The Kinks post -1970. Classic or Dud + Search and Destroy

MUSWELL HILLBILLIES - Incredibly let down by this album when I actually heard it. There's a lot of the plodding nondescript psuedo-pubrock that characterises the Kinks' from 1970-1975. Few of the songs have any real hooks but Ray Davies is incapable of not writing at least one or two great songs per album. Can I also say the lyrics and the "concept" of the album are brilliant. Ray Davies is one of the few writers in Rock ever to write accurately about working class life.

EVERYBODY'S SHOWBIZ - This has more of the dreary pub rock of "Hillbillies" but it has two stunning songs: "Celluloid Heroes" and "Sitting In My Hotel". The live section of the album is a waste of everyone's time.

PRESERVATION ACT 1 - Again this actually has some very good songs on it and the concept is so loose it doesn't get in the way. The songs which aren't good are pretty dire however.

PRESERVATION ACT 2 - I'm afraid this was the last straw for me, I haven't bothered listening to a Kinks album since this. About 4 good songs out of 24 - and the other 20 are dreadful. The concept of the album is really quite interesting because it's really about the conflict about Capitalism and Marxism and as such is a very rare example of a political rock album.

All sorts of wonderful, that song.

"Moving Pictures"
"No More Looking Back"
"Better Things"
"Art Lover"
"Juke Box Music"

destroy:

"Black Messiah"
"A Gallon Of Gas"
"Hay Fever"
"State Of Confusion"
"Destroyer"

"Slum Kids"
"Oklahoma USA"

also to destroy:

"Jack The Idiot Dunce"
"Have A Cuppa Tea"

The Kinks are my favourite band, and this era is definitely not their strongest, but I love a lot of the stuff that came out of it anyway

I've been just hugely loving "Demolition" from Preservation I...first got into it via the BBC version which *sounds* much better. The original goes on longer, sort of along the lines of "Australia" from Arthur (which is another off-the-beaten-path Kinks track that's turned into a favorite over the past few years). If I could find a version that combines the BBC sound with the album performance I'd be in heaven.

I fucking hated that 'Schoolboys In Disgrace' album from the 70's.

But I have The Kinks Present A Soap Opera from 1975 on vinyl and I always thought it was very charming.

I don't know Preservation. I fully admit I didn't get all the Kinks stuff I could have though, but this was partially because of a romantic falling out with someone who loved the Kinks. I never owned Arthur and I know this is a major flaw on my part.

it seemed like in the 80s/90s they fell into this pattern of making dull records with seemingly "commercial" aspirations that had one or two songs that were absurdly better than everything else on the record. specifically, "come dancing" (beats the hell outta everything else on state of confusion), "working in the factory" (the rest of think visual is as embarrassing as any music they've ever made), and "scattered," a song that sounded so fresh and out-of-place on the otherwise disappointing phobia that i wasn't particularly surprised to learn that it was a holdover from the muswell hillbillies days.

the 70s operas aren't without their merits; preservation act 1 is pretty listenable, and schoolboys in disgrace is by far the most focused (and rocking) of those records. as for the 70s aor stuff, i've always had a soft spot for sleepwalker; "full moon" is as beautiful as anything from something else or village green.

as a side note, when i saw the kinks in 1993 they opened with "sweet lady genevieve" from preservation act 1. a pleasant shock for the kinks fanatics in the crowd, with everyone else asking us why we were so excited about this song they didn't know.

How come there was only one mention of This Time Tomorrow?? I had to leave it to Wes Anderson to bring it to me, which is shameful.

Also, search: Get Back In Line.

And to second Oklahoma USA.

Soap Opera is great.

Preservation 1 AND 2 are good if you treat them in isolation. I think most people were just cranky that neither was as good as Village Green.

Elvis Costello tries something different and people love him for it. Ray Davies tries something different and they all have a big cry. I never understood this.

btw I know Davies has apologised profusely for his vaudeville period, but I can't help thinking he let himself be convinced that the work wasn't great and so feels he needs to make excuses.

"Celluloid Heroes" has such a lovely tune, but I'm very ambivalent about the lyrics - sort of irksome how all the male movie stars are portrayed as cool and solid while all the women are oh so tragic and vulnerable. Great song nonetheless.

Elvis Costello tries something different and people love him for it

What? Are you on crack or something? People don't love him for it, they say "What the fuck are you doing writing for a fucking string quartet or writing a symphony or something, why can't you write another album like "Imperial Bedroom" and stop marrying jazz singers and writing albums for opera stars, you pointlessly eclectic cunt!"

I got the Percy soundtrack out the other day. The vocal numbers would make a killer EP, and the instrumentals are endearingly oddball.

Ok, been on a Kinks Rock Operas bender lately, but jesus has rock criticism ever been more wrong? I don't know that I'll ever have time to write up a full blow-by-blow, but Preservation 1 and 2 are both amazing, Soap Opera is great, and Schoolboys is apparently going to be a movie so we can all judge when it comes out.

I can't help but think there was some unspoken agenda against what these albums represented. I have to admit that all the hype managed to scare me off of them for like 20 years, which is sort of ridiculous and I should have known better.

Nice quote from somewhere or other, that's almost certainly true: "If the Beatles cut "Money Talks", it would be quoted every day."

Preservation 1 search at the moment would be:

Morning Song
Daylight
Sweet Lady Genevieve (that's the first three songs on the album, btw)
One of the Survivors
Money & Corruption/I Am Your Man (and I'm pretty fond of Cricket too, actually)
Sitting In The Midday Sun
Demolition

And that = "really strong album." The "Preservation" single isn't too shabby either.

From Preservation 2:

Introduction to Solution
When A Solution Comes
Money Talks (i.e. once again the first three tracks, and jesus Money Talks is amazing. Also, just as a point of interest, compare the middle bit around 2:20 to Bowie's "Candidate" which was also probably channeling the Stones in a twisted way.)
Second Hand Car Spiv
He's Evil (another massive and overlooked track...can't believe this isn't on all the Best Ofs)
Nobody Gives
Flash's Confession (another great faux Bowie track, and why doesn't a single review I've read mention the Bowie influence on this time period?)
Salvation Road

Easily 8 solid tracks, and I'm pretty fond of the rest too.

Most underrated song of this period has to be Ducks On The Wall, though, from Soap Opera. Christ.

Other classic bit on this period:

Circus: A few months ago Lou Reed said he only listens to two albums, "Preservation Act I" and "The Great Lost Kinks Album."

Ray: I don't play his stuff so I feel bad when you say that. I felt really ashamed when I never heard of his group before, the Velvet Underground, until I signed with RCA. I really thought I should have. There are so many things I miss, you know.

It's also screamingly obvious the precedent for Robyn Hitchcock's "Uncorrected Personality Traits" is on Preservation 2: "Shepherds of the Nation."

Got two tracks from Preservation on eMusic the other day 'cause of this recent talk- "One of the Survivors" isn't doing it for me. But "Sweet Lady Genevieve" is beyond fantastic, and might be the best one-song distillation of Davies strengths.

"One of the Survivors" has that fifties nostalgia feel of a lot glam, and it's long-winded like rock of the time. But it doesn't have the production values. It still sounds like 1968. I wonder how much the production and the stasis of the Kinks sound around this time had to do with the indifference they faced. Old hat when everyone was trying out funny new over-the-top hats.

Things I like about "One of the Survivors" off the top of my head:

It's basically "Taking Care of Business" (1973 must have been a good year for that riff)
The line about driving 100 miles an hour, but it don't mess up my D.A.
All that Stonesy riffing. Seems like right around this point in his career Ray starts paying a lot more attention to RS, Who, Bowie...

I kind of remember when I first heard this album, not being to thrilled w/much other than Demolition. It was a slow grower for sure, and production could be part of that.

Agree the Preservation albums are underrated, though I can see how coming so soon after the Kontroversy through Muswell run, they could sound like further confirmation post-Everybody's in Showbiz that the Kinks were in decline. The biggest problems are the vocals and, as alluded to above, the production. Davies singing is even more affected than usual throughout the albums, as he really indulges his penchant for campy overacting. The production is a mess, though that's one thing I rather like about the albums. The sloppy, shambolic quality keeps the music from achieving the larger than life grandeur maybe it could have had, but it also keeps the albums from being overcome by bombast- there's something fundamentally tossed off and funny about the Preservation songs that really appeals to me (and fits in well with the themes of the piece). That said, I'm currently working on a Kinks collection for the comp project, and I ultimately decided on using just a single track from the Preservation project, though it was painful to drop "Salvation Road" and "Money Talks." Another song I really like: "Mirror of Love," especially the alternate take available on the Preservation 2 CD.

I can't help but think there was some unspoken agenda against what these albums represented.

... them representing Ray disappearing up his own arse you mean? There are definitely some great songs on these albums, esp. "Preservation 1" and "A Soap Opera". Listening to all of "Preservation 2" is a chore however and "Schoolboys in Disgrace" is a total dog.

I know, "LOL rockstar trying to make serious statements" but, politically, "Preservation" is naive bordering on simple-minded

Schoolboys in Disgrace to be a film musical directed by Bobcat Goldthwait!

http://www.spinner.com/2010/06/30/bobcat-goldthwait-kinks-schoolboys-in-disgrace-movie/

"Celluloid Heroes" has such a lovely tune, but I'm very ambivalent about the lyrics - sort of irksome how all the male movie stars are portrayed as cool and solid while all the women are oh so tragic and vulnerable. Great song nonetheless.

― Daniel_Rf, Friday, November 9, 2007 9:05 AM (nine years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

anachronistic rock criticism at its finest

Search: 'Ducks on the Wall'

never listened to Sleepwalker before, I'm digging it

I'm kind of agnostic about their post-Muswell work but I put "Here Comes Yet Another Day" on a playlist a long time ago and I'm really digging it now

I love Schoolboys In Disgrace, especially No More Looking Back. Is that Bobcat Goldthwait movie still happening? I think I'd like a Schoolboys In Disgrace movie directed by Wes Anderson, it seems like it would be a good fit for him - institutional setting, focused on the pain/pleasure of wallowing in the past, people cloistering themselves away from the world

Juke Box Music on Sleepwalker is one of their very best. Same goes for Rock and Roll Fantasy on Misfits.

you keep all your smart modern writers

OTM. As is

Juke Box Music on Sleepwalker is one of their very best. Same goes for Rock and Roll Fantasy on Misfits.

"Lola vs. Powerman" - Ray's Jewish accent on "Top of the Pops" is a bit :-O but a good album with some reservations.

I find "Muswell Hillbillies" to be an irritatingly sequenced album, all the boring crap like "Complicated Life", "Here Come the People in Grey", "Acute Schizophrenia etc" seems to be crammed into the first half of the album, making it a chore to sit through, then the last four songs are great. Also I don't like "Holiday" or "Alcohol" much, two songs which people seem to consider highlights of the album. And what does, "Skin and Bones" have to do with the concept (so-called) of the album?

I'm not bored enough yet to listen to "Everybody's in Showbiz".

Ha. The latter was one of the only ones I could find back in the late 70s and early 80s I can confirm that it’s pretty bad.

I've got it I just don't want to listen to it.

"This Time Tomorrow" (mentioned a couple of times earlier in this thread) is one of their greatest. Somehow I missed it in The Darjeeling Limited (not to mention missing it on the album I played two or three times 35 years ago and then shelved), but I've since come across it on The Regular Lovers, a French film from 2005, and the new Mrs. America on F/X.

I've got it I just don't want to listen to it.

Just put on The Great Lost Kinks Album, which I could never find a copy of back in the day, heard the backing vocals on "Lavender Hill," was reminded of the magic that Rasa seemed to add and then this grand theory: https://andrewhickey.info/2018/01/28/did-a-teenage-girl-make-the-kinks-great/

I really disliked The Darjeeling Limited but it did make me realize what a fuckin' great song that is

Yup

There's a good story in the Ray Davies biography which sums up what being in a band with the Davies brothers could be like. They're playing a gig somewhere in the States, late 70s/early 80s, crowd's going nuts, Dave Davies walks over to keyboard player, John Gosling, and spits at him full in his face. At the end of the gig, as they're preparing to go back on stage for the encore, Gosling says, "I'm not getting on stage with that cunt", Ray says, "Get on that stage or I'll knock you out". Gosling refuses, Ray knocks him clean out, dives back on stage all smiles and plays the keyboards himself - ever the pro!

It's awfully hard for me to imagine Ray Davies knocking anybody out. Outrunning them perhaps, but not knocking them out.

Re: live albums, I was dismayed to learn this week that my 1998 CD of Everybody's in Showbiz doesn't contain the full original vinyl. Songs and banter were cut in order to make room for two not-very-necessary bonus songs; some of the cuts were incredibly fussy, like cutting out a second or two in the intro of "Alcohol", or replacing the transitions between songs with looped crowd noise. This is assuming, of course, that the deluxe edition is faithful to the original vinyl, and not the product of another attack of reworked mastering.

It's awfully hard for me to imagine Ray Davies knocking anybody out. Outrunning them perhaps, but not knocking them out.

He's a big guy, slim certainly, but tall - plus have you seen John Gosling? He was also a star athlete at school, in various sports, I think he might even have done some boxing?

(xp) The live part of "Everybody's In Showbiz" is weird anyway, like they, or rather, Ray went out of the way to sabotage it by including all those silly covers and having "Lola" reduced to a chant by the audience. They left out a lot of much stronger and more commercial material that was recorded at the same time. I wonder if it gave Lou Reed the idea for "Take No Prisoners"!

Yes, it's like a snapshot of a certain drunken, horn-laden idea of the Kinks in 1972, more Fandango than Made in Japan.

(now thinking of Lou Reed interrupting "I Wanna Be Black" with a rendition of "The Banana Boat Song")

"I wanna be black
I wanna have a banana..."

"Take No Prisoners" = methamphetamine
"Everybody's in Showbiz" = Tetley's Bitter

lol

The record is kind of lost, but the version of Celluloid Heroes on To the Bone is absolutely terrific.

"Give the People What They Want".

This album is pretty much a write-off until the last three songs. So much of it consists of an out-of-touch middle aged rocker's idea of what punk/new wave sounds like, with shouty vocals from Ray and hideous heavy rock guitar from Dave. The song that recycles "All of the Day and All of the Night" is an abomination. Plus it just sounds crap. Then Ray comes up with a jokey song written from the point of view of a would-be paedophile, a pretty bleak song about spousal abuse and follows those up with a song hoping for better times!

That's what the people wanted!

Not I.

I'd actually rather listen to "Destroyer" than "All Day and All of the Night", I don't even mind the medley of the two that Ray did with Billy Corgan.

Para-noi-a! the destroy-er!

It's absolutely appalling! I really wish Ray had split the band up some time in the mid 70s.

Pretty much

I think it's the one "heavy" song they did in their arena rock phase that can handle the overstatement.

lol it even starts with "met a girl named Lola..."

funny enough I am listening to the Kink Kronikles right now and it is nuts how Ray could basically do no wrong for like that entire 5 year period. practically every song here is gold and it's still missing a lot of the best album tracks. then he just kind of fucked around for a few years and when he tried to make hit records again it's like he forgot how to write a song. I remember reading some article about all the stuff from Sleepwalker on pointing out all the instances of self-plagiarism and stolen riffs. it's like two-thirds of the songs. kinda goes with his fuck-you-I'm-a-star attitude I guess

Ray Davies used to - and still does probably - make a song and dance about how Pete Townshend had ripped the Kinks off on "Can't Explain", which Townshend admitted to, and so kick started the Who's career. So what does Ray do? He rips off the Who on at least one track on every second album from the mid 70s onwards.

Nice use of "fa fa fa fa fa" here (not really)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QhUma34j7s

Recycled the Father Christmas riff too, it seems.

I don’t think Ray was too upset about “I Can’t Explain” at the time, but it probably stung considerably in the ensuing years when the Who got huge while the Kinks floundered commercially (and ended up opening for the Who in 1969). Similarly, the Kinks initially outsold the Stones in the US (and Avory had been a Stone), but the Stones quickly overtook them; and “Zeppelin?! That Page kid used to play on our records!” Ray seemed content to follow his muse in the ‘70s with the theatrical records — he knew those albums weren’t trying to compete with the Who, Stones, or Zep — but probably felt frustrated by 1976 since the Kinks had laid the groundwork for those stadium-filling bands while not able to fill stadiums (or arenas) themselves. So the clumsy following of trends, and jumping head-first into arena-rock hackery, became their defining qualities.