Bob Mould: Classic or Dud?

so serious question: did the Hüsker boys attract male groupies or something?

hetero me didn't even know Mould was gay at the time I saw Husker Du perform

ask Bob M that one Alfred but from the audience his sexuality was not obviously apparent, to say the least

I've had a long-running conversation about this w/one of my best friends who's gay & also been a professional musician his whole life. back in the early 90s when I was a magazine editor we tried to do a "personal testimony" kind of article about his experiences in the (surprisingly) closeted/macho rock world.
The piece never got written mostly cause my buddy is a gifted songwriter but not a journalist (which I guess proves Xgau's point sorta) anyway his 80s band opened for HuDu in FLA. he hung out w/Grant Hart (platonically) after the gig and said he was a nice guy but got no gay vibes from anybody in the band.

Brief review in WSJ by Ken Kurson.

"startlingly serpentine" eh

Are there even such a thing as male groupies? In the strict Pamela Des Barres definition of the word?

The whole homosexuality thing with Husker Du… I don't know how to put it. I don't want it swept under the rug when talking about the band, but it was such a "novel" thing back in the day for most punk fans, it has a tendency to get overblown. "Were Grant and Bob lovers?" Why would you even ask that question. Was Kim Deal fucking Black Francis?

And besides, didn't Grant father a child? Yes, gay men can do that, but it does blur the whole situation, especially when you're asking cockamamie questions about relations between the band members.

I met a friend of Grant's once who described him as bi, and yes, he had a kid.

I certainly thought Norton was the cutest guy in the band before and after I knew about the other two's sexuality.

"Were Grant and Bob lovers?" Why would you even ask that question. Was Kim Deal fucking Black Francis?

Those two questions are not, er, equal which should explain why there are numerous excellent reasons one would ask the first question.

I'm not trying to be confronational or seem like I'm dismissing the first question, but it seems like the only reason it ever gets asked whether Bob and Grant were lovers is because they were both gay and playing in the same band.

The head games and tension that existed throughout the band's tenure as a reason to ask… it seems to me that there have been hundreds of bands that went through that (hell, I just read the Pavement bio where Malkmus pulls a Mould and sits in the back of the van with his hood up, not talking to anyone.) The whole, "WELL, they must have been ASS FUCKING, those homos…" seems a bit disingenuous.

Again, Kevin. I'm not trying to disparage ya, but I'd also like to hear for what reasons you wonder.

Oh I see. I thought you were dismissing outright the question of their sexuality. Still, there are ways to conceive of any erotic/romantic tension between Mould/Hart more positively, i.e.g, as a engine for songwriting or musical energy. Plus it's just a flat-out more politically compelling story than Malkmus sulking or whatever, ya know?

I assume most intraband friction stems from erotic tension. It's natural to wonder whether two gay men in a band were lovers.

The first NYT (daily) review says they took their BFs on the road with them at times.

Azerrad's Our Band... mentioned it too.

Eh. I mean, I've never wondered if the members of Veruca Salt were lovers or if Fred Schneider and Ricky Wilson ever had a thing going.

Use your imagination!

Hell, if we're using our imagination, why do we keep excluding Greg Norton?

The 1983 issue of me and my buddy's Thrillseeker fanzine had an interview with Husker Du (that someone did for us) but it never included such questions. Maybe Tesco Vee discussed such things!

Huskerslash

I've never wondered if the members of Veruca Salt were lovers

i'm pretty sure i wondered this

The whole homosexuality thing with Husker Du… I don't know how to put it. I don't want it swept under the rug when talking about the band, but it was such a "novel" thing back in the day for most punk fans, it has a tendency to get overblown.

also, its weird to me (beyond some journos' general ignorance of the hardcore scene beyond its biggest names) that HD's homosexuality is regarded as a total anomaly, when, in the Texas scene at least, there were a number of out-and-proud gay hardcore rockers - thinking the Big Boys' randy turner and the dicks' gary floyd in partic.

i mean, obv. it wasn't the norm, but...

a lot of very serious wondering

What I find weird is thinking of HD as anything more than 'incidentally' h/c after Metal Circus

at least a side and a half of zen arcade is demonstrably h/c?

I assume most intraband friction stems from erotic tension. It's natural to wonder whether two gay men in a band were lovers.

― The Edge of Gloryhole (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, June 27, 2011 11:49 AM (51 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I agree. I always wondered if dudes like Jorma Kaukonen was nailing Grace Slick, or if Bob Weir was getting head from Donna Godchaux.

sort of, but not fully? you mean "Dreams Reoccurring", eg? xp

I'm thinking most of side 3 in particular - biggest lie, masochism world, pride, etc...

ok. I haven't listened to ZA in over a decade, probably.

Brief review in WSJ by Ken Kurson.

Kurson was the bassist in legendary 80s/90s Chicago band Green. Mould was a fan of Green, and insisted they open HD's final Chicago show.

K.K. no doubt revving up for Giuliani 2012

(we were co-workers and used to hung out a bit, before he went full Republican)

Interesting. I played in his post-Green band (the Lilacs) for a bit. Not a trace of conservatism in him at all in those days (early 90s). Always wondered how/why the transition happened.

Eh. I mean, I've never wondered if the members of Veruca Salt were lovers or if Fred Schneider and Ricky Wilson ever had a thing going.

Oh come on, pleasant plains. This is Homosexuality 101 shit. With homosexuality erased from history to an enormous extent and bullies/trolls (what's the difference?) like history mayne or Camille Paglia "requiring" hard evidence for homosexuality to even exist in most historical instances, it becomes crucial, sometimes life-saving, to seize and insist upon (hi)stories of homosexuality. I'm assuming you're straight which might explain why you don't care about Mould's or whoever's homosexuality. But for most gay people, it's of monumental importance.

Besides do you have to be gay or even care about a Mould/Hart relationship to be interested in homosexuality in a hardcore/punk/Amerindie/whatever scene? And is that "transmutation of wrath into flight" in Hüsker Dü's music 100% unrelated to the homosexuality of the band members? To paraphrase D.A. Miller's superb essay "Anal/Rope," it seems as if you're determined to acknowledge
Mould/Hart's homosexuality so as to prevent it from entering into an eventual understanding of Hüsker Dü's music.

Kevin, maybe I wasn't clear. I'm all about discussing the bandmembers' sexuality and especially coming from a 99% hetero-culture that wasn't always that supportive, despite supposedly liberal punk rock attitudes. I do want to hear how it was accepted 30 years ago, how it affected their craft and even the WE. ARE. SPARTA! descriptions of the band's habits on the road are insightful.

My hang-up only comes from the Did they?/Didn't they? gossip around whether Grant and Bob were lovers. Not whether they were gay or should be out about it. It seems like it cheapens their orientation and cheapens real talk about the band, from icy moodswings from Bob to Grant's drug use.

As it is now, John Lennon and Brian Epstien having an affair is more worthy of discussion than Grant Hart and Bob Mould having a physical relationship.

I never took Homosexuality 101. It wasn't an elective offered to me.

hey Tarfumes, I saw the Lilacs play at Coney Island once, were you in the band then?

xpost I don't see a difference between "discussing the bandmembers' sexuality" and "gossip around whether Grant and Bob were lovers," esp. given the crucial role gossip plays in histories of disenfranchised people. But I'm willing to leave it at that.

I never took Homosexuality 101. It wasn't an elective offered to me.

Doesn't usually exist as an elective per se. But I'm sure you've taken it to some extent. ILM, for instance, offers course credit.

Just don't accidentally sign up for Homosexuality 101-B. That one includes a lab.

fwiw, i took Heterosexuality 101 as a correspondence course.

xpost

haha. the lab was my favorite part!!!!!!

hey Tarfumes, I saw the Lilacs play at Coney Island once, were you in the band then?

Ha, actually, I couldn't do those east coast shows because I couldn't get time off work. I did do a few shows with them that summer, but they were all in Chicago.

Good interview at The AV Club today: http://www.avclub.com/articles/bob-mould,58231/

Interesting interview.

I'm enjoying the book so far.

Also, Grant's still kind of a jerk when you talk to him

Read the first 100 pages of this today in one sitting. It's good (and I'm way more Mats than Husker)

I read the book and enjoyed it overall but left it liking Mould less; I can see why the band was an untenable situation, he and Hart seem like just entirely different people. Mould comes off as a bit of an egomaniac, hugely self-involved and often foul-tempered and humorless. Still, couldn't put the book down. I know Hart pretty well and the portrait of him Mould paints, while not pretty, is quite accurate, even if it ignores the better parts of his personality. It's a wonder they made as many albums as they did.

Given that the Huskers are all over this site at the moment , I'll resurrect a Bob thread.

Just stumbled across some reviews for his new one"Silver Age'. Seem very positive. Believe me, twenty years ago, I would've bought it by now, but these days I'm out the loop

Apologies if this has been done. I did search.

Any reaction out there. It rocks apparently. Anti Blowout

I'm not even really a big Huskers/Sugar/Mould fan and I think it's amazing, top to bottom. Can't even believe how much I dig it.

It's like he drank whatever miracle elixir brought Superchunk back two years ago. Or maybe it's all about Jon Wurster.

Anyway, the Mould album is streaming at Rolling Stone. You can listen for yourself.

http://www1.rollingstone.com/hearitnow/player/bobmould.html

The album is really, really good. Nothing you haven't heard before, but a remarkable summation/conflation of his various bands, Husker Du/Sugar in particular.

Nothing you haven't heard before,

Gonna see him and band tonight do Sugar's Copper Blue and the new "Silver Age"

http://m.stereogum.com/pl/1142922/watch-bob-mould-kick-ass-on-letterman/video/

This is better than the album by a country mile, mind you.