Sea Devils And Die: GeroniMoffat's Doctor Who In The 2010s

I am a little concerned with plot manifesting itself through threats to Amy's bodily integrity, mind (Weeping Angelification, Pregnancy, Dalekification).

Another annoying thing: PLEASE STOP SAYING "DOCTOR WHO?", IT IS AS ANNOYING, IF NOT MORE, THAN FUCKING "SPOILERS".

God I hate this so much. Even Rusty new this was beyond the pale.

And it doesn't even make sense in his own continuity.

"On the fields of Trenzelor, at the fall of the Eleventh, when no living creature can speak falsely or fail to answer, a question will be asked—one that must never be answered. And Silence must fall when the question is asked."

So where are the Silence falling then? After all, they weren't defeated at the end of the last series - they were encouraged to believe they'd won after The Doctor faked his own death, so they lost interest in him. You can maybe forgive them not noticing a blue head in a box saying it, but the entire parliament of daleks shouting it repeatedly? You'd have to think it might attract their attention.

Oh ok, yeah -- the whole "can't have a family" plot point was pretty weak and nonsensical in general. Now I feel terrible that I'm so used to bad TV plotting that I didn't bat an eye. It doesn't really fit at all. It seemed unnecessary to even make Amy and Rory's marriage on the rocks. My apologies for basically saying 'how can you not quite understanding this extremely stupid thing that came out of leftfield, they explained it in the show!?', mea culpa.

Although I suppose I did buy the idea that Amy would preemptively ditch Rory because she thought he would stop loving her... she's been written and portrayed as pretty rash and not the most rational. But yeah, what was even the point of that? I still don't think Moffatt's being intentionally sexist, he's just terrible at putting relationship drama into a sci-fi family adventure (yet he keeps trying to do it!).

Gadget-plot-speculation-go!

I think that what they might be going for is a super version of what just happens, where the Doctor not only is known as dead but is never known to have existed, so the Silence can hold a meeting like the one before the Pandorica, and says "The Doctor has come back!" and everyone says "Doctor Who?" and then the Silence's eyes roll so far back that their heads explode.

hah.

God, I think I've just worked it out.

The problem with Rory and Amy's relationship is that because of what was done to her they can't have kids. Any more kids, rather, except for River who didn't have a normal growing up process. But it remains she's their child, the product of both of them, and bringing her up would be exactly what Amy thinks Rory wants.

At the end of The Impossible Astronaut, the child River from the spacesuit regenerates into a toddler in 1969 NYC. She says later, I think in Let's Kill Hitler, that we wouldn't believe how she managed to survive it. Now, I know it's far fetched, but imagine if you had a plot device that let you travel anywhere in space and time. You could make everything all right for your main cast members...

That is almost certainly 100% correct.

I see someone else read the Adventures of Cyclops and Phoenix miniseries, too

Although the one flaw with this plan is that Mels grew up with Rory and Amy and remained a psychotic killer

Wibbly-wobbly-timey-wimey. Possibly not a "fixed point".

Would lol if somehow Mels was dropped off with Martha and Jack and raised as a ward of Torchwood

Sometimes the music is so overpowering and awful

All of the time tbh

nother annoying thing: PLEASE STOP SAYING "DOCTOR WHO?", IT IS AS ANNOYING, IF NOT MORE, THAN FUCKING "SPOILERS".

God I hate this so much. Even Rusty new this was beyond the pale.

― Matt DC, Monday, September 3, 2012 9:45 AM (6 hours ago)

Reckon they're allowed to say it once a series as a silly joke. Not have it repeated as a way to end an episode.

I cant say I like it at all.

At the end of The Impossible Astronaut, the child River from the spacesuit regenerates into a toddler in 1969 NYC.

I don't think we saw what she regenerated into, did we? She was a kid in the alley in NYC, she started to regenerate, THE END

She regenerated into Mel, no?

No, she specifically says (in LKH, I'm sure) that she's a toddler. Plus, were she to regenerate into Mel she'd need to halt her aging for the next 20 years then start aging normally (as shown in LKH, where she goes to school at the same time as Amy and ages with her). Seems unlikely.

I don't know if this was fully explained, or if it's just sloppy plotting, but I just assumed she was zoomed forward in time and planted with the Ponds by the Silence.

Also on rewatching I'd forgotten all the eye-rolling dialogue. "On a scale of one to ten.. eleven" "Well this is a change" "Who killed the Daleks/Who do you think?"

No, it's deliberately explained she had to survive as a toddler in NYC.

But Wait! Mel unintentionally saved Hitler's life before he invaded Poland, and if anything is a fixed point in the whonivere its World War Bloody Two (this is why the Doctor knew Time Was Broken when the Daleks showed up as Churchill's secret weapon... he didn't suspect wide ranging time-tampering when they showed up in 1920's NYC) The existence of that regeneration of River Song has to be conserved... now I'm going to have to rewatch Let's Kill Hitler to see if Moffat wrote in some kind of an escape clause for himself.

You know what I got the most>

EGGS EGGS I SAID EGGS EGGS LIKE A HEN LAYS I HATE HENS

eggs tern hen ate (ate like in eating an egg)

oeuf never bird oeuf tit

that bit was rubbish, or at least the bit where it was suddenly decided that the dalekification process was 100% halted forever with no need for further action

(maybe Amy's part-Dalek nature is going to come back in future episodes though, and I reserve the right to think that's rubbish too, because thinking things are rubbish is what I do)

We don't know how long she was uniknowingly wearing the anti-nano braclet thingy, which presumably stops and reverses dalekification. It was that which saved her, not the love stuff. That was just a trick by the Doctor to get them back together. Come on, people, pay attention!

Haha come on, past history shows that most people don't pay attention to what they watch

BTW I was trying to watch this with my parents and they kept having long, loud side conversations that forced me to restart the program multiple times until they got the hint and left me alone, lol. I'm such a good son.

She says later, I think in Let's Kill Hitler, that we wouldn't believe how she managed to survive it.

Don’t remember this.

Wibbly-wobbly-timey-wimey. Possibly not a "fixed point".

Strongly doubt that Moffatt would rewind and rewrite his entire timeline from last year, especially in one of four episodes that are specifically branded as being stand-alone. (Also especially as the trick nature of the timeline was one of the biggest points of last year, but not as especially.)

No, she specifically says (in LKH, I'm sure) that she's a toddler. Plus, were she to regenerate into Mel she'd need to halt her aging for the next 20 years then start aging normally (as shown in LKH, where she goes to school at the same time as Amy and ages with her). Seems unlikely.

They cover this specifically in dialogue within two minutes of Mels regenerating into River – River says she might take her age down a little every year, “just to mess with people;” thus establishing that she’s able to manipulate her apparent age in exactly the way Mels would have had to after her first 20-some years in that body.

Also, you’re saying it’s “unlikely” that Time Lords can halt their apparent aging for twenty years, when we’ve seen onscreen, implicitly and explicitly, them hold to the same age for a century or two?

(The Leisure Hive either notwithstanding or withstanding, as I can’t remember why it happens or how it’s reversed)

Also on rewatching I'd forgotten all the eye-rolling dialogue. "On a scale of one to ten.. eleven" "Well this is a change"

“Well, this is new.” Loved that tbh, especially for Smith’s magnificent line-reading, rolling surprise up into delight; he loves things that are new, he loves mysteries, he loves challenges. HE IS THE DOCTOR

what happened to the movie-length episode thing?

what movie-length episode thing?

all the episodes were said to be movie-length, hence fewer episodes in 2012 and 2013

no, they weren't

thank the maker they're not doing that because I'm watching it on BBC America and they won't extend the running time, they'll just lop 15 minutes out of the 60 minutes episodes.

no, they weren't

looks like this might have got out of hand

sounds like someone was pining for the original format and started a successful rumor

the Beeb have made "blockbuster movie" style poster images for each of the five new eps, if by "blockbuster movie poster" you mean 'knocked up cheaply in Photoshop in five minutes by a work-experience kid'

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/galleries/p00xzhxb

And from the rumors I've been reading online, the 50th anniversary keeps sounding more and more dismal...

I don't want to 'spoil' anything for anyone so I won't go into detail. Well that and the fact that online rumors often turn out to be completely false.

I just wish we were getting a full series in 2013, but from all I can see it seems we're only getting the other 8 eps of this one.

The next 8* will be early in the year; at the moment it looks like a cluster of 2009-style specials around the anniversary (not counting Gatiss' Sydney & Verity docudrama), and Moffatt and Smith are signed for a full series in 2014. All this could change, of course.

*apart from the Christmas special

Oh, good, that's more like it then!

Someone else has spotted this:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m9v1aa2Fuk1qjp42oo1_500.jpg

Unfortunate re-use of a prop, or...?

well wait, one has gold arms and the other has black arms

totally different things

Does not not happen all the time though?

(Is that the last known shot of the Doctor's Daughter?)

It's not inconceivable that spaceships might have similarly designed chairs. Just a thought.

Commodity item in teh future.

Bottom one doesn't have gold arms, it's just the lighting.

Aye YMOF, that's the Doctor's Daughter leaving in her spaceship at the end of her episode.

Yes, does happen all the time and is more than likely just a coincidence - and of course Moffatt has no control over the production department even when they make horrific fuckups (cf Rory's hospital badge).

possibly it's more accurate to say they lit the bottom one specifically so it would have gold arms in a vain attempt to throw off canny Internet propspotters

well maybe "accurate" isn't the word I'm looking for

The premiere is kind of a throwback to the ye aulde Who, no? With all the walking back and forth through subterranean tunnels?

and all the old daleks

those tunnels were the BEST, I was so happy to see them