Pixar to Disney: Drop Dead

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El Diablo is quite right -- the success of Spirited Away shows clearly enough that traditional animation can work wonders still. It's as far away from the now standardized 'quick-write-a-musical-with-funny-sidekicks-since-Broadway-is-now-a-NYC-thing-only-and-we-own-the-market' Disney approach as one can imagine, that film.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 31 January 2004 16:40 (twenty years ago) link

2D animation is fine by me.

Aja (aja), Saturday, 31 January 2004 16:41 (twenty years ago) link

I like both!

s1ocki (slutsky), Saturday, 31 January 2004 17:48 (twenty years ago) link

Well you're a freak. ;-)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 31 January 2004 17:49 (twenty years ago) link

No. Just confused, I think.

Aja (aja), Saturday, 31 January 2004 17:50 (twenty years ago) link

I was actually talking to Slocki but I can say that because he's Canadian. Wait, I love Canada, never mind.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 31 January 2004 17:51 (twenty years ago) link

I know. I was saying he was confused.

Aja (aja), Saturday, 31 January 2004 17:55 (twenty years ago) link

"the strange case of the man who liked both 2D and 3D animation"

s1ocki (slutsky), Saturday, 31 January 2004 18:00 (twenty years ago) link

Elementary.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 31 January 2004 18:06 (twenty years ago) link

How about 1D?

Aja (aja), Saturday, 31 January 2004 18:09 (twenty years ago) link

.

s1ocki (slutsky), Saturday, 31 January 2004 18:11 (twenty years ago) link

"The Dot & The Line" to thread.

Kingfish Funyun (Kingfish), Saturday, 31 January 2004 18:12 (twenty years ago) link

FUNYUN ROOLZ OK. I love both the book and cartoon version of that. Even if it's implicitly about how long-haired guys are lazy hippie beatniks, which is so not true.

*does nothing for an hour*

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 31 January 2004 18:15 (twenty years ago) link

El Diablo Robotico = smart! Stupid big trad animation studios ran themselves into the ground by being greedy bastards, and now they blame the art form. They shipped the work overseas for quick profit, and degraded it's quality and artist's wages, while paying astronomical money to the executives with MBA's who know jack about art or making good films. Then they blame the "traditional way" for being "too expensive," and pretend computers are "more competitive" by automating artist's jobs. When in fact trad and computer animation are totally seperate art forms, and good quality has the same expense for either one, because they can't replace artists with automation, they can only cheapen the product. Saying 2D animation has some sort of inherent problem or is "expensive" or has become "unpopular" is a lie from anti-worker executives who made it happen from greed. Success really comes from good stories and quality films not fads. They want you to buy their new substitute, but it's the same scam (they are already outsourcing the computer jobs.) i can't wait for holograph smell-o-vision!

sucka (sucka), Saturday, 31 January 2004 23:28 (twenty years ago) link

Where does claymation fit in here? (and anything alse not CGI/other appropriate computer animation term or cel animation). I don't think the medium matters in the slightest to most viewers, the thing that some people on this thread have had a problem with has been the plots of Disney films vs plots of Pixar ones.

Favourite myth about computer animation, as attempted in a badly edited end-of-the-evening-news report:

Animator Woman: Computer animation is so much quicker, I can just move this over here in a few seconds. If we'd been painting this film on cels, it would have taken months.
Narrator: In total, Finding Nemo took 6 years to make...

oscillatingocelot (oscillating ocelot), Sunday, 1 February 2004 00:05 (twenty years ago) link

Pixar obviously has better writers than Disney, although Joss Whedon is the only one I can think of, and he might have only done Toy Story.

Nick H (Nick H), Sunday, 1 February 2004 13:47 (twenty years ago) link

> I really prefer hand-drawn animation in every case I've seen

and i like the 3d modelling thing they do these days (everything machanical in Belleville for instance, Futurama's spaceships and buildings) where they 3d model various bits and incorporate them / make them look like more traditional 2d animation. without this things tend to change shape when going around corners and that always used to bug me.

> who, other than animation-heads, gives a crap about animated shorts oscars?

people who are interested in what'll win the animated feature award in a couple of years time? people interested in the new animation techniques that are coming through? the short is where people tend to try out things, it's a testing ground. and that's more interesting to me than, say, another jack nicholson movie 8)

andy

koogs (koogs), Sunday, 1 February 2004 15:00 (twenty years ago) link

one year passes...
http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/01/22/0739217

koogs (koogs), Monday, 23 January 2006 11:41 (eighteen years ago) link

Local planet gets renamed iWorld shock, Steve Jobs crowned owner of known universe. (iCosmos planned)

StanM (StanM), Monday, 23 January 2006 12:12 (eighteen years ago) link

Can't wait to see Mickey Mouse wearing an iPod.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 23 January 2006 15:16 (eighteen years ago) link

http://www.billpalmer.net/mickeyipod.jpg

RJG (RJG), Monday, 23 January 2006 15:18 (eighteen years ago) link

IT BEGINS

Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 23 January 2006 15:19 (eighteen years ago) link

and the Tomorrowland food court will STILL feature an all-polyester pop-up band of musicians performing disco medleys of The Starland Vocal Band, Captain & Tenille, and Olivia Newton-John!

Dom iNut (donut), Monday, 23 January 2006 19:55 (eighteen years ago) link

Now that disco is the new "hot" again, Tomorrowland can still be today's tomorrow!

Dom iNut (donut), Monday, 23 January 2006 19:56 (eighteen years ago) link

This is completely fuckin' hilarious. I doubt Gates' trousers are being shat with even a fraction of the force being brought to bear in Howard Stringer's at the moment. I give Eisner two months tops to clean out his desk.

TOMBOT, Monday, 23 January 2006 20:19 (eighteen years ago) link

This essentially means that all of the board at Disney told Michael to go fuck himself, the only reason the company's entertainment arm was still in the black is because of Jobs and they need him more than they need autonomy. This is so weird. This is mind-boggling.

From the man who brought you NeXT.

TOMBOT, Monday, 23 January 2006 20:22 (eighteen years ago) link

The Macrumors forums are funny. Some of them seem to be genuinely convinced that Jobs is on his way to controlling the world (his 6% of Disney means he will be personally in charge of EVERYTHING), and most of those are quite content with the idea.

Erick Dampier is better than Shaq (miloaukerman), Monday, 23 January 2006 20:26 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm glad nobody was around to point out that I'm an idiot with my head stuck in the sand for not knowing that Eisner was ALREADY out and had been replaced. WTF, I need to pay attention to one news.

TOMBOT, Monday, 23 January 2006 22:15 (eighteen years ago) link

If I'd checked in to this hotel a little earlier I would have done. (wasn't this month's Economist cover story prescient)

Tom, mail me at the below address. I can't find your email address in the archives.

Ed (dali), Monday, 23 January 2006 22:56 (eighteen years ago) link

one year passes...
was going to start a new thread for this but here will do.

here's a movie file of Pixar's 3D zoetrope (& i mean actually 3D not 3D CGI). pretty incredible.

http://www.navone.org/Media/Movies/ZoetropeLoop3.mov

i think this one is set up with a spinning base and a strobe light - not a traditional slotted drum.

jed_, Wednesday, 7 March 2007 02:46 (seventeen years ago) link

wtf, that is wild. so how does it work? for each position there is a different model and they rotate on a turntable w/strobe? I can't stop watching it.

walterkranz, Wednesday, 7 March 2007 05:36 (seventeen years ago) link

that was at the pixar exhibition in london last year, think i mentioned it here at the time. very nicely done.

(and yes, that's exactly how it works, 18 (iirc) different sets of models evenly spaced.)

koogs, Wednesday, 7 March 2007 08:07 (seventeen years ago) link

Mesmerising.

Ed, Wednesday, 7 March 2007 08:34 (seventeen years ago) link

the london one was slightly different. woody was missing but jessie was stood on a pile of alphabet block swinging her lasso up and down (on the white band behind buzz).

koogs, Wednesday, 7 March 2007 09:11 (seventeen years ago) link

one year passes...

Disney and Pixar: undrop dead. Though then there's this:

IN a subtle but important shift, Pixar has matured, allowing its strategic thinking to evolve inside a sprawling corporation. For instance, some of the studio’s executives once resisted sequels and direct-to-DVD efforts, arguing that quality and the brand could suffer. While sequels were not out of the question, they said Pixar’s hot streak hinged on pushing boundaries with original material.

But at Mr. Lasseter’s presentation in April, Disney’s first such event in 10 years, he announced “Cars 2,” a 2012 sequel that will take Lightning McQueen and his pals on a tour of foreign countries. Also in the works are four direct-to-DVD movies built around Tinker Bell.

“We are definitely planning on doing more sequels, just as we are more originals,” Mr. Lasseter said in an interview. “We talk with Bob Iger about which ones make sense to do from a business perspective. But each movie has to be absolutely great or you will snuff out a franchise.”

And the Pixar team, which also has oversight of Walt Disney Animation Studios and the DVD-focused DisneyToon Studios, decided that it was O.K. to outsource some direct-to-DVD animation to an Indian company, a departure from its rigid stance that outside animators could not deliver the necessary quality. (Mr. Lasseter will still closely monitor the efforts, however.)

Ned Raggett, Saturday, 31 May 2008 21:26 (fifteen years ago) link

Also:

In Disney’s case, Pixar was assigned the difficult task of turning around a storied animation department that had fallen into disrepair as it struggled to find its footing in a new world of computer-generated pictures. At a low point, the 2002 film “Treasure Planet” flopped so badly that Disney was forced to take a $98 million write-down.

A window into how the rebuilding effort is going will come on Nov. 26, with the release of “Bolt,” the tale of a Hollywood dog star who becomes lost in New York and has to make his way back to California. Mr. Lasseter and his team have heavily reworked the project, including playing up a wickedly funny side character, a hamster.

Ned Raggett, Saturday, 31 May 2008 21:28 (fifteen years ago) link

including playing up a wickedly funny side character, a hamster.

played by Jack Black, I suppose.

Rock Hardy, Saturday, 31 May 2008 21:40 (fifteen years ago) link

nope, but it does have miley cyrus and john travolta in it

abanana, Saturday, 31 May 2008 22:24 (fifteen years ago) link

I'm more of a Wallace and Grommit man.

Aimless, Sunday, 1 June 2008 00:33 (fifteen years ago) link

speaking of jack black... "skidoosh!"

msp, Sunday, 1 June 2008 01:25 (fifteen years ago) link

I love pixar but I couldn't make it past the first 10 minutes of Cars...

akm, Sunday, 1 June 2008 05:19 (fifteen years ago) link

i got high hopes for wall-e.

ledge, Sunday, 1 June 2008 09:19 (fifteen years ago) link

Why did they decide to make a sequel out of one of their poorer efforts? I mean, it is not like they don't have enough amazing movies that you really wish there was more of.

Jibe, Sunday, 1 June 2008 09:54 (fifteen years ago) link

I'm guessing it's for the money.

Noodle Vague, Sunday, 1 June 2008 14:24 (fifteen years ago) link

four years pass...

has anyone read the pixar touch? is it good?

markers, Sunday, 21 April 2013 17:15 (eleven years ago) link

http://www.amazon.com/Pixar-Touch-Vintage-David-Price/dp/0307278298/

markers, Sunday, 21 April 2013 17:15 (eleven years ago) link

two months pass...

So I guess Pixar's hand was forced to do sequels, but surely they could have come up with something more inspired than Monsters U.

Josh in Chicago, Sunday, 23 June 2013 00:29 (ten years ago) link

one year passes...

Pretty long article here
http://www.wired.com/2014/10/big-hero-6/
Thing I had to notice was that chart comparing Pixar to Disney film grosses - notice how Pixar's have gone down while Disney's have increased. Not coincidentally since Pixar has been doing lackluster sequels...

Nhex, Friday, 7 November 2014 17:31 (nine years ago) link

Didn't know about this:

But it wasn't all bad: While at Disney, Lasseter saw an early computer-animation test for Tron and it blew him away. “It was very simplistic, but a door opened up in my head and there was this incredible world beyond it,” he says. “I kept thinking, ‘This was what Walt was waiting for.’” Lasseter started an animation test—hand-drawn characters in computer-generated backgrounds—and began developing an idea for a computer-animated feature about forgotten appliances at a summer cabin waiting for their owner to return. Lasseter pitched the idea to the top brass. It was rejected. “The only reason we'd do computer animation,” Lasseter was told, “is if it was cheaper or faster.” Immediately after the meeting, he was summoned to the office of the manager of the animation department and told he was out of a job.

Lasseter was mortified. “My entire self-identity, even as a little kid, was based on this dream of working at Disney,” he says. “It just was so crushing to be fired from the place of your dreams.” He didn't tell anyone that he'd been let go—not even his wife, Nancy. Instead, he said that he'd quit to pursue computer animation. (It wasn't until Disney bought Pixar, more than 20 years later, that Lasseter finally admitted the truth.)

Nhex, Friday, 7 November 2014 17:33 (nine years ago) link

With Lasseter in charge of the entire animation division now, it seems like there's been a slow transformation of the main studio into the new Pixar.

I'm In The Mood To Munch! (Old Lunch), Friday, 7 November 2014 17:36 (nine years ago) link

I'm talking biology!

Pleeesiosaur (Leee), Monday, 1 August 2016 23:02 (seven years ago) link

I thought a kid tore one of his arms off?

Josh in Chicago, Monday, 1 August 2016 23:13 (seven years ago) link

two months pass...

The Good Dinosaur was a snooze. Weak characterizations, a poorly defined story universe and a disappointingly standard American Tail-style lost child narrative. And couple of lovely autumnal visuals towards the end notwithstanding, even the animation was barely better than average.

rhymes with "blondie blast" (cryptosicko), Friday, 14 October 2016 19:18 (seven years ago) link

yeah. worse than brave in my opinion.

Einstein, Kazanga, Sitar (abanana), Friday, 14 October 2016 22:34 (seven years ago) link

I couldn't get my kids to watch it when it was literally the only thing on TV. 50% of "Brave" is great, then it turns into My Mother the Bear.

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 14 October 2016 22:50 (seven years ago) link

that was the better half imo

Nhex, Friday, 14 October 2016 22:58 (seven years ago) link

my expectations for the good dinosaur were sufficiently low that i actually kinda liked it for what it was: a feature-length demo reel for pixar's amazing new digital grass and water effects

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 17 October 2016 06:42 (seven years ago) link

one month passes...

I thought "Moana" was great, easily one of the best looking Disney, etc. movies, sort of made me think of "Brave" if "Brave" was better.

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 25 November 2016 23:23 (seven years ago) link

Is this one Pixar or just Disney?

rhymes with "blondie blast" (cryptosicko), Saturday, 26 November 2016 00:06 (seven years ago) link

Disney.

Josh in Chicago, Saturday, 26 November 2016 00:11 (seven years ago) link

four years pass...

Is the new one Pixar or Disney? Doesn't really matter anymore, I guess. Anyway, "Encanto" was absolutely gorgeous. It was also perhaps more patient than most Disney animated films, and perhaps just slightly more cliche-averse. That said, I don't think it made much sense, and my daughter immediately thought of a better ending, but it's worth it for the bright colors alone. Also, caught the trailer for this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdKzUbAiswE

Looks like it could be fun.

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 24 November 2021 21:39 (two years ago) link

(Also some "Teen Wolf" vibes.)

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 24 November 2021 21:40 (two years ago) link

whole lotta dreamworks face in that trailer

When Young Sheldon began to rap (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 24 November 2021 23:07 (two years ago) link

trailer is manic af

more difficult than I look (Aimless), Wednesday, 24 November 2021 23:18 (two years ago) link

This is the one set in my old Toronto neighbourhood! Can't wait to see it. The short by the same director was a lot mellower, hopefully this was just trailer'd up

Chuck_Tatum, Wednesday, 24 November 2021 23:37 (two years ago) link

I literally lived opposite this house!

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FEZ0WZqWYAkpX6H?format=jpg

Chuck_Tatum, Wednesday, 24 November 2021 23:39 (two years ago) link


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