I HATE APPLE

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I've been using APPLE computers since 1985 and have never had a problem.

Orbit (Orbit), Sunday, 6 March 2005 21:02 (fifteen years ago) link

Exactly what Orbit said. And what Ed said regarding OSX--it's by far the best desktop OS, and nothing comes close.

My tech experience with Apple has been sensational. A friend called me today to tell me that his mini iPod was replaced in less than five business days, and he also got the new generation mini in place of his old one that had died. No charge.

I've dealt with Dell and Gateway and their CSRs are no better than Apple's. HPs can blow me, they've sucked.

don weiner, Sunday, 6 March 2005 23:22 (fifteen years ago) link

whoever has been using Apples since whenever and loves it can eat a dick.

the desktop I have at work running XP has been up and alive for 2 years with barely any reboots. It does everything I want it to do, does it quickly, and I can navigate painlessly without ever touching the mouse if I feel like it.

I was raised on Apple and my first job was DTP on a Mac, followed by audio editing on a Mac, more DTP, and so on. OS 7+ had more than its share of problems and stupid quirks but the hardware was rock solid and at least its behavior was predictable.

Since getting my latest-edition powerbook I've put it through little more than I ever tried to do with my old OS

TOMBOT, Monday, 14 March 2005 17:18 (fifteen years ago) link

Oh weird that post got completely chopped in half.

...OS

TOMBOT, Monday, 14 March 2005 17:21 (fifteen years ago) link

Fuck it.
Keeps mistaking the rest of my post for an HTML statement. Now it's lost to the ether. All computers are stupid and worthless, except that old LC & Quadra we had running 6.0.7 - 7.7, those were pretty stable builds as I recall.

My old Quadra used to have a TV Tuner in it and be able to do image captures from live cable broadcasts, then I could import them into my cheap, incredibly easy to use paint program and do whatever with them. I believe it cost approximately half of what my laptop did! My laptop lets me chat and surf the internet. And rip CDs.

TOMBOT, Monday, 14 March 2005 17:25 (fifteen years ago) link

HALCYON DAYS
http://oit.uta.edu/desktop/energystar/mac_files/OS_7_Control_Panels.JPG

TOMBOT, Monday, 14 March 2005 17:49 (fifteen years ago) link

In case anyone is wondering what this is all about, I have had "issues" with my laptop since purchasing it (A YEAR AGO, THINGS THAT COST $2000 SHOULDN'T DIE IN A YEAR), mainly that if I put it to sleep via either apple menu->sleep or by shutting the cover, I've got no better than a 50-50 chance the fucker will wake up again.

Well today it decided it wasn't going to wake up again, ever, as I'm being greeted with a totally white screen.

What's funny is that like doing searches on my own to try to figure out wtf this computer is doing right now (I mean not even the sad face x-eye Mac or the question mark Mac! NOTHING AT ALL! WHITE SCREEN! I know how to handle the other things!), everyone who is reporting similar issues to me is like bitching about how they have all this important blah blah blah they were doing with the Mac prior hand. Is it that no one who has this failure who is only using their Mac for chat, porn, and MP3s can be bothered to get in on the discussions, or is it because they don't die if that's all you use it for? Because yeah, it seems like my sleep problem increases tenfold whenever I've been using my iBook more for writing or photo work. If all I've done on the damn thing is use iChat for two weeks, no problems whatsoever with starting it up, back when it, uh, started up.

What does this imply??? Is there like some inherent instability in the majority of the "native" programs that come bundled with OSX or is this just really fucked up coincidence?

Also it seems that this particular issue with the iBook G3 was so bad they threw the whole "your warranty is expired, give us $500" shenanigans out the window, and searching on this same issue with "Powerbook" has not given me the same results--ARE IBOOKS PIECES OF SHIT? wtf?

Allyzay, Monday, 14 March 2005 17:59 (fifteen years ago) link

As an aside, I noted that my computer was purchased a year ago, actually a year and 3 weeks, making it out of warranty now. Every. Single. Computer. I. Have. Ever. Owned.* Has. Done. This. Do they design computers to die at warranty, in general? Because it is not just me who has reported this ridiculous situation going on, and I'm starting to think that if this is going to be the case, wasting my money on a pricey computer with only a single year warranty is not worth the hassle, since all other brands have 3-4 year standard warranties, so at least I'll get 3 years out of it, instead of 1, before this message will self-destruct.

*with the exception of my ancient PowerMac that I had when I was 14-15-16, which only died because my sister is a dick.

I am pretty close to deciding to become the female Punisher, except murdering computer firms, instead of bad guys.

Allyzay, Monday, 14 March 2005 18:02 (fifteen years ago) link

although the best customer service story I have ever been witness to was in an Apple store, when our friend J0sh had a bunch of seemingly sensible questions about using X type of Mac as a server, they made sense to the rest of us, and the sales guy just blurted at him "YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT"

And then kind of ran away????

That was pretty funny.

Allyzay, Monday, 14 March 2005 18:10 (fifteen years ago) link

I have a friend who just got a job repairing computers at Tekserve. He just started last week so I'm leery about hitting him up for favors, but the hitting up will be happening, oh yes it will. I would be happy to serve as an intermediate hitter-upper for your computer, Ally.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 14 March 2005 18:24 (fifteen years ago) link

I used to get the sleeping-no-wakey-wakey problem when I was using the last Photoshop build (pre-CS or whatever the newest is called) fairly heavily, but it fixed itself at some point. I have no idea what was going on or how/why it stopped happening.

milozauckerman (miloaukerman), Monday, 14 March 2005 18:41 (fifteen years ago) link

we just set up a netgear router modem! YfriggingAfriggingY!

nathalie barefoot in the head (stevie nixed), Monday, 14 March 2005 18:46 (fifteen years ago) link

I am looking over the system 7 window I posted up above and trying to figure out what they've improved since then! Help!

TOMBOT, Monday, 14 March 2005 18:47 (fifteen years ago) link

The graphics. If you have to ask, you're obv. a Windows person.

sunburned and snowblind (kenan), Monday, 14 March 2005 18:49 (fifteen years ago) link

graphics?

RJG (RJG), Monday, 14 March 2005 18:50 (fifteen years ago) link

I prefer the trash and HD icons in that window to the ones in OS X.

TOMBOT, Monday, 14 March 2005 18:54 (fifteen years ago) link

Tracer I would love your assistance but unfortunately I am currently in Washington DC, about 300 miles away from my last-ditch-savior-plan OSX disks (safe boot and fsck have already failed, for anyone interested) and probably the same distance away from Tekserve :(

If Apple store in Clarendon cannot do anything for me worthwhile like, I will be coming back up to NYC and hitting u up on the favor, though. I like desperately, desperately need this to work ASAP.

Graphics are nonsense; I had that system and just customized the entire thing with graphics of my choice. Of my choice, since I was like 14 at the time, was like a bunch of lame ass Monty Python cartoons and/or Madonna album covers but what the fuck ever.

Allyzay, Monday, 14 March 2005 19:06 (fifteen years ago) link

No, I know. It's a bullshit reason, but Appleheads go on and on about it. "The design!" I think design is great and all, but Apple is not the end-all, be-all of it. My XP desktop is way more customizable than this OS X desktop.

You know what else? This lamp-shaped iMac is stupid. There's no reason the screen needs to be this adjustable, and in fact with an LCD screen that has color-shifting problems, it's best if it doesn't move at all. It's only to make the computer more anthropomorphic, more... cute. So people will fall in love with the computer like it's a kitten. Crafty to the point of being kinda evil.

sunburned and snowblind (kenan), Monday, 14 March 2005 19:10 (fifteen years ago) link

If I'm supposed to relate to my computer as if its a kitten, Apple is doing a VERY VERY BAD JOB because I have never, in my life, wanted to punt a kitten out the window and then scream GOOOOAAAAAAAAL when it smashes a window across the street and subsequently busts into 10,000 pieces.

I have thought, on a few occasions, that OS7/8/9's desktop was more customizable than OSX's.

Maybe they are trying too hard to make things look pretty or cute and not spending enough time on making things sensible and working, anymore.

Allyzay, Monday, 14 March 2005 19:12 (fifteen years ago) link

Yeah, that would be the case, I think.

When I've been put off the G5 iMac as my next desktop computer because I hear too many stories about the power supply overheating thanks to them shoving everything in a thin white IKEA slab, it's time to reconsider the role "award-winning design" plays in your product development.

I kind of hate the OS X desktop. I have a menu bar, and a hard drive icon. I don't want a fucking DOCK, I never asked for a fucking DOCK, the whole rest of the computing world gets by without a DOCK. take that shit away and let me pick my own fonts. Dickholes.

TOMBOT, Monday, 14 March 2005 19:18 (fifteen years ago) link

uh is there any way to manually eject cds from an iBook.

allyzay, Monday, 14 March 2005 19:22 (fifteen years ago) link

This lamp-shaped iMac is stupid. There's no reason the screen needs to be this adjustable, and in fact with an LCD screen that has color-shifting problems, it's best if it doesn't move at all.

In an office where multiple people are using the same computer and there's limited desk space the lamp iMacs have been terrific.

Elvis Telecom (Chris Barrus), Monday, 14 March 2005 19:27 (fifteen years ago) link

uh is there any way to manually eject cds from an iBook.

Hold down the trackpad button on startup.

Elvis Telecom (Chris Barrus), Monday, 14 March 2005 19:28 (fifteen years ago) link

Thank you!

I will be at a loss forever, though, as to why pressing F12 (the eject button) worked to eject The Marriage of Maria Braun not ten minutes earlier, but refused to work just now.

Any suggestions on the other stuff, besides setting the thing on fire?

Allyzay, Monday, 14 March 2005 19:30 (fifteen years ago) link

I'd rather have crap graphics and cheesy icons than a bogged-down-prone OS that consumes copious amounts of memory.

massive xpost

Thermo Thinwall (Thermo Thinwall), Monday, 14 March 2005 19:33 (fifteen years ago) link

I use DragThing, I love it. I've got operating kind of like the OS8/9 pop-up folder windows.

Font management/selection/preview is atrocious in OS X. I got Suitcase but all that does is move fonts into and out of your Font folder, rather than you going and doing it yourself. Uh alright thanks I guess.

You know what I've never understood about computers? Why should anyone have to "save" anything, ever? Why isn't it just all on there all the time? I spent 3 hours working on some document, you tool, you think I don't want to "save" it? I mean really now.

xpost: you could try shooting it.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 14 March 2005 19:34 (fifteen years ago) link

I mean you've got a white screen what the hell else can you do? Aside from attaching it to a $25 external monitor, I mean.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 14 March 2005 19:37 (fifteen years ago) link

Any suggestions on the other stuff, besides setting the thing on fire?

Download Yasu, let it run everything.

Elvis Telecom (Chris Barrus), Monday, 14 March 2005 19:42 (fifteen years ago) link

My wife's iBook has the not-starting-up problem and only now seems to have a half-hour of battery power at full charge. meanwhile my powerbook is now a year old and looks and works like a dream.

just adam (nordicskilla), Monday, 14 March 2005 19:43 (fifteen years ago) link

A month or two ago I had a huge hard-on for a Powerbook. Now I'm starting to feel like I'd be just as well off with this sexy thing:

http://www.laptops4me.com/images/pict/SNY-TR3AP1_LG.jpg

sunburned and snowblind (kenan), Monday, 14 March 2005 19:47 (fifteen years ago) link

I don't like those. My friend Sh4hr14r has one and he just uses it to watch DVDs.

just adam (nordicskilla), Monday, 14 March 2005 19:48 (fifteen years ago) link

The speakers are in a logical place. This makes me happy.

sunburned and snowblind (kenan), Monday, 14 March 2005 19:51 (fifteen years ago) link

Downloading programs on computer that is dead?

And yeah, Tracer, I'm kind of hoping that this is a display issue somehow, not a computer-itself issue, but everything I'm reading indicates this is not the case. :(

Allyzay, Monday, 14 March 2005 20:18 (fifteen years ago) link

Downloading programs on computer that is dead?

I didn't notice the all-white screen hassle upthread. Did you try booting into open firmware and reseting the NVRAM?

(cmd-opt-o-f on bootup, then type "reset-nvram" "set-defaults" "reset-all" )

Elvis Telecom (Chris Barrus), Monday, 14 March 2005 20:29 (fifteen years ago) link

nuffink at all :( It won't do anything besides the white screen, no matter what I try to boot with.

so I can just walk into the apple store with this thing and someone will help me out?

Allyzay, Monday, 14 March 2005 20:54 (fifteen years ago) link

Walk into the Apple store with that thing and your checkbook.

sunburned and snowblind (kenan), Monday, 14 March 2005 20:56 (fifteen years ago) link

I would try that but seeing as most of the people at the Apple store will be salesfolx rather than techies, I don't know if that will help you (although talking about your issues in a really loud voice next to the iBook section while people are browsing for a new machine could work wonders for you).

The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Monday, 14 March 2005 20:57 (fifteen years ago) link

It seems like people have luck on the phone sometimes too, Momus is full of talk about how the Apple people give him all kinds of fixer-uppers out of warranty.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 14 March 2005 20:59 (fifteen years ago) link

Oh dear, I really want to make a completely mean-spirited joke about telephone fellatio but for some reason I feel bad doing so (so I'll just imply it and half-assed assuage my guilt, haha).

The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Monday, 14 March 2005 21:00 (fifteen years ago) link

"If you fix my computer I will allow you to receive my C on your Ts k thx."

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 14 March 2005 21:05 (fifteen years ago) link

The phone support lines really are about the fine art of oral persuasion. And like my mom says, if you get someone who's just not playing along with you, hang up and call back.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 14 March 2005 21:10 (fifteen years ago) link

ally, you could always did what i did with my last dvd player, just take it apart piece by piece until i could just life the dvd out of there, and then put it back together.

xpost

tracer otm. i often have totally differing degrees of success w/customer service if i just take a different approach.

Amateur(ist) (Amateur(ist)), Monday, 14 March 2005 21:15 (fifteen years ago) link

just LIFT the dvd out of there

Amateur(ist) (Amateur(ist)), Monday, 14 March 2005 21:16 (fifteen years ago) link

I do this all the time with tech support. Person number one and two maybe will give you the party line about how they don't support this or that, which really just means they don't know. But person three or four will be someone who knows exactly how to fix your problem, and will be happy to tell you how.

sunburned and snowblind (kenan), Monday, 14 March 2005 21:23 (fifteen years ago) link

I really really like the flat look of System 7, by the way. I just like flat graphics in general, from web pages to cartoons. Yay gifs, boo jpgs! Even as early as System 8 they'd started introducing this roundy shadowy stuff and I suppose it's alright, and it certainly looks "nice", but I find icons much harder to identify quickly, especially at a small size. It would be so awesome if there were a way to make OS X go to some "barebones" mode where all the icons were rendered as flat and actually iconic, rather than some photorealistic hoonja doonja. I know there are mods you can get, but rather than another layer of cruft on the top, it would be neat to have something deep into the system that could be got to (reawakened?) by scraping away all that aqua stuff. I mean honestly, opening and closing files, how glamorous does it need to be. Save the processing power and feathered edges for the actual filez d00dz.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 14 March 2005 21:33 (fifteen years ago) link

I mean honestly, opening and closing files, how glamorous does it need to be.

I like a little glitz. The trouble with OS X is that it's not likely to be *your* glitz, just theirs, which is arrogant on Apple's part (shockah!). Like Tom says, you can't even change the system font. I don't much care for Lucida Grande, but guess what? Apple likes it, so I get to stare at it every day for several hours.

I do want my desktop to be prtyy though, since I spend so much time there. It's like my apartment -- in a way it's even more personal. I mean honestly, cooking and watching TV and sleeping, how glamorous does it need to be?

sunburned and snowblind (kenan), Monday, 14 March 2005 21:40 (fifteen years ago) link

I don't want anti-aliased feathered semi-transparent pans if my food takes twice as long to cook!

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 14 March 2005 21:42 (fifteen years ago) link

Yeah. Which is why it's criminal that they sell people computers with OS X and 256Mb of RAM.

sunburned and snowblind (kenan), Monday, 14 March 2005 21:44 (fifteen years ago) link

Seriously, after doing all the updates, my system really has finally decided to slow way the fuck down and at this point it's a toss-up between going into debt for a new machine or just tossing the new system completely and going back to OS9. Which is something I actually could do, none of my main apps are OS X-only. Photoshop's still carbon, BBedit, Eudora, web browsing. I bet it'll feel like getting a brand new computer!

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 14 March 2005 21:45 (fifteen years ago) link

When I've been put off the G5 iMac as my next desktop computer because I hear too many stories about the power supply overheating thanks to them shoving everything in a thin white IKEA slab, it's time to reconsider the role "award-winning design" plays in your product development.

This is only for particular models. I looked it up before buying a G5. I don't have any problems (yet).

This lamp-shaped iMac is stupid. There's no reason the screen needs to be this adjustable, and in fact with an LCD screen that has color-shifting problems, it's best if it doesn't move at all.

Well, no, I don't think so. In fact I have a hard adapting to the non-moveable G5. :-(

nathalie barefoot in the head (stevie nixed), Monday, 14 March 2005 22:00 (fifteen years ago) link

I keep a TM backup and a separate "flat backup" (no time rollback) using rsync. It's a bit belt-and-braces but I have been burned oh so badly.

assert (MatthewK), Wednesday, 25 November 2020 02:13 (one week ago) link

I've been under the impression these days that the idea that you'll kill a drive by unplugging without unmounting is archaic. It was probably time for the drive to go anyway.

why do you unplug the drive anyway? I keep it plugged in but has just started using Time Machine Edit again to cause it back-up less often.

dan selzer, Wednesday, 25 November 2020 05:07 (one week ago) link

I unplugged it so I could take my laptop elsewhere. Also, I had the idea that by keeping it mostly unplugged/unmounted, I'd extend the life of the drive! Ha ha!

lukas, Wednesday, 25 November 2020 06:06 (one week ago) link

i finally realized yesterday that many of the new big sur features were driving me crazy and making me feel less productive. so i decided to put an hour into setting all of the various preferences so that my mbp would work how i remembered it working before i upgraded

and then i found myself on the apple support forums, going absolutely insane looking for "documentation". and no matter how much i looked, i couldn't find anything that explained in writing the specifics of how anything worked, what to expect when i picked each option, etc.

then, magically, i stumbled onto this: https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guidelines/macos/overview/whats-new-in-macos/

wow! finally i had found something that looks like the documentation that used to come with computers and software when i was first learning to use computers (30+ years ago)

so i guess what i'm wondering is when did basic documentation become specialized developer knowledge? has this been going on for a long time, or was there a discrete point at which people stopped bothering to explain how the things they sell work? did it start w/ apple (it must have, no?) and has it since infected the entire industry or is this just an apple-specific thing? how do young people figure things out nowadays? watching videos? trial and error? word of mouth?

i'll be honest, i stopped looking at OS documentation awhile back (probably in the early 2000s when i first switched from PC to mac?) and so when i finally started looking again for information on how stuff worked i was really surprised at how hard it was to find!

the late great, Wednesday, 25 November 2020 06:11 (one week ago) link

The end of documentation started with the beginning of modern computing - unix predates the first instance of the man page by two years. To operate a personal computer of any manufacture successfully you usually had to buy a thick book from a third party (I will never forget The Macintosh Bible, RIP). Programmers hate documentation a lot and everyone’s favorite bugaboo capitalism hates documentation even more, so here we are: people ask questions for free, get partial or useless answers for free, and the vendor has an intern close out the issue. Don’t grep readme

sound of scampo talk to me (El Tomboto), Wednesday, 25 November 2020 06:33 (one week ago) link

Watched a documentary tonight (GAMEMASTER, 2020) about making board games and there was some good discussion of how to write instructions - they have to be for children and old folks, they have to be redundant, they can’t be too clever or creative, and even your favorite version of your instructions will invariably confuse people unless you playtest the shit out of them. Good documentation is very, very hard to do.

I’m also reminded of an old Gamasutra article that quoted a videogame developer who pointed out that the existence of a significant third party market for strategy guides indicated a problem in the industry - that studios were reliably putting out things that were supposed to be fun, but basically required an extra guidebook to enjoy properly. Obviously this person had never heard of GameFAQs, but that just reinforces my point above: documentation is for user groups to make for themselves after the purchase.

sound of scampo talk to me (El Tomboto), Wednesday, 25 November 2020 06:46 (one week ago) link

people ask questions for free, get partial or useless answers for free

new borad description

the late great, Wednesday, 25 November 2020 06:49 (one week ago) link

Anyway it’s definitely not an Apple-specific problem because people have had blogs and blogs about this shit for Windows, plus geeky open source user groups out the wazoo since before HTML was even a thing.

sound of scampo talk to me (El Tomboto), Wednesday, 25 November 2020 06:53 (one week ago) link

I love man pages tbh, always mad when some hot new tool doesn’t ship with a man page.

is right unfortunately (silby), Wednesday, 25 November 2020 06:55 (one week ago) link

yeah that's interesting context re unix and a good reminder that most of the documentation for my early computers really was third party stuff now that i think abt it (practically had a half shelf of o'reilly books just for stuff bundled with the pc - "wordperfect in a nutshell" etc lmao)

the late great, Wednesday, 25 November 2020 07:00 (one week ago) link

stackexchange is the gamefaqs of work

sound of scampo talk to me (El Tomboto), Wednesday, 25 November 2020 07:00 (one week ago) link

aka word of mouth

the late great, Wednesday, 25 November 2020 07:02 (one week ago) link

Macintosh Bible 3rd Edition was the bomb. I read it to destruction before I even had a Mac

stet, Wednesday, 25 November 2020 10:05 (one week ago) link

Oh man, I just found out Arthur Naiman died last year.

stet, Wednesday, 25 November 2020 10:07 (one week ago) link

I know it’s beating a completely decomposed horse at this point, but fuck apple earbuds forever

brimstead, Thursday, 26 November 2020 18:56 (one week ago) link


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