how to land your kid in therapy

tbf tho the Last Psychiastrist was explicitly referring to situations where the child has hurt him/herself and yeah not comforting them in that situation seems like a dick move, to me...?

ha, the atlantic article has become a bit of a running joke betw. my wife and I now -- especially the excessive praise stuff. made us realize how much we praise our kid for the most mundane things -- "great job walking!" "great job sleeping!" "great job holding my hand!" not realllly freaked out about it though.

Last Psycho (lol) does a good job of taking on the author without resorting to misogyny, & I dunno the gender of the blog author, but the article is def talking about mothering, not just parenting, & I think that's kinda important to this.

man I recently got together with some friends who completely have grown to hate each other and will be together always and boy do I feel bad for their kid

eek

kids need praise by their parents, don't think that's very controversial

this whole thing is pretty adjacent to/overlapping with the tiger mother thing isn't it

friends who completely have grown to hate each other and will be together always

uh, how does this work exactly?

yeah re. tiger mother (rawr)...kinda want a mom's perspective on this but tbh my wife's too busy parenting to read articles like this, leave that to me the deadbeat dad on ILX.

It's all just some stupid "I think I know what's wrong the kids now and here is my five point plan to make my kid different" bullshit.

It goes along with "I think I know why people are fat now and here is my five point exercise/diet program to make them less fat" bullshit.

well the same author has written an entire book about her anorexia so that article may be coming

That's probably step five.

friends who completely have grown to hate each other and will be together always

uh, how does this work exactly?

― satisfying punishment for that thing he said about lesbians (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, August 24, 2011 9:54 AM (11 minutes ago) Bookmark

just seems, to me, an observer, like they'll prob never get divorced

tbf tho the Last Psychiastrist was explicitly referring to situations where the child has hurt him/herself and yeah not comforting them in that situation seems like a dick move, to me...?

which is not what the Atlantic article was talking about:

Consider a toddler who’s running in the park and trips on a rock, Bohn says. Some parents swoop in immediately, pick up the toddler, and comfort her in that moment of shock, before she even starts crying. But, Bohn explains, this actually prevents her from feeling secure—not just on the playground, but in life. If you don’t let her experience that momentary confusion, give her the space to figure out what just happened (Oh, I tripped), and then briefly let her grapple with the frustration of having fallen and perhaps even try to pick herself up, she has no idea what discomfort feels like, and will have no framework for how to recover when she feels discomfort later in life.

Gottlieb is talking about parents swooping in to rescue a kid who is not hurt and isn't even crying. Last Psycho twists that into a parent ignoring a bleeding kid, and then talks about hitting a kid with a hammer to toughen them up... lame.

why does the article title make therapy seem like a bad thing

I've never been in therapy and physically recoil when people I know just openly talk about their therapist outta nowhere, but I try to think that I don't think it's a bad thing at all

what makes you so special that you don't need some of that great therapy?

I have the internet

Well let me give you my five point plan for avoiding therapy...

#1 Don't read the Atlantic.

lol

I fully admit to having some deep-seated bias against therapies/the industry of psychotherapy

theraPISTS

Gottlieb is talking about parents swooping in to rescue a kid who is not hurt and isn't even crying. Last Psycho twists that into a parent ignoring a bleeding kid, and then talks about hitting a kid with a hammer to toughen them up... lame.

yeah fair point.

"I fully admit to having some deep-seated bias against therapies/the industry of psychotherapy"

IT IS THE INDUSTRY OF DEATH <L Ron Hubbard>

fuckin psyclos

Scientologists or Psychiatrists? Or both?

http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/images/atlantic%20warning.jpg

cmon this is classic

Scientologists or Psychiatrists? Or both?

c'mon dude that was a Battlefield Earth joek!

Haha and I don't remember enough that silly movie to get it. Oh shame.

If you don’t let her experience that momentary confusion, give her the space to figure out what just happened (Oh, I tripped), and then briefly let her grapple with the frustration of having fallen and perhaps even try to pick herself up, she has no idea what discomfort feels like, and will have no framework for how to recover when she feels discomfort later in life.

i'm sorry but this is just... ridiculous. kids go through moments of pain and frustration and confusion EVERY DAY. the idea that through over-attentive parenting your child will have "no idea what discomfort feels like" is just..... kerrrrazy. as a purely basic example, every child has to learn how to comfort themselves to go to sleep. and every parent has to learn to allow them to learn this, other wise that parent will go mad.

i think it is sort of interesting that she talks about "therapy" like it's this awful fate when she herself had a therapist, not even as an adult, but as a child growing up.

i mean sure, i am broadly on board with the idea that parents need to give their kids some space to figure things out for themselves. but who isn't?

I've known a few who weren't, but they're pretty rare. And their kids are messed up.

Actually they claimed to be on board with it, but were too neurotic themselves to put it into practice.

yeah i was about to say almost all parents would probably agree with giving their kid space, but either don't have the will to do it or just end up trying to solve/assuage/soothe all their kids' problems almost absentmindedly.

There's more to "letting your kids have some things be hard/unpleasant" than letting them cry to themselves at various times of their infancy. The article, stupid to start with in a great many places, misses what modest targets it COULD have hit by not even touching larger issues throughout childhood & adolescence.

Liiiike making kids do things they don't like because it's "good for them" or because it "builds character" or what-have-you. Letting them get bored so they, in desperation, come up with things to do on their own. Making them work really hard at something so they know how it feels to be exhausted. I don't know. (Luckily I'm not a parent.) Just the basic things that happen when you don't have a million dollars or a personal commitment to buy/give your kids the "best everything" so they can outshine their peers starting in 8th grade and get into a good college and go to law school and achieve whatever passes for success these days, I might not have kept up with that so I'm not sure.

I stopped reading the Atlantic when Caitlin Flanagan started showing up more and more. She was making me so angry that I had to stop reading it and then I never went back.

it's like how a zero-tolerance policy toward bullying might interrupt or even "stop" bullying, but won't teach a kid what to think of being bullied.

lori gottlieb is sort of nu-caitlin flanagan tbh

horrible! that is a guaranteed way to get me not to read something. only thing worse would be "this is endorsed by dick cheney" or w/e

dick cheney would definitely not pick up a crying child

It's probably crying because he stole it from its mommy, only gave it bottlecaps and some dead twigs to play with, and told it to go sit in a hallway where he can conveniently kick it as he strides by.

So rather than starting a grave-sounding new thread I figured I'd post to this one (it was this or "are you a good father" lol). Hi everybody it is your boy underrated a, new dad of three weeks. Going through all the stuff a lot of I Love Parenting people already know about, the sleeplessness and the glory, most amazing time of my life ever, never felt so in love, never been so tired as some of these days, etc.

One thing you may not know about me is that I'm a "hypochondriac," although I don't consider my hypervigilance around catching a cold hypochondria actually: if I get sick it fucks up my whole deal because I need 100% of my voice for my work. having been sick at work many times, I've become, over time, the kind of person who avoids shaking hands when possible, declines parties and dinners because people won't let me know if I need to give them a wide berth in order to not catch their cold (or: they'll take the opportunity to share folk remedies for colds with me, don't get me started), etc., I am a tiresome motherfucker in my pursuit of not getting sick.

tonight my sister-in-law arrived from out of state for a weeklong visit. guess who got a cold yesterday and didn't cancel her trip to visit her family with the newborn? RRRRRAAAAAAAGGGGGGGEEEEEE

my son and I are presently sequestered upstairs in the bedroom and neither one of us are leaving until the visitor has been sniffle-free for at least 12 hours.

any parents who got some "my newborn caught a cold & it was total Hell for several days but he/she is fine so the only big deal was what a drag it was" stories would be GREATLY appreciated by me, because while I am practicing as severe preventative medicine as I can over the next few days, viruses gonna virus sometimes so best-case-scenario stories will help me keep it as positive as a guy like me can be reasonably expected to keep it

The general feeling when our 23-year-old was a 23-day-old was not to suddenly become neatniks or germophobes, because that just wasn't us. Fortunately, Sarah was a few months old before her first snot-everywhere cold*, and I would be doing the same thing you're doing if somebody with a cold visited this soon. In general though, I think you'll have a healthier kid if you let him and germs get acquainted at a young age, even if you occasionally take a little collateral damage yourself. It's a tough situation -- you can't afford the exposure, but the bebeh needs a bit of exposure.

*the time to "we'll look back on this someday and laugh" was just a couple of weeks

oh shit aero. Yeah. When my girl was born last year, my wife - who is extravigilant about such things not as a hypochondriac but as a medical lab tech who fully understands about fucking germs - did her best to keep all sick people away. Nevertheless, when she was 3 weeks old I went off to a conference and came back with something bad. Abby was lethargic and running a high fever so we went off to our first of several trips to the emergency room in the last year.

It was hairy. They ran a bunch of bloodwork on her and a spinal tap and it came back that she had viral meningitis (NOT the bacterial meningitis that kills college kids all the time, but still an infection of her meninges). She landed back in the hospital for a few days with an IV for fluids. It sucked big time, but we made it through.

You're doing the right thing by keeping yourself sequestered. Don't be afraid to ask people to wear masks and shit or if you or your wife get sick, ask the sick one to sleep in a separate bedroom. But in all likelihood, things'll turn out fine.

Also, don't know what you are doing as far as feeding but breastfeeding helps a lot insofar as providing your child with antibodies.

I've become, over time, the kind of person who avoids shaking hands when possible

man when i met an underrated aero he was giving out free hugs like it was going outta style

this sounds lol but it couldn't hurt to get a couple surgeon's masks if it'll make you feel better (your guest...does know why you've been holed up in that room for hours now right haha) - if you've got a hospital or something nearby they'd probably even hit you up with them for free

man when i met an underrated aero he was giving out free hugs like it was going outta style

lol dude hugging is how I avoid handshaking

cold at 3 weeks shouldn't be that bad, not reaaaalllly newborn anymore though it feels like it (you're almost 2 months away from humanity!)

We have a friend whose 5 month old now has chicken pox. Uggh.

Also, not to inspire panic with our tales of spinal tap. Like I've said, we've been to the ER several times since and that was the only time they busted out that particular diagnostic tool. It happened to the correct one for what was ailing her.

I am neither a parent, nor a doctor, nor a microbiologist (though I used to be the latter), but. . .

What I'm getting from your post, aero, is that you are worried more about your germ issues and the effect of your germ issues on your kiddo than the germ issues per se. At least that's how I read it.

Your kiddo faces so, so many challenges in life, but guess what? Stats suggest that he will be fine. The cold that your relative has is not going to be the end of kiddo. Period. But you shutting off the relative with the cold could have--that kind of thing is more likely to have repurcussions imo. Relative will think you are being unreasonable, wife may also not be thrilled, you are concerned that you are projecting your admitted hypochondria (however well-founded, though I think by definition, hypochondria is *never* well-founded). . . anyhow something to consider, maybe? That the problem is not the germs, but your attitude toward the germs and the effects that could have on the kiddo? Oh wtf do I know, just a thought, and one given past my bedtime at that.

Also you posted in the how to land your kid in therapy thread, so. . . .

Oh dude, do you have a nose bulb and saline yet? Because when your kid does catch a little cold, you're going to have to develop extreme proficiency at removing boogers. This was by far the roughest thing to deal with when our girl got sick.

I've heard good things about this Swedish snot system, but never had the chance to try it.
http://nosefrida.com/

477 of 485 people found the following review helpful:

5.0 out of 5 stars IT SUCKS BOOGIES & catches them in a tube to eat later, December 2, 2010

By Moobs (New York, NY) - See all my reviews

Amazon Verified Purchase(What's this?)

This review is from: Nosefrida The Snotsucker Nasal Aspirator (Baby Product)

my wife has tiny nostrils. i can't fit any of my fingers in her nose...it's amazing she can breathe through her nose at all. consequently, our son is also lacking in the nostril-diameter department. he gets boogies...he can't breathe very well...he gets upset. it's been like that since he was born, whenever that was...recently. i forget, but i digress. we came home from the hospital with a pretty decent nose-sucking bulb...it did a reasonably OK job of sucking out boogers...and was reasonably firm and springy. but then our dog ate it. so, i tried to find a replacement. not all bulbs are created equal, i soon found out. some were too hard to squeeze and didn't spring back quickly enough. others were too soft to suck anything out and just sat there, mocking me. i tried at least four different replacement bulbs, none of which were as good as the one from the hospital. we even tried a fancy battery powered nose vacuum that made a whirring sound but produced nary a single lump of green gold. while ordering the various, useless bulbs i also ordered this thing - the nosefrida - on a whim thinking i was probably wasting $13.

BOY WAS I WRONG.

this thing works. it sucks boogers out of noses. it even stores them in a little tube to eat later. or, you can just wash them out in the sink. anyway...it works better than any of the other things we tried...and we tried pretty much everything. there's a technique to it:

- suck in quick short bursts with your mouth muscles first...to loosen things up
- then, suck in long hoover-style bursts to get those boogies out
- if the boogies get stuck near the surface, try pulling the end of the thing out a little mid-suck a few times
- use a tissue or q-tip to get any nose goblins that are loitering anywhere accessible
- repeat

if i was a professional booger sucker...and it was my job to suck the snot out of noses 8 hours a day, i would insist on using this thing. but i would want a longer tube, and a holster.

Moobs!

My sister-in-law used to just apply her mouth to her infants' noses and suck the snot out that way, so I guess you don't necessarily need a swedish snot system, but...

so totally ordered. but yeah I used to know a Polish family who was like "what's wrong with American mothers? why don't they suck out their babies' snot?" --strict mouth-to-nose, eliminating the middleman. and I guess there are claims about shared beneficial flora et al for that kinda thing but then again all home-remedy type stuff comes with all kindsa claims.

we have a nosefrida, tbh i don't really think its any better than the bulb. the kid certainly doesn't have a preference, she hates either.

feel like i don't have much input re: sickness, our kid hasn't gotten that sick yet since she's at home most of the time, just a couple of colds. i will say that when she was in daycare for two weeks, she caught a cold which she then passed on to me that was pretty much the worst cold i've ever had, some kind of baby-only supercold that took me literally a month to completely shake. the kid never seemed that upset about it though, she'd be a little grouchy once in a while but was never miserable.

lol when I worked with kids I used to get The Supercold about once a season, just the unshakeable fuckin' A you little monsters are made of strong stuff flu of doom

The thing about little kids and colds and stuff is that the parents who sequester them and take extra precautions to maintain them sicky-poo free when they're tiny will eventually get their ass kicked when their kids get bigger and go to school and get totally sick all the time when it really counts. All kids get sick, but colds and even fevers are pretty par for the course. Build their resistance when they are young. The only thing I tend to avoid is other kids who have terrible coughs, not that I'm worried about my kids getting sick, per se, but because kids take weeks to get over a cough. Snot sucker is vital, btw, for all parents.

Anyway, aero, just be reasonable, wash hands, etc. Use common sense. Don't be afraid of sick people, but don't let them slobber all over the baby, either. And it's never too early to teach/adopt the so-called vampire cough.
t
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfG-YzlOHmA

haha well as I mentioned my fear of sick people is an ongoing kinda deal - when I worked in hospitals & had sicktime I didn't have any such fear but when "calling in sick" = losing a lot of money one's relationship to illness changes

If you ever have a month off, go on a handshaking/doorknob-licking spree.

p sure the lil dude will be fine---he's got mom's immune system for about six months and then he's got to start paying his own immunological rent

basically quincie otm