smashing pumpkins -- pisces iscariot: classic or dud?

That I couldn't confirm either because, as I learned last night, I no longer have a single way in my house to listen to cassettes. Ha. Still love that that was included though!

bummer there isn't more siamese dream outtake material, like cleaned up versions of some of those demos that leaked a few years ago. the heavier "set the ray to jerry" for example

In the absence of that

http://thepumpkins.net/music/647-music-quiet-and-other-songs

Meantime, as I just posted on the Frogs thread, here's their take on Pumpkins songs from a 1997 rehearsal:

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL345D3F4CAFD406A5&feature=edit_ok

love that version of Rhinoceros

yeah that version is great

(seventeen years ago)

is it still your fave?

yes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnjegcYZVfs

Hadn't listened to that song in years and got goosebumps the whole way through. Thanks for the thread bump, Curtis. I'm gonna have to dive back into PI. Starla has my favorite Corgan guitar and Blew Away is maybe James' best song.

Hello Kitty Kat is an awesome song, so brutal, & it came very close to being on Siamese Dream (in place of or after Quiet iirc). the promo cassettes of SD have Hello Kitty Kat on them, and it's a different mix than the one on PI.

record rules, still stunning what a prolific & consistently great songwriter Billy was in the Pumpkins' prime

xp yeah Blew Away is the only James song that I listen to (somewhat) regularly. The Boy is pretty cool too - here's a sick live version from a Starchildren show from June 1994. it's a lot faster than the one on TAFH: https://archive.org/details/tsp1994-06-18.shn/tsp1994-06-18t04.shn - also there's a pretty sweet cover of Cars. that's a cool show. early version of Here is No Why, too.

Neither classic or dud, but has some stunning must-hear moments on it.

Damn, the outro to Obscured is so gorgeous.

Ahhh, "Whir"....still gorgeous and the lyrics have meant different things to me as I've gotten older.

Yeah, 'Whir' is easily one of my favourites. That and 'Frail and Bedazzled' ...

speaking of which

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bcvnO-rvjA

Yep still the best one

Yeah, incredible how Billy was not only prolific, but kept hitting the mark with almost every song he wrote in the '90s. At some point the quality control went and he just became prolific.

even the songs he threw away were brilliant, "Methusela" being the best example.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JufC-dp5Sw

Cool album IMO

Browsing at Amoeba, I came across a sealed copy of the deluxe reissue (2CD / 1DVD) for $18.98, and bought it on a whim. Did I do good?

It's worth the price for 'Frail and Bedazzled' and 'Starla' alone!

Did it come with the demo cassette

The back cover does list "First ever SP demo reproduced on cassette" among the inclusions...

There's a lot of people in the hardcore that really like their very early work from the late '80s, the pre-Gish stuff. I can't really say I'm one of 'em. That early TV appearance where they play a lot of early material is still worth a watch, though, just as a comparison point between then and Gish.

Although it's kinda sad to compare it to footage of the Arising! tour for a number of reasons. D'arcy's appearance being one of 'em.

there are some fantastic riffs among the pre-Gish stuff but yeah not much in the way of good entire songs... I like “under your spell” and “there is goes” though. Were those both Marked tunes?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Rr7th61VOk

'There It Goes' isn't too bad. I think the Oceania-era line-up did a one-off performance of that one just for a select couple of people, but I might be misremembering and it may be a completely different song. Look at how young and fresh-faced they all look in that 1988 video, though - even Jimmy - although he's very restrained on the early stuff. D'arcy looks cool (and cute) as hell.

Fast forward 11 years later...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x20kajCVzTM

Opened it up, the tape is pretty cool-looking... wish I still had a cassette deck

none of them are Marked songs, those can be found elsewhere... I think when Billy started SP he threw everything he had away. I've listened to some of that Marked stuff, it's pretty bad. there are some good songs among the pre-Gish material. definitely There It Goes, She, Under Your Spell, Razor, I Am My End...

Mashed Potatoes remains an extremely fun listen, imo

oh, one of the best. "Cinder" is killer, I always wondered where that was recorded, why there's no other documentation of that song, and why an unrelated song was put out on the PI reissue called "Cinder Open" or something. only the Pumpkins would let something like that die as a almost never played live rarity.

'Cinder' has a great riff, if I remember. That's the one where part of it ended up in 'Silverfuck', right? There's few bands out there that inspire me to hear not just all the officially released recorded work, but the bootlegs and outtakes etc., but the Pumpkins are definitely one of 'em.

we’ve never seen the deeep live silverfucks 95-96 all laid out right? i saw (and recorded, and traded) a bunch of them back then and just a few months apart it changed so much, just whole new avenues into song, n ight-to-night variations on themes

sounds wanky as shit but in person? powerful

I’ve always had a love/hate relationship with this band, but the quality of their leftovers from the 90s is undeniable. I could do a POX just from b-sides.

I’ll expand on this thought tomorrow (maybe) but Gish and the bsides from both this album and “aeroplane…” contain in retrospective my favorite moments from them.

Yes! I went down a Pumpkins rabbit-hole in the last week after Bang Bang You're Dead... POLL In Your Head - ILM Artist Poll #87 - SMASHING PUMPKINS - Results was revived. In the 1990s, I had signed off from the Pumpkins in the wake of their Siamese Dream ubiquity. Just too many views of the Disarm video on MTV. When I was schooling myself for the poll though, Pisces Iscariot was a huge discovery for me and is probably my favorite after SD.

I could listen to "Whir" forever. Such a mature, vulnerable song.

Yes to Whir! One of their best songs. That one and Obscured are probably my two favorite cuts from the era. I like Corgan a lot in acoustic guitar mode with James (or is it Billy himself?) in electric guitar complimenting calmly with that beautiful tone.

Absolutely love how the results from the SP poll ended out. A lot of songs I love in the higher ranks, not a big emphasis on their singles - which

… I’m not a huge fan of except for a couple of them. The real juicy part of the pumpkin is not in their singles.

"Glynis," on Disc 2 of the deluxe ed., is such a cool song.

It's funny – and endearing, I guess – how the Pumpkins can be so corny/goofy/obvious, and then suddenly a song like that pops like...

*up

Ah, "Glynnis"...one of the little treasures housed on the No Alternative charity comp.

Otm. I'm always moved/suprised when it comes on. I find it so evocative of the time.

Try to Corgan form, though, the version on the Deluxe Edition box isn't the original.

Don't have it in front of me to a/b, but I recall (besides taking all the air out if the mix) it has added, louder, seemingly current/more nasal vocalizations from Corgan, and I recall more noodly soloing?