GIRLS talk (the Lena Dunham thread)

there is a guy they refer to as johnny drama

case closed

I like how Entourage, a show about four male buddies who would occasionally get into some trouble only for it to be resolved within 30 minutes by sheer luck/coincidence/absolutely no agency on their part at all, just in time for them to be in super expensive cars/jets/overlooking a city/by a pool with women and say "bros, we really made it", just sort of skates by with 7 seasons despite being a disgusting, 'aspirational', paen to shallow consumerism and idiotic misogyny, and somehow "Girls" gets picked apart after two episodes because it "should be better". That's less of a pointed criticism at Josh in Chicago than it is at the general tenor of internet blathering about this, btw.

Everyone should remember that it's perfectly cool if a show isn't your bag. That's totally fine. It doesn't make you a bad person to not be into this show.

I don't agree with JiC's specific complaints, but again, we're only two episodes in. I thought the first was pretty pilot-y in that it had to stretch credible human behaviour to set the larger plot in motion, which about 95% of pilots tend to do, as well as it having some sort of tonal missteps because they haven't quite figured out the show they're making, like 99.9% of all pilots do (hell, even Deadwood has some major disconnects in its pilot compared to the rest of the series).

As far as not serving a larger arc, there were clear narrative threads set up in the first episode that have been continued in the second episode: Hannah loses her job -> goes to a job interview in ep2. Marnie is dissatisfied with her loving, respectful, drip of a boyfriend -> continues to be in episode 2, and moves further into rationalizations about the guilt she feels for being just plain bored with him/meanwhile both contrasted with Hannah's relationship with Andy. Jessa turns up in episode 1, there are some tensions between her and Marnie, Jessa turns out to be pregnant -> Marnie tries to make a better impression on Jessa in ep 2 by setting up the abortion for the pregnancy which allows for Hannah to get an STD check to clear up her anxieties (even if they're misplaced) -> based on the teaser for ep3, the STD test plays a part.

And all of that is in 2 episodes.

Again, totally cool to NOT like a show about 24 year-old white girls in Brooklyn. This is the internet, after all, and a dislike of 24 year-old white girls in Brooklyn is basically its dilithium crystal. Still, I think trying to fob it off as a TV version of the kind of navel-gazing Joe Swanberg borefest mumblecore films like Alexander the Last is unfair.

man why am i spending time defending this show

sometimes, we look with a critical eye at the things we like and enjoy, because frankly, we are critical people and the stuff we do not like isn't even worth discussing

i found the last couple of seasons unwatchable. the season with the porn star in it was just risible. but s2-4 are kind of charming.

well entourage 'skated by' cause ilx types didn't really watch it that much

there were a few fairly active Entourage threads! but yeah it didn't get much close analysis because c'mon who the fuck is going to do that even if they like it

i tried entourage and found it to be, briefly, a guilty pleasure watch it rarely show
then i caught some random episode that was so fucking stupid that i never tried it again. it was during the aquaman storyline. when was that? second/third season?
another vote for veep; that had some very good moments.

I dunno I searched before posting that and they all have like 50 posts

aquaman season was the best! still stupid but def the show's peak.

well entourage 'skated by' cause ilx types didn't really watch it that much

yeah i'm not really talking about ilx here i guess

3-4 threads with 50 or so posts is exactly what i meant by "a few fairly active Entourage threads"

If I recall, Entourage was widely derided as basically a male Sex in the City, but Entourage's misogyny - not to mention its shallowness, materialism, et al. - was far worse than SatC's respective sins. Though I suppose Entourage was pure escapism - not a lot turning in that engine.

How many eps is Girls slated to have per season? Six? Eight? Ten?

Gukbe, you're right that there's a lot going on, but that's pretty typical for TV, no? The A story, B story, C story, etc. It's massively efficient at cramming stuff in. If anything, there's actually too much going on, which I read as a one of its contrivances. One thing I liked about Downton Abbey was that there were often several months that passed between episodes, so it got less bogged down in the minutia of linear storytelling and was able to bobble all its characters with broader, even more efficient strokes. That is, a lot happened, but it glossed over the quotidian in favor of the big picture.

the first season of Girls will have 10 episodes, so everyone get ready to post "I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU GUYS ARE TALKING ABOUT A SHOW WITH ONLY TEN EPISODES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" over and over in two months

I'd say it's typical for cable TV, yes, but I was specifically answering your criticism that it doesn't seem to be going anywhere and that it's hovering in a vacuum, when i found there to be clear narrative thrust and character arcs. Again, two episodes in and I think it's hard to know a "bigger picture" just now, but it's hardly like they're just throwing in random elements whenever just for a gag or 'to make a point', though I'm not really against them doing that either.

Downton Abbey is probably one of the worst offenders as far as contrivances that I've seen recently, tbh. I don't think the spacing apart makes the ridiculousness any more plausible (I like Downton, btw, even if only on the level of very pretty trash, and ignoring it's crazily offensive themes). A whole season of Deadwood might take place over the course of about three weeks, and Milch follows a one episode = one day rule.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fpW1thGues

Entourage didn't seem all that aspirational, they all kind of hated their lives.

wha?

Turtle was always busy trying to become who he was iirc

guess Ari did have some arguments with his hot wife

Downton Abbey is like the epitome of campy contrivance. But I liked how (season one) rolled out.

Entourage, iirc, was about meditative self-reflection and the push/pull of independence and autonomy vs. the promise of wealth and reward, complicated by the loss/confusion of self amidst the things we own and buy. It's totally existential, dude. It's also, like, post-feminist. Or something.

true enough. that time Drama and Turtle both took on that chick at sundance and 'crossed swords' was a deeply moving examination about sexuality and identity.

i was always v mystified re entourage, like it didnt have a plot

the anti-plots of drama trying to get a macguffin like "a trucker hat that will make me look younger" got pretty hilarious though

some guy i know from college wrote some pretty nasty sexist stuff about this show on my fb feed (and then used the racist twitter controversy as an excuse to dump on Lena and everyone involved in the show). i was gonna argue with him, but i just unfriended him. anyway, he constantly posts this annoying ra-ra Community posts so it wasn't a huge loss.

I have hated the girl who created the HBO series "Girls" the second I found out she existed. The revelation that she and everyone she knows are horrible racist only confirms what I have know for years: My snap judgements of people are almost always right.

i may have overreacted. idk.

there is never not a good reason to defriend somebody

the 2nd season of entourage was pretty entertaining.

Was that aquaman? I think I quit after that.

yeah, that was Aquaman. I think that season was followed up with the episode "Aquamom", an intense 30 minutes of high-pressure balancing acts when Vince had to try to get his mother on a plane to go to the Aquaman premiere with him...and he did.

Girls would should be better if the characters had clever nicknames like "drama" and "turtle"

why do you keep harping on that like anybody is actually saying "entourage roolz, girls droolz"

sorry, just have some irrational beef with entourage

mh drama

can my fiesta name be "beef"

I mean, my entourage name

to turn it back to Girls/girls, pop-culture watcher and girl Tavi has some important, interesting things to say about Girls and being a girl and representations of girls/women:
http://youtu.be/6osiBvQ-RRg

Tavi lives down the street from me...with her parents!!!! It's like a plot from Girls, but in high school. And, you know, she's successful and stuff.

ok

bright kid there

she is remarkable

was serious about everyone on Entourage hating their life - aside from the last-30-seconds deus ex machina, everyone on that show seems miserable. Loveless, aimless, addicted to drugs, etc..

I want to be cynical about a teen fashion blogger who gets people to invest in an online mag etc, but Tavi is pretty awesome

This thread has 1744 posts?!

hating your life doesn't mean it can't be interesting or that it can't be fulfilling in some ways

Man, I thought those bros had it all. Bummer.

*reconsiders priorities*

haha, funny AV Club question...

AVC: There’s a scene in the third episode of Girls where Hannah is sitting there and trying to compose a tweet and keeps deleting it because she’s not happy with what it says. It’s almost like voiceover or a musical number, where you can express emotions more directly and people will buy what’s going on.

LD: That’s such a great analogy, because it is. It’s like the moment in episode three, when Hannah tweets out her feelings about her gay boyfriend, her HPV. That was a moment when her Twitter allows her to really state her perspective on what’s just happened in the way that a facial expression would be more ambiguous. You’re totally right. That is its function....

http://www.avclub.com/articles/lena-dunham,69373/

I was definitely into personal blogs when I was younger.

Good interview.

She sounds like a nice, smart person.