ATTN: Copyeditors and Grammar Fiends

is "brethren" strictly a gendered word?

eh, there's "sistren" but that's even more antiquated

oh that's terrible

because of the miracle of metaphor, no word needs to be strictly gendered. however, the plain, obvious meaning of brethren has a strong gender denotation.

yup

try 'posse' instead

i went with 'cohorts'

broheems

Help! I don't know what to do about this particular thing where I'm writing about a girl named K.C. I have to end a sentence with a quote in which her name is the last word. So is it:

". . . K.C.". Next sentence here. . .

or

". . . K.C." Next sentence here. . .

For argument's sake, let's pretend I cannot rework the sentence structure.

Oh and this is supposed to follow APA style, if that matters.

the latter imo

Yes.

At least that's how we do it in the good ol' U.S.A.

Heck, I'm not crazy about it, but it seems like every sentence that ends with a quotation these days has the period on the inside.

Do you have to have the full stops after K.C.? Could you just put KC?

I think you could get away with that if it was an acronym, but initials would have a different rule.

it's definitely the second one

Yeah I mean K.C. is the name, so I don't feel I can drop the periods.

OK here's another wrinkle. What if I needed to write a sentence that went:

. . . Kaitlin is the "K", while Carmine is the "C".

vs.

. . . Kaitlin is the "K," while Carmine is the "C."

Again, let's pretend that I can't rewrite. Where does the punctuation go, inside or out?

inside

I trust u and harbl and pp but I'd feel better if someone could site some actual rule from some actual style guide. Googling the rest of the internets has not been very helpful in this regard :(

As I always understood it inside is typographical/US style, outside is logical/UK style. Being lol british would definitely go outside for the second example, but would stick with the inside one for "K.C.", no point doubling up. Xpost sorry no useful citations here.

Inside the quotes, though I don't like it personally.

http://www.dailywritingtips.com/period-goes-inside-quotation-marks/

Alright, inside it is. Stupid grammar.

I just feel badly that I'm asking the period behind the "C" to do double duty as part of a name *and* sentence--ending punctuation. Doesn't seem fair to the poor lil guy!

Just imagine what life would be like if you were supposed to have an ellipsis after that "C" instead...

FML were that the case, yes

Stupid grammar.

Just a trivial correction here. This sort of typographical convention is entirely detached from grammar. Grammar is intrinsic to a language, while typography is extrinsic.

This is why I defer to the grammar fiends :)

that is not a trivial correction!

I considered it trivial because the complaint it corrected was not seriously intended.

ah but the distinction itself -- not trivial!

Just imagine what life would be like if you were supposed to have an ellipsis after that "C" instead...

As someone who overuses ellipses, I've confronted this a few times--I always went with three dots instead of four.

I never liked this punctuation on the inside business, and I think if we all just agreed in secret to move it to the outside, in a few years time, it won't even be a thing anymore.

naw it looks silly on the outside imo. did the boys of 1776 die for nothing?

I wrote for one American magazine that, for stylistic reasons of its own, put punctuation outside quotation marks. Always looked goofy to me, but it was their call. I could never remember to write that way, though, so I just let them relocate the periods and commas.

well, which looks sillier?

Sheryl Crow wrote "Benny and the Jets", the best song in her career.
Sheryl Crow wrote "Benny and the Jets," the best song in her career.

Top one looks sillier, but it's hard to say why except habit and expectation.

Sheryl Crow writing a song like "Benny and the Jets" – the silliest of them all.

^^ But hey, by the inside rules, I should've written:

Sheryl Crow writing a song like "Benny and the Jets –" the silliest of them all.

I mean, punctuation is punctuation, right?

Sir, let us not be ridiculous!

How about:
Sheryl Crow wrote "Benny and the Jets", "Master of Puppets", and "Nothing Compares 2 U" while in an opium haze.
Sheryl Crow wrote "Benny and the Jets," "Master of Puppets," and "Nothing Compares 2 U" while in an opium haze.

we'll always have oxford (commas)

you would put 4 dots there if there was an ellipsis, if i recall correctly....

That's purely a stylistic question (as is your original question). I think what you were really asking was, "Does anyone here have the APA manual?"

Stupidly, the APA manual is not available online, or I would have purchased that fucker.

Associated Press Guide To Punctuation ©2003:

Well-known initials (my emphasis) don't have periods. FBI CIA FAA LBJ

Does KC & The Sunshine Band count? Does he qualify as well-known? And if so, does that translate to someone who isn't a 70s disco star, but also has the same name?

Periods and commas always go inside the quotation marks. Exclamation points, question marks, dashes and semi-colons do not always go inside.

Didn't Mark Anthony say, "I have not come to bury Caesar, but to praise him"?

Gertrude Stein once asked, "What is the question?"

But back to periods and commas: Always means always. Last night, I watched "The Cosby Show," "Family Ties," "Cheers," and "Night Court."

Again, I don't like that, but I didn't get to make up the rules.

...I have a couple of follow-up questions for which I would be grateful if you would answer at your liesure.

seems so wrong. help?

What's wrong with "which I would be grateful if you would answer..."?

The "for" is leading you astray, dear boy. Drop it.

I have a couple of follow-up questions,

... answers for which, if provided by you at your liesure, would inspire within me gratitude in your direction.

... for which I need answers, and if you provided me with same at your liesure, I would feel grateful.

... and if answers to these came from you, purely at your liesure of course, then that would be swellerific in my view and incidentally, I'd be grateful, not at my liesure, but at once, without let or hindrance.

... and if, at your liesure, you could answer them for me, then I would be most grateful.

I would lean toward the last of the above suggested variants.