’m looking for this thing and I can’t quite find it so I think, ok, so I’ll make it myself.
“You could also say that Vatican is the total opposite and antithesis of Bermuda Drain, because it doesn’t address the personal world thematically. It’s really more about headlines…I like to describe it as being like a spy game, an espionage board game where you don’t know who’s winning or what side you’re on. I think that’s fair. I like the idea that there are multiple events happening simultaneously, and they may be unrelated, but somehow they’re creating a larger picture. I like the idea of things working behind the scenes, particularly in a sinister way. Even the name Vatican Shadow, and all the song titles, are based around this idea of fear and mistrust and…”
Conspiracy?
“I mean, it’s linked to conspiracy, but I actually have no real interest in that and am not advocating any of those theories. I find [conspiracy] interesting as a symbol for collapse, a total lack of trust, a total global failure – I think that’s what’s interesting. I have no agenda. I like the atmosphere of degeneration and fear that Vatican conjures. It’s very poetic. When you read the news and see these headlines sometimes you just think you’re reading poetry. They’re so absurd.” [laughs]
― crüt, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 00:20 (eleven years ago) link
There was an error parsing the BBcode in your post:Unknown BBcode tag: [conspiracy]
he is a pedophile― JW (ex machina), Thursday, May 25, 2006 3:17 PM (6 years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
― mh, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 00:21 (eleven years ago) link
that's prurient amirite
― things that are jokes pretty much (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Wednesday, 26 December 2012 00:22 (eleven years ago) link
So many Vatican Shadow options this year but this one was my favorite:River of Ectoplasm (Cass, Ltd, C120)A1 Had 'Em Throwin' a Party for a Bunch of ChildrenA2 While All of the While the Slime Was Under the BuildingA3 Grabbed the Proton packs off the Back and They SplitB1 The Bones Over the Door Rattled as Venkman Entered the ShopB2 Dana Walked Down the Street with Venkman Retracing the Path of the Runaway BuggyB3 The Improved Ectomobile Roared Out onto the StreetB4 Its Ghostly Siren Moaning and Wailing― Andy K, Wednesday, December 12, 2012 12:55 PM (1 week ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
River of Ectoplasm (Cass, Ltd, C120)A1 Had 'Em Throwin' a Party for a Bunch of ChildrenA2 While All of the While the Slime Was Under the BuildingA3 Grabbed the Proton packs off the Back and They SplitB1 The Bones Over the Door Rattled as Venkman Entered the ShopB2 Dana Walked Down the Street with Venkman Retracing the Path of the Runaway BuggyB3 The Improved Ectomobile Roared Out onto the StreetB4 Its Ghostly Siren Moaning and Wailing
― Andy K, Wednesday, December 12, 2012 12:55 PM (1 week ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
― Andy K, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 00:31 (eleven years ago) link
some of the Christian Cosmos stuff is really dope
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUXD6BUqNNk
― crüt, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 00:42 (eleven years ago) link
i want to post one of this dude's press shots in lonely guys thinking baout things
i'm certain that most of the people depicted in that thread are thinking 'would it matter if vatican shadow just released untitled albums in plain covers'
― things that are jokes pretty much (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Wednesday, 26 December 2012 01:01 (eleven years ago) link
Beats aside there isn't actually that much difference between Vatican Shadow and someone like Burial, except there's a chasm of difference between calling your track 'In McDonalds' and calling it 'Chechnya's Ghosts Loom Large In Death Of Former Spy' when the musical differences are microscopic.
Of course Vatican Shadow himself knows this and he knows full well that this extremely broadsheet-friendly music is going to listened to by people who are at the same time reading accounts of all manner of atrocities. It's an album that's good to read to, it's an album that works strangely well on a Sunday afternoon. It's excellent background music, there's not much going on after a couple of bars.
The music SOUNDS fucking amazing, by the way.
― Matt DC, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 02:37 (eleven years ago) link
i don't think it is narcissism of small differences to suggest that burial does not sound that much like vatican shadow
― things that are jokes pretty much (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Wednesday, 26 December 2012 02:40 (eleven years ago) link
Vatican Shadow (dark techno / broadsheet techno)
Burial (dubstep / blood and soil electro)
Objective NON correlation, granular analysis PROVES differentiated soundtype arrays
― things that are jokes pretty much (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Wednesday, 26 December 2012 03:00 (eleven years ago) link
I dunno, the beats are totally different but the sonically they're not very far apart - it doesn't have to be Burial though, the basic point can apply to any producer of grim-sounding abstract music.
Like I get the sense that this is record (not listened to the others) is actually meant to represent the unease of reading about atrocities rather than the experience of them. And he knows his audience and he's well aware of all this.
Then again it is late on Christmas Day and I am drunk but I still think this is one of the best records of this year.
― Matt DC, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 03:09 (eleven years ago) link
i think it's cyberpunk adorno music
― Mordy, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 03:21 (eleven years ago) link
how could we rebrand vatican shadow
― things that are jokes pretty much (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Wednesday, 26 December 2012 03:23 (eleven years ago) link
there are about a trillion releases so if one were so inclined to carefully repackage one of them and send press releases etc, how could it be presented
― things that are jokes pretty much (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Wednesday, 26 December 2012 03:25 (eleven years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zH9-d2YQqHU
― Mordy, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 03:25 (eleven years ago) link
an NRO contributor greatly concerned w/rise of Islamism plays techno
― Mordy, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 03:28 (eleven years ago) link
like even though it only sounds like burial to drunk people, what if we use the burial concept but alter the signifiers from grotty suburban london to some industrial city in china, press releases would focus heavily on the anomie of living in a smog cloaked exurban wasteland
all of the lp covers would be photos of shopping trolleys in canals, track names would be broken english with random chinese characters, it would be the work of a producer born in harbin in 1983 who spent a year studying industrial design in kiev and is now living a shadowy existence hiding from the CCP, emailing flacs surreptitiously from internet cafes
― things that are jokes pretty much (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Wednesday, 26 December 2012 03:33 (eleven years ago) link
If he wants to rebrand he has to change names. Vatican Shadow is DF's war-themed bedroom techno project, just like Exploring Jezebel is his femdom/male-humiliation fetish-themed noise project and Christian Cosmos is his Christian-themed ambient-industrial project.
― crüt, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 03:37 (eleven years ago) link
Is that Exploring Jezebel thing any good? It looks like every track is 45 minutes (!)
― mh, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 03:46 (eleven years ago) link
I haven't heard that one. 8 x C90 sounds like a great way to release music! Also, lol @ each side being called a "Dildo": http://www.discogs.com/Exploring-Jezebel-Penis-Torture-Chamber/release/2384418
― crüt, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 03:49 (eleven years ago) link
It's on digital release, too, looks like.
― mh, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 03:51 (eleven years ago) link
is there any ilm thread about the arbitrariness of paratext in electronic music
like what if drexciya instead of black science fiction had been about a counterfactual reality where the british empire never finished
― things that are jokes pretty much (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Wednesday, 26 December 2012 04:02 (eleven years ago) link
roman empire never ended iirc
― mh, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 04:12 (eleven years ago) link
Vatican Shadow I've heard was pretty close to Sandwell District and their off-shoots (go and listen to the Silent Servant album if you haven't heard that yet). Also maybe Morphosis too.
― Albert Crampus (NickB), Wednesday, 26 December 2012 10:57 (eleven years ago) link
it sounds like early 80's SPK
― sisilafami, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 11:30 (eleven years ago) link
Fernow put out Silent Servant's album this year (Hospital Productions is his label). It's a bit like VS but better and without the war on terror titles
He's also in a black metal band, which I'm guessing won't come as a massive shock to anyone - http://www.last.fm/music/Ash+Pool
― paolo, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 12:01 (eleven years ago) link
Also merry christmas everybody
i have the silent servant album which is my kinda thing, but apart from one or two tracks it hasn't quite clicked (yet, maybe)
― things that are jokes pretty much (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Wednesday, 26 December 2012 15:02 (eleven years ago) link
the christian cosmos youtube crut posted is great
― flopson, Wednesday, 26 December 2012 19:55 (eleven years ago) link
nothing stanton in the way of you making your own cool paratext abstracted from context islamodrone records, burt i guess you have better things to do
― Nilmar Honorato da Silva, Tuesday, 22 October 2013 15:52 (ten years ago) link
fyi my ouvre on ilx is a similarly themed middle east fetishism paratextual art project but in the medium of 'message board textual aesthetics' as opposed to leftfield electronica.
― Mordy , Tuesday, 22 October 2013 15:53 (ten years ago) link
true
― Snipers as a breed tend to be supercilious (Nilmar Honorato da Silva), Tuesday, 22 October 2013 16:03 (ten years ago) link
http://soundinjections.tumblr.com/post/35349961955/vatican-shadow
― Mordy , Saturday, 18 January 2014 23:56 (ten years ago) link
^^that's v good, i need to hear more tbh
― lovely cuddly fluffy dope (imago), Sunday, 19 January 2014 00:47 (ten years ago) link
http://s.pixogs.com/image/R-5759187-1401885690-2892.jpeg
Vatican Shadow – Death Is Unity With God
TracklistFireballA1 Al Qaeda (Branch Davidian) B1 Desert Storm (Waco) B2 It's To Come Enduring MysteriesC1 ATF Sinful Messiah D1 FBI God D2 Koresh Babylon Easing Of Our TaskE1 Fort Hood Again E2 Koresh Lamb E3 Machine-Gunning Of The Davidians F1 Texarkana Resistance Oklahoma Military AcademyG1 Theology Is Life And Death (Pakistan) G2 Descended On Guayanilla (CNN) H1 Arms Of Yahweh H2 Manufactured Silencers Under Direct Orders Elohim CityI1 Living On And Off At The Shadow Motel I2 Small Explosives And Blasting Caps I3 Inside The Pages Of A Phonebook J McVeigh Figures April SilencerK1 Shadows On The Courthouse Wall L1 Waco Postmortem (Murrah)
NotesEdition of 100.Comes with seven 8" x 8" collages
― Mordy, Tuesday, 10 June 2014 04:41 (nine years ago) link
Elohim City
― clouds, Wednesday, 11 June 2014 16:32 (nine years ago) link
sampling what's available on youtube. seems like everything i've heard so far barely rises above a (menacing) whisper.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdmRF5eF85U
― Daniel, Esq 2, Wednesday, 11 June 2014 16:41 (nine years ago) link
My first thought was that's an old Danse Society logo. I am an old goth.
― Daniwa, guys! Daniwa! (aldo), Wednesday, 11 June 2014 17:10 (nine years ago) link
free show @ urban outfitters!
― the late great, Thursday, 17 July 2014 05:24 (nine years ago) link
Ahhh this one’s a real peach. Veering far from what we expected, ‘Games Have Rules’ is a brilliant late night excursion made in the spirit of classic Artificial Intelligence albums, instantly reminding us of that killer first Reaganz (Move D & Jonah Sharp) album from ’94 with it’s atmospheric soundscaping and nods to John Carpenter.
― the final twilight of all evaluative standpoints (nakhchivan), Saturday, 4 October 2014 22:48 (nine years ago) link
i like this more than i thought i would going on that description
― the final twilight of all evaluative standpoints (nakhchivan), Saturday, 4 October 2014 22:51 (nine years ago) link
lol yes, this sounds amazing so far
― Mordy, Saturday, 4 October 2014 22:52 (nine years ago) link
this guy has somehow turned into one of my favorite artists. this is elegiac + beautiful.
― Mordy, Saturday, 4 October 2014 22:53 (nine years ago) link
― Mordy , Tuesday, 22 October 2013 16:53 (11 months ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
lol
― the final twilight of all evaluative standpoints (nakhchivan), Saturday, 4 October 2014 22:56 (nine years ago) link
CD Version of Death Is Unity With God (3 discs) for under $20
― lute bro (brimstead), Saturday, 26 December 2015 19:27 (eight years ago) link
http://www.tinymixtapes.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/Article_Width/1606/vatican-shadow-media.jpg
― brimstead, Thursday, 16 June 2016 00:15 (seven years ago) link
"Take Vows" is a total jam.
― mr.raffles, Thursday, 16 June 2016 02:30 (seven years ago) link
New double 10" Luxor Necropolitics with Joshua Eustis from Telefon Tel Aviv
― brimstead, Sunday, 10 September 2017 16:23 (six years ago) link
oh shit that sounds like something i'd like to hear
― Mordy, Sunday, 10 September 2017 16:33 (six years ago) link
the remix at the end of it is pretty good
― mh, Sunday, 10 September 2017 16:45 (six years ago) link
True story: I was interviewing Ty Dolla Sign in late 2012 and he asked what I'd been listening to (he's very musically curious) and I pt him on to Vatican Shadow. No collab as of yet but there's still hope imo
― Listen to my homeboy Fantano (D-40), Sunday, 10 September 2017 17:43 (six years ago) link
Thanks due to this thread, obv
― Listen to my homeboy Fantano (D-40), Sunday, 10 September 2017 17:44 (six years ago) link
Based on the dates here it must have been early 2013, actually
― Listen to my homeboy Fantano (D-40), Sunday, 10 September 2017 17:45 (six years ago) link
interested to hear this
https://www.residentadvisor.net/reviews/23662
― the late great, Monday, 15 April 2019 17:35 (five years ago) link
it's interesting! not sure how I felt about all the Genesis Breyer P-Orridge vocal clips used as a connecting thread although it was an interesting choice
― mh, Monday, 15 April 2019 18:03 (five years ago) link
the genesis stuff makes it a nope for me, which sucks cause i'd prob be into it otherwise
― karl...arlk...rlka...lkar..., Monday, 15 April 2019 18:53 (five years ago) link
definitely seems like a very odd time to be making that particular decision
I guess I might have undersold the types of "interesting" there
― mh, Monday, 15 April 2019 18:58 (five years ago) link
I'm not sure "tone-deafness" is quite the right phrase in that RA review, it implies a kind of thoughtlessness. There's no way an artist as conscious of media narrative and violent imagery as Fernow didn't know exactly what he was doing.
― Matt DC, Monday, 15 April 2019 19:15 (five years ago) link
maybe that consciousness isn't the same type people like to think it is
― mh, Monday, 15 April 2019 19:56 (five years ago) link
New LP out tomorrow, Persian Pillars of the Gasoline Era.
His approach to titles is unsettlingly formulaic.
― hey, trust the fungus! (pomenitul), Thursday, 17 September 2020 19:26 (three years ago) link
I'm surprised Persian Pillars has been ignored for EOY lists or at all. It's great.
― wherewasyou, Tuesday, 29 December 2020 05:07 (three years ago) link
Got Vatican Shadow on this evening, almost certainly as a consequence of that recent amazing post in the politics thread. I’ve got to give DF props for calling a track “more of the same” which is the most ridiculously on the nose title ever
― I am using your worlds, Saturday, 9 January 2021 22:31 (three years ago) link
New one features a track titled 'The Other Blackbirds Required Shipping to Their Final Resting Places Which Necessitated Their Wings Being Sawed Off by Worldwide Aircraft Recovery'.
― pomenitul, Saturday, 6 March 2021 20:39 (three years ago) link
Pretty good article going deep on Fernow's connections to the far-right:
https://jeanhugueskabuiku.substack.com/p/about-vatican-shadow-link-with-the
Didn't expect the side swipes at St0suy. They were fair, from the context of the article, but I thought everyone loved that guy. Anyway, saw St0suy posted something on his Twitter about it this morning, but I haven't had a chance to read that yet.
― a superficial sheeb of intelligence (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Monday, 12 July 2021 14:14 (two years ago) link
It is worth reading:
A piece on Dominick Fernow and his links to artists with right wing ideologies was published Friday. I spent the weekend thinking of my laziness and complacency re: these connections and wanted to post the below. It's from a letter I wrote to the piece's author, @amazinggaijin pic.twitter.com/CfyiNYMTfP— brandonstosuy (@brandonstosuy) July 12, 2021
― Ned Raggett, Monday, 12 July 2021 15:13 (two years ago) link
Disappointing, but not all that surprising. Every time someone who produces negative art that I connect with turns out to be a creep, I wonder what about it hooked me in the first place. It's a concern. I guess it's a thing where we're both angry about things - just turns out they were coming at that shit from the opposite side of the spectrum. I loved DSO before I found out about that dude, too.
― beard papa, Monday, 12 July 2021 18:56 (two years ago) link