no boys allowed in the room!!!!

these stories are breaking my heart!

Right on, hs!

:-)

I love your mother now!

Just from that story!

aw i sort of got tears in her eyes typing it tbh. she is lovely but i don't want to be talking about how gross i look when i'm in my 60s.

is it actually visible if you're wearing black tights?

I haven't worn black tights in years, but when it got really, really lush on my legs the hairs tended to stick out a little. But I doubt this is a problem for you.

loooool tears in my eyes jesus

Aw, that story is great. :)

I agree.

I got all verklempt reading it too, don't worry. I can picture your mom perfectly now and I have no idea what she even looks like.

another thing to say about that is my mom was berating herself because her body had changed since she was, you know, 25. and i find myself doing the same thing and it's like, bodies change, you know?

you know you know you know

Yeah, I've aired this on ilx before, in bits and pieces, but my mom does exactly the same thing, and having witnessed that for the last 30 years, I remind myself to extend myself the same outrage I felt for her when she did it in my hearing.

this is kind of off-topic, but when my parents came out to the US last year, we picked them up from the airport and on the way home my dad said to my husband "you've put on a bit of weight since we last saw you". i was FURIOUS - like, it's not ok to say that to my husband just bc he's male, my dad would never in a million years say that to me about my weight.

also kind of off topic: the last time i was this heavy, i was in a very bad situation in my life, a very terrible and degrading relationship, everything was shit. now i'm v v happy, and in an amazing relationship, but this weight reminds me of that other time... i don't really know how to articulate this but it really bothers me in a related but separate way to the general i-hate-my-body feelings.

My mom's got all these unresolved health problems, maybe lupus or something (some doctors think), but she's also been in a lot of car accidents lately and maybe it's neurological stuff. They don't know. She's got a banging R. Crumb girl kind of build that I inherited and these health issues have meant she's progressively losing a lot of weight for reasons no one can really figure out.

I should also note she's one of the hardest-working, volunteeringest, most self-extending ladies at her church (and there is stiff fucking competition in the world of Mormon women). She does a lot of unrequited good for a lot of people, and she's so kind and chill about all of it. But it's losing all this weight that finally earned her praise and attention and congratulations from both the women and men in her church. I was both relieved and fucking apoplectic to hear her say that it's the only thing that will earn women in her position any praise, that it's the only area of self-improvement people will recognize. Like, how cool that she's self-aware that that's bullshit, but how sad that that's the case. You have to look at the 99+% of the good things you are doing in life that have nothing to do with your waistline even if a lot of parts of society sometimes refuse to validate them.

I can't catch up, so

I hate pants too. All my skinny coworkers wear tight black pants and I love the look but I have to choose between tight around the thighs and my stomach or loose, I invariably choose loose and feel like a dumpy loser. Pants are my Depressed Clothes.

Viva les skirts. I have been wearing them and dresses 95% of the time (scarily, winter approaches..) and I have recently become addicted to Spanx as well..they were uncomfortable at first but they really give me back the beautiful shape my body has before I put clothes on it (I'm squishy, so there's always bra/waist/underwear lines) and erase all the bumpiness and it has been making me feel SO much better about having 50 pounds on most of my coworkers!

ugh that shit makes me crazy Abbott i'm sorry your mom is dealing with people being idiots on top of worrisome weight loss.

You guys, Jenny was otm about this w/r/t relationships, and I think about it all the time since she put it into words, it's pretty damn obvious I guess, but...we have to make a new way, you know? For ourselves as we age and change and get crone-ier in all ways. We can do better. We have each other, first of all, and this conversation and a thousand more like it, it feels like a richness right now and I just know we can make something out of it.

I wear a waist whittler every day myself (one from Hanes), and it does make a difference.

You guys, Jenny was otm about this w/r/t relationships, and I think about it all the time since she put it into words, it's pretty damn obvious I guess, but...we have to make a new way, you know? For ourselves as we age and change and get crone-ier in all ways. We can do better. We have each other, first of all, and this conversation and a thousand more like it, it feels like a richness right now and I just know we can make something out of it.

― It means why you gotta be a montague? (Laurel), Thursday, November 10, 2011 10:15 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark

yes, this is what i want! hear, hear!

:-) :-)

and there is stiff fucking competition in the world of Mormon women

omg, so true! where i grew up, there was a sizeable Mormon population, and they were heavily involved in the community music and theater programs - they made _my_ mom feel lazy! And my mom, when i was growing up, worked 65-70 hour weeks, plus catered parties for my grandparents' numerous social functions, and cooked and cleaned for me and my dad.

yeah one of many reasons I'm not Mormon anymore, I like saying no

Church women are something else. I think Mormons might have that cornered, but I think Swedes could give them a run for their money!

there's also serious peer pressure among Mormon matrons!

It's not for nothing that there's a book for women called When I Say No, I Feel Guilty.

She does a lot of unrequited good for a lot of people, and she's so kind and chill about all of it. But it's losing all this weight that finally earned her praise and attention and congratulations from both the women and men in her church . . . I was both relieved and fucking apoplectic to hear her say that it's the only thing that will earn women in her position any praise, that it's the only area of self-improvement people will recognize. Like, how cool that she's self-aware that that's bullshit, but how sad that that's the case. You have to look at the 99+% of the good things you are doing in life that have nothing to do with your waistline even if a lot of parts of society sometimes refuse to validate them.

This is so fucking otm it's not even funny. It speaks to what I was talking about earlier.

Big things I have done in my life:

Played 2nd chair 1st violin in a youth symphony
Graduated college
Moved to a city I'd never been to with just the stuff in my car and made it on my own
Moved to another country
Volunteered for various places and youth organizations
Gotten married
Cared for my sick mom a lot
Gone to graduate school and graduated with my MA and a 3.8 GPA

You know what people praised and gave me all sorts of weird attention for than all those things combined?

Losing 30 fucking pounds and getting down to a size 8/10.

I'm not sure gotten is a word and am pretty sure got would have sufficed there but you know.

Erica that is an amazing CV of awesome. Your actions make you a total hero to me! You have such a good heart and you're so strong, that's the most important thing.

You're always 1000% the most sensible person about women's health/repro issues, it's so fucking smart and refreshing, and it's because of all this personal & intellectual effort you've done. I mean when you're on your death bed that's the kind of shit that'll carry you through, I think, not "at least I'm not a size 16 anymore."

otm and otm

that is another thing that helps me when my brain gets crazy on me about this stuff. to think, i don't value people because they have the "willpower" to lose x amount of weight. the things i value are different.

the last time i was a size 16, i was pretty thrilled about it tbh

Gotten is a word, actually.

You also quit smoking, Erica!!! So many things not on that list I am sure you can give yourself credit on.

x-post Aw, thanks guys. You're totally right Abs about what I'll realize is most important. The things I listed are all way more important to me in the whole scheme of things and what ppl seem to put importance on is so completely ass-backwards. I'm just angry that I've spent so much time and energy on it all for the last 30 some odd years. That any of us have, really.

BULLSHIT.

lol Abs - I mostly quit. Still allowing myself to bum when drinking which is usually about once maybe twice a week and rarely amounts to more than 5 total. I'm OK with that because it's a lot better than a pack a day but I feel like I'm cheating saying I quit since i didn't do so entirely.

also you are all wonderful

and thank you - I feel better for having ranted and for the support.

<3

Ha I might have secretly started socially smoking, too.
I was seriously all ready to start again in March – 2 packs a day again because I was "thin" when I was smoking that much. Well how fucked up is that that a big part of me thought it would be wise to put fucking proven carcinogens into my body and not breathe well anymore and feel like an uncleaned bbq grill all the time in the idea of some potential of looking like a starving depressio again. Goddamn.

Also when I was smoking that much I was super poor and not spending money on FOOD and had not even a bicycle, getting everywhere by foot, so it wasn't just smoking that got me there, it was being at a personal nadir.

YMMV of course!!

yeah, take it from me, it is totally possible to smoke 2 packs a day and be a fatty.

Yeah. It's so fucked up but fear of gaining weight is def part of why it took me so long to even cut back this much. :/

there are so many fucked up emotional and self-image reasons why i haven't quit smoking ... i just don't even ...

I actually don't get how you can smoke 2 packs a day at all. I guess I probably have once or twice if that day also included a night out with booze. That's a lot of smoking though! Not nearly as bad as the old pres of BU who smoked 5 packs a day. How do you fit 100 cigarettes into 24 hours? HOW???

x-post - oh I very very strongly identified as a smoker and just couldn't imagine myself as someone who didn't smoke which is weird because ppl who don't know I smoke often find it strange to find out I do. Seeing myself as a non-smoker is really odd and prob part of the reason I keep allowing myself the social ones.

what's amazing to me is how people who do this stuff leave hobo marks on your psyche that other abusive people can immediately read.

― estela, Thursday, November 10, 2011 9:22 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark

i missed this before and it is so true! and brilliant! y'all are amazing.

^^^