Guns n Roses: Critical Rehab

That book is going to be so awesome.

i'd feel kind of ridiculous reading ANOTHER gnr book after the slash memoir and the uyi 33 1/3 but duff is a capable writer and most likely the most sane/trustworthy guy out of the band so i am down for that

I still have no interest in hearing UYI but is the 33.3 well-written and juicy enough about the band dynamics, rather than the songs, to shell out for?

it is a great and very entertaining book but it's very much about the album and that period in the band's history, so i'm not sure why you'd even ask whether you should read a book about an album you don't want to ever listen to (although the author himself amusingly doesn't go back and re-listen to UYI until the last chapter)

i mean there are now memoirs by 3 different ex-members of the band if you're into juicy inside scoops

the UYI book is excellent, especially for (a) context (explaining how it works alongside the before-the-revolution moment of fall '91) (b) debunking the Izzy Stradlin worship.

haha the anti-izzy bent of the book pissed me off so much

btw this thread has one of the worst premises in the history of ILM, fucking shameful

so i'm not sure why you'd even ask whether you should read a book about an album you don't want to ever listen to

'cos a bunch of the ones that I do have are more about the artist in general, or that period of their career, rather than a documentary of the recording, or a critical analysis of the songs. so I was asking if this happened to be one of the former. because I know they exist. based on having bought and read them. (at least two of the series are actually novellas that don't require even knowing that the album exists before reading. and the one of those I've bought [by the shameful OP btw lol] is the second-best 33.3 that I've read.)

I also have the Celine Dion one, and though it's been on the shelf waiting for 18 months, I don't plan to buy and listen to the album before I get around to it.

man I <3 Eric W. to bits but I had major problems with the UYI 33.3

such as? (i'm curious -- like i said i enjoyed it but there were definitely parts that pissed me off too)

a bunch of the ones that I do have are more about the artist in general, or that period of their career, rather than a documentary of the recording, or a critical analysis of the songs. so I was asking if this happened to be one of the former.

it's more the former than the latter. but much more about the band's place in the music industry/pop culture at the time and the axl cult of personality than band dynamics juice.

Is the Slash book any good? Because frankly, between him, Adler and Duff, Duff is the only one that seems to possess a modicum of modesty, a firm grasp of history and a penchant for introspection. He's totally the John Taylor of the group.

you're probably right about duff (which is why i will prob read it) but the Slash one is a pretty good read -- i'm sure the co-writer smoothed it over a lot but he kind of has a good dry sense of humor about some of the crazier stories and of course there are some pretty crazy stories. also slash has a pretty interesting life story beyond just the gnr stuff.

such as? (i'm curious -- like i said i enjoyed it but there were definitely parts that pissed me off too)

I would just have strongly preferred to have been reading about it from the perspective of somebody who loves GnR & will rep for their music. I like Carl's book on Celine even though he's not nuts about her music, but with GnR, the whole "I wouldn't normally listen to this" schtick just rankled me a lot. like, even though GnR were massive, they still to a certain extent represent a subculture, for better or worse. I don't want to hear the take of somebody who has no investment in that culture; the story doesn't have to be told by a fan, but I think for it to be told by a person who doesn't even like that kind of music is invariably going to leave out one of the most important parts of the story.

It's weird I mean I'm kinda defensive of this band even though I think their music is vastly overrated by the exact same people whose voices I'd prefer to hear if we're talking about it

aero, do you think "Appetite" is vastly overrated? Because I'm with you on "UYI" (obv.), but that first album is zeitgeist in the a bottle. Or something.

he's definitely irreverent about GNR in the book but to me it didn't come across as dismissive or superior -- UYI is more fun to talk about if you acknowledge its flaws and ridiculousness from the start, and if you're not constantly saying Appetite was the greatest thing ever and comparing it to that. also i didn't get a "i wouldn't normally listen to this" sense, if anything it was that he'd listened to it so much in the '90s that he could actually write the majority of the book from memory w/o relistening to it.

btw i apologize if my platform itt has become 'i will read any and all books about guns n roses and so should you'

i'll pass on adler's, though, it was depressing enough seeing him on celebrity rehab

wait doesn't he explicitly say he's never listened to the albums before writing the book?

no, he was definitely very familiar w/ the albums beforehand but only listened to them again while writing the last chapter.

if it WAS a total intellectual exercise of "let's see how much i can write 'about' an album without engaging with the album on any level" like the Celine book that would be total bullshit but don't even get me started on that

What's the gist with the UYI book and Izzy or his role in GNR?

mainly he just hates on all the songs w/ Izzy writing credits and thinks his Stones vibe was unwelcome

btw for your edification my 3 favorite things i learned from the Slash book: 1) he was given the nickname Slash by actor Seymour Cassel, 2) he was really disappointed when he met Alice Cooper and found out that Alice just used snakes as stage props and wasn't super into them like he was, 3) he owned a mountain lion named Curtis.

yeah, sorry, aero, I never got the impression that Weisbard was holding his nose.

also i get what you're saying about them being a subcult band to some extent but any sunset strip sleaze metal band that could also be a 10 year old suburban pennsylvania nerd's favorite band has graduated to the arena where a multiplicity of takes is probably not just appropriate but should be encouraged.

fyi I used to buy frogs scorpions etc at the same store in Lakewood where Slash got his snakes

the Frogs, Scorpions Et Cetera on Del Amo Boulevard!?!? get right outta town. do you know if Howard is still the manager over there?

I used to buy frogs scorpions etc at the same store in Lakewood where Slash got his snakes

The first sentence of the third chapter of your memoir.

frogbs, scorpions, etc

looking forward to the "steven tyler's frogpit" solo album btw

definitely wanna read the duff book, and i've stayed away from the other two autobios even though i used to be a diehard gunshead. i haven't read the UYI book but i think i'd like it -- while i have feelings of affection for the music and the group, i'm as critical/mocking of their flaws as anyone.

i watched the live stream of this year's rock in rio (w/ axl + "new" guns). interesting experience. following the hashtags was also a telling experience.

(the hashtaggers were particularly critical about axl's weight gain. i didn't think he looked too bad for a guy about to turn 50.)

The first sentence of the third chapter of your memoir.

actually it's my entire memoir, sorta jumped the gun by posting it here

the Frogs, Scorpions Et Cetera on Del Amo Boulevard!?!? get right outta town. do you know if Howard is still the manager over there?

no loyd's pets and reptiles. now closed evidently but it was the best place if frogs scorpions etc were yr deal

Loyd's are a bunch of fucking bums, Howard just told me to post

At the time Weisbard surprised me by not relating the story of Axl, after sending champagne and roses, showed up backstage at a Pet Shop Boys show in 1991.

He proceeds to rave about the show -- "that was so cool, `My October Symphony,' when tye dont' even sing" -- and say that liking them is becoming a shared secret in the world. "I phone dup the singer of Nine Inch Nails and I said "'What's that you're listening to?" and he said, "'Oh, er, it's the Pet Shop boys.'" He tells me he plays Behaviour in the car and his friends say, 'What are you trying to make me like NOW...?"

Then he tells me that there's something in common between "My October Symphony" and this song he's struggling with in the studio at the moment, a song called "November Rain."

Howard is bummed that Slash didn't recognize him when he came in for feeder mice

is it overreaching to make a "thing" of how many gay artists axl is a huge fan of (psb, freddie mercury, elton john)? i remember an interview where he said his classmates in the '70s made fun of him for liking the stones because they were "considered fags" at that point.

i tend to think that whole "i'm ineruditely homophobic yet deeply enamoured and respectful of gay icons like elton john and freddy mercury" is just a fragment of a broader dichotomy that sums up w. axl rose. i mean, the guy is inscrutable and ridiculous on just about every front.

He's an outsider just like them

Or was when he stepped off the Greyhound

i mean, the guy is inscrutable and ridiculous on just about every front.

well, yes, but.

to me there's always been a sense of axl diffusing his introspecive, thoughtful side ("estranged", "november rain") with a more small-minded, belligerent approach ("one in a million", "back off bitch"). i also sense a bit of a running theme throughout the cavalier illusion records of a "small town white boy" trying to reconcile himself with the opportunistic and complex world that fame and rock stardom brings.

and of course you also hear the byproducts of fame and rock stardom on those albums, ie. a right-of-way to channel inner thoughts and insecurities in a bloated and self-important manner.

i think the mystery of axl stems from his curious ability to offset his predominantly selfish and reckless personality with atypical bouts of tenderness and complex thinking.

my favorite bit of trivia about Axl is that one of his favorite songs to get 'fired up' to was WASP's "I Wanna Be Somebody". But I think that Axl is looooooong gone.

Hmm, where to put this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XUKRZGVW6Q

In which Axl reveals that the original cover of "Appetite" was intended to be a photograph of the Challenger explosion (!!!!!!).

So it went from Challenger explosion -> robot rape scene -> awesome skull cross?