Every huge artist has their "New Jersey" - a huge event album that ultimately feels a bit hollow & signals a career decline

oh shit i forgot about his self titled album, Cocky DEFINITELY counts

FOREVER

though actually Cocky got most of its sales late in the game thanks to the belated success of "Picture"...really Kid Rock may be too wily a scamp for this

weren't this and The Great Milenko the big ones? From what I remember Jeckel Bros. was one of the best

Yes it was, which is the point; we're looking for a massive album that clearly telegraphs that the band was on a full tilt slide out of vogue and is retroactively embarrassing/terrible. Bizaar/Bizzar sold less than half of what Jeckel Brothers sold.

It's actually kind of amazing - Cocky is definitely the New Jersey for fans of the "my name is KIIIIIIIIIIIIIID" kid rock but ground zero for the people who love his later bullshit.

actually the Jewel comparison tracks pretty closely:

both Slippery and Pieces of You went 12x platinum in the US

New Jersey went 7x and Spirit went 4x

I can't remember a single song from Spirit

you don't remember "Fat Boy"?

TS: "Pieces Of You" vs "Fat Boy"

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/heQi0AZBH-0/0.jpghttp://i.ytimg.com/vi/heQi0AZBH-0/0.jpg

FAT BOY-EEE

doh

http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/heQi0AZBH-0/mqdefault.jpg

The neat thing about Monster being a New Jersey is that it was dramatic style shift that America bought and then quickly regretted. Usually a New Jersey is a MORE OF WHAT YOU LOVE kind of album, but I guess while Monster certainly wasn't a "more nightswimming!" album, it was in touch enough with the post-grunge vibe that people didn't get grossed out until after the fact.

"Hands" was the big hit from Spirit.

Yes it was, which is the point; we're looking for a massive album that clearly telegraphs that the band was on a full tilt slide out of vogue and is retroactively embarrassing/terrible.

Well Jeckel Bros. is probably their least retroactively embarrassing/terrible release, and ICP was never really in vogue

Well Jeckel Bros. is probably their least retroactively embarrassing/terrible release

this does not compute at all

although looking back at the track list it looks like "Piggy Pie" was actually on Milenko so maybe I should be backing that one

its also got "The Neden Game" which is the one track even people who hate ICP tend to like

Rock Of The Westies, mentioned a while back, is a good one I think. Debuted at #1 on the Billboard chart, yet "Island Girl" was the only charting single, and I struggled to remember any song titles without looking it up. Pretty neglected/forgotten about today?

yeah survivors like Elton always muddy the waters a bit - he put out "Don't Go Breaking My Heart" the same year - but Rock definitely seems like a bloom is off the rose moment

Roll With It and Crash, good thoughts.

Tangentially, there were a lot of slumpy followups in those years: Edie Brickell, Ghost of a Dog; Lisa Loeb, Firecracker; Tori Amos, Under the Pink. I don't think the foregoing are "huge artists," though, rite?

Winwood had been huge-ish because of SDG and Blind Faith, but I don't think the audience for "Roll with It" was the same audience as for Blind Faith (or, for that matter, Arc of a Diver).

BTW, "I Go to Extremes" and "Matter of Trust" are still in my head as much as any Joel is (which is not that much, but still) "Remember the Time" was my high school class's prom song.

Aerosmith - Nine Lives

that was a big dropoff from Get A Grip, though -- GAG sold as much as Pump, but maybe it's too well remembered for its videos to be a New Jersey?

btw does anyone else hear Fred Armisen as David Paterson saying "New JERSEY!" in their head a lot while reading this thread?

i do now

George's Living in the Material World is a good one

yeah aerosmith's tough - Nine Lives was definitely a #1 debut BIG EVENT album but tanked fast. Get A Grip's singles were so similar SNL made a joke out of it, so I could see the argument they were already being propped up by Alicia Silverstone, but really their entire Geffen run was so on borrowed time that I don't see anyone begrudging the hits.

i still hear "Livin' On The Edge" on rock stations, i wonder if any '90s hits' stations play any of the Silverstone trilogy anymore

ha -- heard "Crazy" yesterday morning on the eighties/nineties station

that kinda lovin' sends a man right to his grave

I remember being amazed at how long "Cryin'" was played on the radio until I realized I was actually hearing "Crazy"

lol

Debbie Gibson - Electric Youth

i honestly considered that the other day but vetoed myself since I still remembered the hooks to the two biggest hits, plus I don't know if it sounds any less hollow than the debut. Others more invested may feel differently.

like "straight up" and "opposites attract" definitely get more love than "promise of a new day" and "rush rush" but do people really rate "foolish beat" above "lost in your eyes" or whatever?

If so, then Step By Step probably counts

the presence of "Vibeology" drags the whole thing into New Jersey territory imo

there's this blurry zone between a New Jersey and a flop that we hit a lot, the "commercial disappointment" that still does honorable business. Part of what makes New Jersey so interesting is that for anyone else it'd be HUGE. Like Spellbound - anyone would love having five top 20 hits off an album, but it feels like the beginning of the end now.

New Jersey rolled out a lot like Country albums do--two years after its predecessor, just after the singles from the last album had stopped coming out, and is pretty similar to that other album. A lot of other follow-ups to massive hits come after an extended break, and the artist has either "matured" or the music scene has changed.

Part of what makes New Jersey so interesting is that for anyone else it'd be HUGE

I don't think most artists would complain if they had Bon Jovi's post-NJ career either: going by Wiki, five platinum/multi-platinum albums and two gold albums in the US (only considering studio album), 8 Top 40 singles in the US, still touring stadiums 25 years after their biggest album.

so instead of studying for a test i'm trying to come up with TIERS

the New Jersey: a huge event album that's massive by all reasonable standards but is shadowed by the album(s) that ironically are the only reason it was massive, since it was pretty damn shallow on its own merits (i.e. New Jersey, Spellbound, For Those About To Rock, Spirits Having Flown, Afterburner, Fore!, Be Here Now in the UK)

the Fairweather Johnson: a huge event album that still sells better than it should've thanks to the band's previous success, but one could almost immediately sense fortunes going considerably southward even if one was a fan (i.e. Fairweather Johnson, Supposed Former Infatuation Junkie, Nine Lives, Be Here Now in the US)

haha dude you've taken this and run with it

but i think those are totally valid distinctions to make, the fundamental difference is that the Fairweather Johnson is viewed as underperforming or being slightly disappointing AT THE TIME, the New Jersey is only revealed in the fullness of time.

lol yeah sorry if i'm hijacking or anything, i just love this shit.

I don't think most artists would complain if they had Bon Jovi's post-NJ career either: going by Wiki, five platinum/multi-platinum albums and two gold albums in the US (only considering studio album), 8 Top 40 singles in the US, still touring stadiums 25 years after their biggest album.

yeah, though there was a serious drop off stateside after New Jersey, these guys were fucking troopers

more simply, everyone thinks a New Jersey is a Slippery When Wet at the time

you're not hijacking at all! i hadn't really thought it out ever but it was just kicking around in my head.

in movies this is Return of the Jedi

I don't think Spirits Having Flown is a New Jersey, I hear "Too Much Heaven" & "Love You Inside Out" too much for that. though the last time I heard "Love You Inside Out" was at a restaurant in Paris, & it was followed up by "Call Me Maybe", so really who knows

in movies this is Return of the Jedi

― Listen to this, dad (President Keyes), Wednesday, August 8, 2012 6:31 PM (33 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

woah, totally.

yeah i was wondering re: bee gees if it was different in europe, in America I have a real sense that despite being #1s, "Tragedy" "Love You Inside Out" and "Too Much Heaven" get nowhere the play of the Saturday Night Fever/Main Course stuff.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/cc/Lethal_Weapon_3_Poster.jpg

LOL re: Jedi, otm

Not sure I buy Fairweather Johnson as an 'event album,' but take that phrase out and it's a really useful category - things that sold massively in the first weeks, entirely on the momentum of the previous record, then died completely as everyone either realized it wasn't as good, or that the moment had simply passed. SFIJ is in this category, and probably a ton more much-hyped flops that are technically non-flops since they sold a million plus and had a ''hit'' in the first single (before the jig was up). The New Jersey is a much, much smaller club; I feel like this thread has maybe produced a dozen or fifteen, total, in between all the cult hits (not relevant), flop records (New Jerseys are successful, i like Elrond's point that they appear to be Slipperys) and ordinary sophomore slumps (which don't enjoy even the momentum sales of a Fairweather Johnson).

Xpost Re: Bee Gees, this may be a US/Europe divide. None of those songs are US radio regulars, although I did hear a dude request ''Tragedy'' a few weeks ago.

"Tragedy" rules so I'd be offended if it was forgotten entirely.

But yeah, re: Fairweathers forget "event album" - it's just a good way for us to make New Jersey a more exclusive honor

There's a phenomenon that's similar which I would dub the Journey Through The Secret Life of Plants (AKA the One From the Heart, in the film world), which is the instance wherein a respected artist, after having poured themselves into a critically-acclaimed and commercially successful work, basically opens up the pressure valve and sees a concurrent downturn in their critical and commercial success.

Step By Step def one.

Step By Step SO otm

Old Lunch, by "pressure valve," you mean doing what they want, marketplace be damned?