A thread for The Killing, aka much-lauded Danish drama "Forbrydelsen" (with spoilers)

(see also the FBI conspiracy stuff in the miami vice movie).

this is my read:

john hawkes is a former informant of crockett and tubbs, whom they passed over to the feds. one night while they’re trying to take down herc from the wire, they get a call from a tearful hawkes saying "badness is happening right now."

what's happened is, he’s set up a meet-n-greet between the aryan brotherhood and some fbi undercovers; but the aryans have the feds rumbled, and they don't have any backup. crockett and tubbs warn the local bureau chief but it’s too late and the feds get killed, and so does hawkes’s fam. he then steps under a lorry.

so the unchill aryan bros have cut into the feds and the feds need to plug the leak. crockett and tubbs are hired to go undercover as boatmen and get intel on the aryans' suppliers,* which turns out to be a large operation with hubs in the triple frontier and haiti.

when c & t are bringing in a big shipment, they give out different information to different branches of the fbi, and that way they’ll sus out who’s feeding the aryans with information.

it call goes sideways because the bad guys take naomi harris hostage.

*ok this bit is maybe murky

felt like a missed opportunity though

yeah, totally, especially cause danish tom noonan bro was nice n creepy

FBI conspiracy stuff in Miami Vice "resolved" (abandoned) after C & T let the guys know how to find the leak. I have a feeling there was meant to be more but they had to quickly change the ending because Foxx refused to go back to South America to film the actual climax of the film. Or maybe Mann just stopped caring about that particular plot at some point. Either way the movie is all the better for it, imo, whereas the conspiracy stuff in The Killing is just boring red herrings.

it wasn't boring imo, i liked the characters enough

the only stuff i found boring-ish was the grieving parents

a little goes a long way

http://allfiberarts.com/2011/sarah-lund-white-sweater-motif.htm

yeah i think i understood the fbi conspiracy stuff in miami vice nrq, it's just it seemed to be an open thread at the end of the film.

i guess the killing was different: not an open thread so much as a red herring. would have liked it not to be a red herring because it was cool though (max otm about tom døønån, he was great!)

any thoughts on this? i am probably being dim:

still don't get what rie was supposed to have done wrong? she seems to admit to cleaning up the outside of the flat, but so does morten?

is it something to do with suppressing the photo... hang on nah that was morten?

idk

she maybe screwed that guy?

> http://allfiberarts.com/2011/sarah-lund-white-sweater-motif.htm

RONG. isn't symmetrical and the left bit is too close to the middle.

if i may draw your attention here:

Rolling iPlayer and 4OD and iTVPlayer 2011

This is being repeated on BBC4 just now. Second episode 10pm tonight, first is on iPlayer, and it's tied with Only Connect as the biggest reason to continue the existence of BBC4.

Loving this. *must not look up to find out who was the murderer*

oh ffs, keep meaning to catch this, but episode one is now no longer on there. will have a rootle around on the 'net i guess.

finished this tonight. have to say it was good however after a while it's gets a bit cyclical and you never believe whoever ABSOLUTELY MUST BE GUILTY is guilty. it starts to get a bit irritating near the end.

Last episode is one of the most colossal letdowns I've had with a TV series, given it shows so much of the stuff from earlier in the series to have been pointless contrivance that's utterly ludicrous. I mean, the Jens Holck stuff - why would he have run someone over, then tried to kill Lund WHEN HE WASN'T EVEN GUILTY OF ANYTHING TO COVER UP?

Sorry if that's spoilery - had a look upthread and didn't think I was guilty of more than anyone else who'd finished the series. But that annoyed me so much.

Yeah exactly, and the whole "let's get Sarah Lund arrested" thing was such a cheap shot. It didn't feel natural and was just part of the crescendo. The first few eps work cos you can't tell where it's going but after that it's basically building certain cases against anyone which you know will fall through.

Yep: why were the police authorities so concerned that she would uncover the fact that ... a racist, pervert manual labourer was involved. Red herrrings are good in thrillers, but there has to be a purpose to them; they have to be resolved. Otherwise its a cheap trick: any crap writer can throw in unresolved conspiracies; the trick, if they are not the actual denouement, is to resolve them in a satisfactory manner. Once a writer sets them up, they have made an implicit promise to the viewer: "I'll be back for these later." The writers of The Killing set them all up, then just left them there, which absolutely anyone can do; it turned out to be based on a whole series of broken promises. Unforgivable.

i basically agree w. ^^.

the show hasn't rally 'stayed with me'. but i liked the characters, thought it was well put together, liked the mileu (bbc4-viewer potential city-breaker? yeah i guess), found it suspenseful, and so it's easily worth seeing once. and i'll watch the second season.

i can't really remember the solution, but the show hinted at a much bigger political conspiracy and failed to follow through, iirc.

Just finished this - I for one was glad the murder wasn't a political conspiracy, it would have felt ridiculous.

Last episode is one of the most colossal letdowns I've had with a TV series, given it shows so much of the stuff from earlier in the series to have been pointless contrivance that's utterly ludicrous. I mean, the Jens Holck stuff - why would he have run someone over, then tried to kill Lund WHEN HE WASN'T EVEN GUILTY OF ANYTHING TO COVER UP?

Eh? He was guilty of having an affair with a schoolgirl using another party's flat and bribing a civil servant to keep quiet about it. That's not murder-level obviously but in normal political terms it's a career-ender and possibly illegal as well.

It only doesn't make sense if you assume it's calculated. Given all the above, when said schoolgirl was then found murdered having been attacked in a flat he'd been in, having made the bribes and tried to cover them up... he just became certain he was going down for it and panicked. It seemed like an open-and-shut case for everyone except Lund.

Also, I'd had Vagn pegged as the killer from very early on so was happy that played out. I don't understand why it's unforgiveable to so heavily hint at a conspiracy and for it then to turn out to be something else. What with him and Weber both being the guilty parties = never trust a loyal confidante with no initial discernable plot function.

finished this tonight. have to say it was good however after a while it's gets a bit cyclical and you never believe whoever ABSOLUTELY MUST BE GUILTY is guilty

By the third or fourth time this happened I just started to enjoy it, thrillers kind of have to do things like that to string the suspense out. Still, it did annoy me the number of times Troels Hartman had a "hey, we're in the clear!" kind of moment and then made some big public statement that then immediately blew up in his face. How many times did that happen?

Also the actors playing Nanna's parents were totally the best thing about this. And Meyer, I loved that guy.

Poor Meyer!

never trust a loyal confidante with no initial discernable plot function.

looool

Also I don't think Rie actually did anything wrong? Except maybe fucking that guy but equally maybe not. Hartman was just extremely paranoid at that point and a massive dick to her. But then he couldn't actually go back on that without hanging Weber out to dry, which would in turn break his career.

If I was a fictional citizen of Copenhagen I'd have been out on the streets in protest at the completely farcical state of my political system and police force but no one really seemed that arsed? And then Hartman just became mayor by default? Bit weird.

Does anyone know when the Killing 2 gets to be shown on the BBC? I thought it was scheduled for Autumn?

1st November according to someone on the Facebook page. DVD available on Amazon on 12th December.

1st november is a tuesday though. and these things are traditionally on the saturday.

they are currently showing the wallander films. last saturday was 'man who smiled' and next saturday is 'one step behind'. there are 2 more after that (firewall, pyramid) but the first is a two-parter. so i'd say the 5th or the 12th.

Sarah Lund fashion is so ubiquitous right now - I walked through a shopping centre today and saw nothing in windows but patterned knitwear.

tomorrow, bbc4 (and on front of radio times)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b017h80m

Beeb cuts back on sweariness

Don't think the swearing was particularly obtrusive in the first series - I don't think I even noticed any - but maybe I'm just desensitized to it.

I didn't notice it at all.

Thread needs Danes, are there any on ILX?

Didn't finish season one (got careless with the recording -- was on ep13), so just glad I can pick up on s2 independently of what happened, apart from a 'return from exile'.

Given some of the disussion from upthread it sounds like 10 eps is a good thing. Personally thought the 'this must be the guy' theory with any case falling apart by the end of the ep was a by product of putting a *day-by-day* investigation under the microscope. I was enjoying that.

Lund is not convinced
DURATION: 02:50
SERIES 2, EPISODE 10

Lund wants more information
DURATION: 01:13
SERIES 2, EPISODE 8

Lund pursuing suspect through an abattoir
DURATION: 02:36
SERIES 2, EPISODE 7

Where's the discussion for the 2nd season?! A lot more suspenseful than the 1st, I say. Possibly because death toll a lot higher.

ILX packed up during most of the month in which it was on hence the lack of discussion.

In the Sandox I said I enjoyed it, someone did say there were a lot of plot holes but I didn't get round to asking what those were - not that attentive, in need of repeats.

In the end I did like the political sub-plot although at the end 'the pact' just seemed like some sort political dark ages nonsense that was just placed there for Sarah to shoot to shit. But the politician was great, liked the shots of him strutting around with a toothbrush.

Also liked Sarah's reduced interaction w/her family. The whole 'no time for family' is a cliche I seldom care for in cop dramas however her scene w/parents in the taxi was the comic highlight (couldn't they go in separate taxis, sheesh!).

The reduction of episodes did allow for more suspense, felt trashier because of higher death toll, and I am always going to like that more.

**SPOLIER** One big plot hole was why did that one guy blow himself up? He was supposedly opposed to extremists and yet he kidnapped someone then detonated a suicide bomb. Didn't make a bit of sense, especially considering his innocence.

**More Spoliers** but wasn't he in a conspiracy with the Danish secret services, so the way I saw it was:

- He hated extreme islamists
- his crime was to let certain messages go by/not be interceted/flagged up, as this was an op that murdered Taliban informants (but also one in which innocents died)
- I think the kidnap/blowing himself up was to put all the guilty on himself, the guilty go free, allowing them to carry further naughty ops, killing more extremists. He didn't blow himself in a shaopping mall, it was an old military site where and no one else died

Anyone for Brogen?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/tv-and-radio/2012/jan/06/the-killing-sanish-drama-borgen

Not sure its gonna work. There is a real taste for crime, really. Put in the politics, just don't forget to bring a corpse.

Sorry Borgen

I think the kidnap/blowing himself up was to put all the guilty on himself, the guilty go free, allowing them to carry further naughty ops, killing more extremists. He didn't blow himself in a shaopping mall, it was an old military site where and no one else died

The putting-all-the-guilt-on-himself bit sounds plausible, but don't forget he almost blew up two police officers and Raben's wife in the process. Can't remember the details of some of the other bits that seemed a bit dubious, gonna have to tease them out of the recesses of my brain.

The way I recall he let Raben's wife go w/ease then displayed the explosives allowing both Lund and Srange enough time to run off.

Any reports on Borgen? I might start watching this on iPlayer

V much liked episode 1, family dynamic excellently done. Not sure I have the attention for something politics based though. Both Lund's partners from Killing 1 & 2 are in this btw.

Yes, (Killing Spoiler!) I kept expecting Strange actor to go on a murder spree. Not sure the politics will be enough for me either. I do really like some of the characters though. The spin doctor guy looks to be a good baddie.

they've done ok, especially episode 4 where they moved beyond the coalition-building back and forth. i liked the greenland montage, for instance.

I've just finished the first episode of Bron/Broen or just 'Bridge'. It's got that Killing gloomy feel. Anticipating watching the second one. I did love Borgen in the end. I liked how she transitioned from unlikely politician to, lets just say 'learning on the job'. There should be a collective scandinavian tv thread!

I really enjoyed the first two episodes of Bridge, partly because it uses the same central plot device as Bon Cop, Bad Cop.

It has the same kind of Northern European industrial noir feeling as The Killing but there's lots of comedy there as well.

anyone watching the third series? why does no-one finish their sentences on this show?

Yes. Because that's standard realism-tool. No one finishes their sentences in

We don't have time for that now - we have to bring the entire department where the killer isn't