does anyone hate themself?

I don't quite know if that makes sense on your computer screen the way it did in my head...

*smiles*

: ((((((((((((

so, geez... a person can't even be distinctive or familiar in THAT department?!?!?!

Pretty much my answer, though at my worst moments thinking of those faults and flaws is extremely self-eviscerating. I am learning to approach dealing with them (and improving them as I can) with more control, I hope. *MANY good thoughts* for everyone on this thread.

thanx ile!

Well, where are you right now, and what is the weather like? In DC it's raining, and my options are to stay at home alone or go out alone. These conditions tend to breed such thoughts in me.
:^P

I've had this weird and displaced feeling for several years that someone once told me was the "dark night of the soul" and told me to "be careful".... but, how can you "be careful" about your thoughts and feelings? I think the answer is not to cultivate these thoughts and turn them inward (fear --> displeasure --> hate and loathing ---> personality defined: hater).

There are weird mental tricks to changing your attitude, but you have to really not want to just give in (i.e. "FUCK IT ALL!")... and I guess you have to get really low or something to realize that something's got to give: either you or this attitude you're lugging around that you don't even WANT.

If you don't WANT it, why is it fucking THERE? You'll probably think "because life sucks" or "because I suck", but these attitudes are like little programs that you've learned to access when something "pushes your buttons". They're only there because you created them a long time ago to "make your life easier" so your brain could focus on new things it has to create autostart programs for (however, in this case, these negative programs are more like autostart viruses that continually corrupt new files until the whole system is infected).

You really are like a machine, you only are REALLY PAYING ATTENTION when you are FIRST learning something. Before you create a program called "driving the car", you can't really drive a car all that well unless you've been REALLY PAYING ATTENTION in your mind BEFORE you even started driving (creative visualization). But, after the initial effort is made to create a program called "driving the car", your brain simply launches the program every time you sit down in a car so that it can focus on new things. It's the same process with social situations and usually these reactionary programs are cemented in a person's youth, which is why having a solid family and great parents is an important part of being happy.

Of course, there are other reasons for utter and hopeless despair, such as tragic loss of income or death of a loved one, etc. The important part of getting over depression is treating it like anything else you have an avid interest in, LIKE WHEN YOU WANTED TO LEARN TO DRIVE A CAR, but you were only 15... creative visualization helped you figure out what to do before you even sat in front of the wheel. Or that damn video game you just have to beat: the different levels replay in your head until you've mastered and moved on to the next level.

If you're really in a rut and can't figure out how to get out of the maze, seek therapy or try meditation, look into a lot of self-help books and see if any one of them doesn't seem like a total waste of money on bullshit (most of them are). One thing I noticed right away is that music is basically hypnotism, so listening to songs that are pessimistic, whiny, angry or just damn sad is a bad idea. Same thing with artfully "enlightening" movies which are desperately sad and/or depraved states of the worst sort of human condition, often dressed up as "normal" to further underline the horror of it all... "damn, that movie was so GOOD! Life really is fucked up, man..." Sure, while you listen to some down-to-earth dude singing a soulful tune about despair that you can relate to so well, in your head you're thinking, "this is a listening experience and I can separate my reality from that of the dude on my stereo", but hypnosis and NLP is really all about controlling thought forms through focus and repetition. Music captures your full attention and you play songs over and over because they just "strike a chord in you" (not to mention they also typically have repeated musical phrases, verses and choruses) Meditation can help you to control your thought forms, along with focusing on the positive and ignoring the negative. A classic non-religious book on meditation that was put out by psychologists is called "The Relaxation Response" and it's a really cheap little book. Not a hell of a lot of information (you can find the important stuff on the internet), but I wouldn't feel comfortable recommending anything by "great spiritual teachers" to anyone.

For me, it really came to a simple point where I said, "I don't want to feel that way" and it was like I snapped (in a good sense) and everything changed. People have to try very hard in order to "push my buttons" these days. Usually, if I decide to get mad, it's exactly that: a decision under some control where I decide it's important to speak my mind and express my displeasure at an idea, while inside I'm almost as calm and cool as a couple of cold penguins.

Also, booze and smokes really do a number on me. I still enjoy the stuff, but it short circuits the self-control the next day if you're hungover and cigarettes put your body and mind out of balance.

Hope this helps and didn't sound preachy. I'm trying to help here, even if it all sounds as fucking obvious as Madonna's latest kick.

I was going to say yes to that, but instead I'll say no.

Andrew and Rainy you are the variety hour-era Sonny and Cher of ILE. xo.

it's very 'wrong', though. (but labeling it 'wrong' just reinforces/piles on the self-hate i guess) it's the same as hating others, except that ultimately, you can almost always do more damage to yourself, being that you're such a convenient target and all.

thinking that you are the 'worst' person in the world is as misguided and grandiose as thinking that you are the greatest.

i struggle all the time with figuring out how to properly appreciate myself, yea, even love myself. i suspect that Dr. Stuipd is on the right track & that the solution lies in what some might describe as learning to reprogram your mind with more positive thoughts...if you have a spiritual bent, then it's possible to utilize that to give you extra momentum in your efforts...for instance, if you make a habit of conceiving of/imagining/visualizing an unconditionally-loving, perfectly compassionate higher power of some sort, then you can use the resulting emotional energy that evokes to help boost your efforts. even if you think the 'higher power' is ultimately non-existent, it doesn't really matter, because the patterns ingrained in your mind which cause you to beat up on yourself are based on bullshit as well, if you take the time to analyze them. so why not use imaginary angels to defeat your imaginary demons? the magic lies in the fact that your mind can create any sort of bullshit it chooses to, and then will treat that bullshit as though it were solid truth. best to create 'good' bullshit. 'divine' bullshit, even.

yeah, & and accepting yourself as you are and accepting others as they are, probably go hand in hand, right?

"I hate myself, with good reason. I'm an alcoholic, unemployable, friendless, lazy piece of shit. But I think if I tried harder I could be excellent. I feel like an underachieving saint."

i think that is a beautiful post, for many reasons.

Oh, I thought you were coming on to me. Damn! Why does no one flirt with me around here?

but seriously folks...

I wouldn't say I hate myself so much... but, rather, I hate things I've said or done to people in moments of hot-headed indiscretion... the things that can't be forgotten or erased... THOSE are the things that get me everytime...
-- Scott Kos

That's the nail on my head, Scott. Maybe you could just leave out the "hot-headed" and just file it under indiscretion of any and all kind for me.

The other person is being a dick. Remind yourself that, for this one loser just here on ILX there are dozens of people who think you're swell. Don't let this person get to you.

Yes, it does. And to me it sounds like a fairish amount of what you are feeling is not so much depression as grief.

Depression is a hard thing to sort out. It can be caused by just plain chemical imbalances in your brain, in which case, no amount of 'perspective' is going to make you more hopeful. You will need a doctor to help you decide if you require some sort of anti-depressant drugs or similar therapy to climb out of that hole.

Depression can also be a temporary side effect of just coping with horrid situations. Luckily, this second sort is easier to wrestle with and ghet past. In this second circumstance the difference between sadness/grief and depression is that if you are feeling genuinely sad, then you are feeling something. This can tip over into depression when you start to supress and avoid feeling your grief, and you just go numb and stop feeling much of anything.

Usually, going numb in the face of grief or sadness is founded on one's sense that, either the grief is too big to face, or that if you stop to notice how you feel it will incapacitate you, or prevent you from carrying out your pressing responsibilities. This is a decent sort of coping skill, but it is hard to shut off. The "cure" is to make sure you identify, or set aside, times when you are allowed to feel like shit, to cry, to shake, to claw at your face, or whatever acts express your feelings most pungently.

Believe me, I know about this second kind of depression and it feels like an endless mountain of pain you are condemned to dig through. But, it is not endless, and the only real way forward is to go through. It is a hundred times easier to go through this if you have some emotional support from friends or family.

Good luck. Don't give up.

Would you like to go any farther with this? if you like to make yourself feel good by making a nasty, one line comment in reference to a long post, go right ahead. I hope your day was made brighter by being an asshole.

it can often be a good to think of how unfortunate we are even in the worst of times. It can help to give you some perspective.

I have a perverse genius for doing the wrong thing. Why shouldn't I hate myself?

Self-loathing and self-disgust seem to be more common than self-hatred. But then there's that whole, nasty thing about self-harming that I can't really wrap my head around, either.

I hate myself all of the time. It comes from growing up in a military family. Self-hatred prepares you for confrontation with thine enemy.

it's easy to be to weak to survive and too weak to kill yourself

@tree_bro
I feel like shit and i hate myself <-- CAN ANYBODY RELATE TO THIS??? ANYBODY/??? ON THE INTERNET?????

I hate who I am around certain people.

99% of my current anger issues come from the feeling that id like to kick my own ass

what is 1% from?

his ass

Lol

i wrote this down in a word document after a bad experience with w33d a couple years ago

our relationship with ourselves is unbearably, cloyingly close so of course it leads to resentment, even disgust. the solution is to focus on things outside the self but this can only be a distraction. in a deep, primordial sense i'm not sure people can ever really unproblematically love themselves the way they can love other people.

i'm not sure if i fully believe this anymore but i do know that i resent people who report liberating having liberating insights after taking drugs

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