An Impossible Job: ILX's 40 Favorite Documentaries

#11: When We Were Kings (Leon Gast, 1996)

http://s3.amazonaws.com/auteurs_production/stills/1945/original.jpg?1289431429

52 points/4 votes/1 first-place vote

www.youtube.com/watch?v=N44vdCqI7LI

I'll stop there and do the top 10 tomorrow. I now wish I'd voted for The King of Kong, which I loved--5 more points would have pushed it into the top 10, possibly triggering some kind of highly entertaining meltdown for Morbius.

How difficult isShoah to watch? On one hand I have a fairly strong interest in Holocaust history, but on the other I don't know if I can commit to watching it all. For instance, It took out Night and Fog from the library like 4 times before watching it because - as someone who generally has difficulty committing to watching anything - I seemingly couldn't find 30 minutes of free time to do it (which is essentially an excuse to avoid a difficult watch).

Yeah, the King of Kong was great, don't be such a grouch Morbs.

I mentioned my own experience with Shoah on the thread that preceded this one. If you mean in a theatre, make sure you've had major rest beforehand--I hadn't and couldn't last. That wouldn't be a problem at home.

great pics on the last two.

i havent seen when we were kings since i was a child, and it was certainly mesmerizing, but i wonder if i'd find it overly reverent towards ali today.

Anybody ever tried Billy Mitchell's BBQ sauce?

I liked When We Were Kings a lot, but I like this VHS I once picked up of the entire Ali-Foreman fight even better--including a post-fight interview with David Frost that's amazing. Probably Leon Gast used some of the footage from this broadcast.

Here's the list so far:

#40: Salesman (Albert Maysles/David Maysles/Charlotte Zwerin, 1968) -- 20 points/3 votes
#40: The Filth and the Fury (Julien Temple, 2000) -- 20 points/3 votes
#40: The Gleaners & I (Agnes Varda, 2000) -- 20 points/3 votes
#40: The Times of Harvey Milk (Rob Epstein, 1984) -- 20 points/3 votes
#39: Être et Avoir (Nicolas Philibert, 2002) -- 21 points/2 votes/1 first
#38: Inside Job (Charles Ferguson, 2010) -- 22 points/3 votes
#36: Gimme Shelter (Albert Maysles/David Maysles/Charlotte Zwerin, 1970) -- 24 points/3 votes
#36: Winged Migration (Jacques Perrin/Jacques Cluzaud, 2001) -- 24 points/3 votes
#34: Spellbound (Jeffrey Blitz, 2002) -- 25 points/2 votes/1 first
#34: The World at War (Hugh Raggett/John Pett/David Elstein/Ted Childs/Michael Darlow/Martin Smith, 1973/74) -- 25 points/2 votes/1 first
#33: Los Angeles Plays Itself (Thom Andersen, 2003) -- 26 points/2 votes
#32: Sherman's March (Ross McElwee, 1986) -- 25 points/4 votes
#31: Anvil! The Story of Anvil (Sacha Gervasi, 2008) -- 26 points/2 votes
#30: The Last Waltz (Martin Scorsese, 1978) -- 26 points/4 votes
#29: WR: Mysteries of the Organism (Dusan Makavejev, 1971) -- 27 points/2 votes/1 first
#28: The Fog of War (Errol Morris, 2003) -- 27 points/3 votes
#27: My Best Fiend (Werner Herzog, 1999) -- 29 points/3 votes
#26: Shoah (Claude Lanzmann, 1985) -- 30 points/2 votes/1 first
#25: Paris Is Burning (Jennie Livingston, 1990) -- 32 points/3 votes
#24: Winter Soldier (Fred Aronow/Robert Fiore/David Gillis/David Grubin/Jeff Holstein/Michael Lesser, 1972) -- 32 points/4 votes/1 first
#22: The Century of the Self (Adam Curtis, 2002) -- 35 points/2 votes
#22: Hype! (Doug Pray, 1996) -- 35 points/2 votes/1 first
#21: Don’t Look Back (D.A. Pennebaker, 1967) -- 35 points/3 votes/1 first
#20: Grey Gardens (Albert Maysles/David Maysles/Ellen Hovde/Muffie Meyer, 1975) -- 35 points/5 votes
#19: Koyaanisqatsi (Godfrey Reggio, 1982) -- 35 points/6 votes
#18: Stop Making Sense (Jonathan Demme, 1984) -- 38 points/5 votes
#17: Brother’s Keeper (Joe Berlinger/Bruce Sinofsky, 1992) -- 40 points/2 votes
#16: Man with a Movie Camera (Dziga Vertov, 1929) -- 41 points/6 votes
#15: Night and Fog (Alain Resnais, 1955) -- 48 points/3 votes
#14: The Up Series (Michael Apted/Paul Almond, 1964-2005) -- 48 points/5 votes/2 firsts
#13: Man on Wire (James Marsh, 2008) -- 49 points/4 votes
#12: The King of Kong: A Fistful of Quarters (Seth Gordon, 2007) -- 49 points/5 votes
#11: When We Were Kings (Leon Gast, 1996) -- 52 points/4 votes/1 first

Rattle and Hum is gonna be #1, right

King of Kong is so good. Ranking of Hype! suddenly reminded me of Dig!.

One of the many remarkable things about Night and Fog was that the French gov had two problems with it: showing all the bodies and showing the complicity of French officers. Resnais reportedly had to obscure the latter to include the former, and so it remained until ... only recently?

Morbs OTM

Can't tell you how much I disagree with what seems to be the underlying issue with some of Morbius's complaints about King of Kong and the Anvil film: that documentaries must be about serious matters to be valid. Unless he just wanted a more artistic film on the intricacies of Donkey Kong.

Eric--you voted for Jackass Two. Haven't seen it, but I'm interested to know what kind of an aesthetic values Jackass Two but deems The King of Kong frivolous.

I can think of few docs as honestly, surprisingly moving as King of Kong and Anvil. Flashing back to King of Kong and the wife's support for this guy who's been dealt such a bad hand ... the Anvil guy's family stepping up to help this super good-natured, optimistic, hard-working dude fulfill his belated dream ... not every doc has to be a freakshow or war tragedy. And Anvil even has a holocaust angle!

xp: sex sells

It's better.

And King of Kong is kinda pretty serious about its subject. Jackass doesn't pretend it's about anything so important as Donkey Kong.

the Anvil film video just isn't very well made, and the music is dreadful.

I'm not even a non-fan of Kong or Man on Wire. But c'mon; 12th and 13th best of all time?

but hey, Frederick Wiseman, lighten up!

Come on, it's not fair to demerit the Anvil doc for the music.

If those are the issues you guys have, no problem. I'm reading more your exasperation.

But c'mon; 12th and 13th best of all time?

Were you expecting the very large sample of 30 voters not to come up with some quirky rankings? People were voting for their favourites, not trying to assemble a correct list.

You were expecting us not to bitch?

Free to be you and me--fair point.

I'd sure bitch if something as turgid as Wiseman's "Belfast, Maine" made it to the list.

I do think Man on Wire should've been a lot lower. it's a solid movie, but I feel like a better one could've been made about the subject.

The issue isn't that these are quirky rankings so much as they betray the sample size's very ILM mentality.

haha i just looked up belfast, maine. 245 minutes! with this glowing review on imdb:

This is not a film for anyone under 35. Wiseman manages to portray Belfast as some sort of hellish retirement community. The entire film is done without a hint of humor, and Wiseman seems to be taking these people's gray little lives as over-seriously as they do. Rarely do any of the people of Belfast crack a smile - it's as if living in Belfast has literally sucked all of the joy out of their lives.

This film fails on every level. As entertainment, it fails miserably. As serious documentary, it fails because it grossly distorts your image of Belfast - the youth of the town are completely ignored, and the elderly, the infirm and the retarded are represented again and again. As character study it fails because of episodic nature of the film - we never stay with any person long enough to really learn anything about them.

"Belfast, Maine" is one of the worst mistakes in the history of the documentary. A poor, poor film.

People were voting for their favourites, not trying to assemble a correct list.

Never get this distinction, but carry on.

(Among music docs, some of you could at least have gone for Theremin)

I'd rather listen to Anvil than two hours of Theremin (/barely hyperbole).

is man on wire good? tbh i find that kind of dangerous feat of skill really stupid and careless and annoying rather than awesome. total dick move imo.

Titicut Follies is pretty spry and entertaining, fwiw.

Yeah, Man on Wire's filmmakers seem to adequately work the dick angle.

Theremin got three votes, including one from me, but not enough points.

I've gotten into many discussions about that favourite/best distinction over the years, but it's a long one and probably a separate thread. I do not make such a distinction when drawing up lists, but I've encountered people who do.

As for Wiseman, he got votes for a number of films, but it was the old problem of spreading the votes around.

who voted for Paris Is Burning besides Eric and me?

I did!

tightrope walking btwn towers >>>>> Philippe Petit saying "EET WASS MY DWEAMMM" for two hours

This is not a film for anyone under 35.

i HAVE to see this now

I didn't like Man on Wire. King of Kong was great. I wish I had voted in this.

xpost You really don't have to see it.

i am going to lobby so hard for "not suitable for anyone under 35" to become an MPAA rating

"rated ADD"

(Among music docs, some of you could at least have gone for Theremin)

― satan club sandwich (Dr Morbius), Monday, August 15, 2011 5:18 PM (58 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I'd rather listen to Anvil than two hours of Theremin (/barely hyperbole).

― Josh in Chicago, Monday, August 15, 2011 5:20 PM (56 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Probably would have voted for it had I seen it seeing as it's tough to make LT's life boring. And Josh, that is sacrilege. Anvil really isn't about the music at all for me, anyway. It's about the story.

I liked Anvil better as American Movie.

Me too. Still liked both, though.

Man On Wire was my no.1, you philistines. For giving me an even stronger image of the towers than their destruction, somehow - I cam out feeling euphoric, there was something religious in the way it was done I think. Worth watching for the stills alone.

xpost I was mostly just referring the Morbs' comment that "the music is dreadful" as a demerit against the film's quality.

I've mentioned before that I don't like crying in documentaries. One instance where I find it moving is when the guy with the big mop of white hair breaks down while recalling the Twin Towers walk. It happens all of a sudden--we just see him cover his face with his hands. (It's in the clip above.)

I didn't like the way they filmed scenes to make it look like a heist film.