OMG I WANT THIS AMAZING RONALDINHO BOTTLE OPENER

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you're the same person that was becky lucas, right?

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:26 (seventeen years ago) link

WHY ARE PEOPLE SO DETERMINED TO BE REMINDED OF A HISTORY OF CENTURIES OF UGLY HATEFUL CARICATURE, WHY CAN'T THEY SIMPLY NOT REMEMBER THAT SHIT WHEN THEY SEE SOMETHING UNCOMFORTABLY REMINISCENT OF IT

― ghost rider, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:27 (seventeen years ago) link

not you kevin, charles dickens upthread i meant

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:27 (seventeen years ago) link

LJ grunttfuttock in this country means a fat elf, so congrats you finally insulted me on the third try.

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:27 (seventeen years ago) link

for the record, i would NOT even for a MOMENT consider buying that bottle-opener.

― unfished business, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:27 (seventeen years ago) link

TOUCHÉ

― Dimension 5ive, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:28 (seventeen years ago) link

oh and :-D for the third-dart out-shot!

― unfished business, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:28 (seventeen years ago) link

I don't get the distinction some people keep making between the image "in itself" and the racist baggage of the image. it is what it "might unconsciously be," to use your words, Ailsa.

― horseshoe, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:28 (seventeen years ago) link

you know what kind of bottle opener is awesome? the kind that like says a funny saying when you open a bottle. i mean i wouldn't buy one but when my friends have them, it seems to discourage people from drinking because no one is interested in hearing the voice yelling at them about beer! i should get one and maybe, hey, more beer for me :D

the more you know!

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:29 (seventeen years ago) link

guys guys dontcha get it? alisa doesn't SEE race!

― kenan, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:29 (seventeen years ago) link

P.S. we've talked about this a little on the political cartoons thread -- how artists have to show a certain level of care when caricaturing certain people to make sure they don't accidentally just create race-caricatures. E.g., you don't "caricature" an Asian person's eyes so they look like some WWII-era Pacific-theater propaganda. If you're exaggerating an Israeli politician's large nose, you want to avoid drawing a guy that looks like he comes from Nazi handbooks. There's just a basic level of care and tact involved here, and some of us react when we feel that it's not being taken, or when it's being pointed -- consciously or not -- in the wrong direction. (E.g., I get annoyed by the way "terrorists" or "radical Islam" in political cartoons invariably have a foot-long nose whose tip points back toward the lips.) (Lucky for me, a deviated septum means my large nose is hooking slightly to the right instead.)

― nabisco, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:29 (seventeen years ago) link

BUT THE DARKIE TOOTHPASTE ETC IS REMINISCENT OF OPPRESSION, I GET THAT, WHEREAS THIS IS JUST LAUGHING AT A BLOKE WITH BIG TEETH.

some xposts, no doubt.

― ailsa, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:29 (seventeen years ago) link

okay, no one is saying, you fucking British racists I bet you all have lawn jockeys! can't we just acknowledge the way race operates without people getting all guilty and then defensive?

― horseshoe, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:30 (seventeen years ago) link

his teeth aren't even really that big. i mean his gums are pretty big but really it's difficult to gum open a bottle.

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:30 (seventeen years ago) link

http://www.enduringvision.com/archives/hitler.jpg

― Roberto Spiralli, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:30 (seventeen years ago) link

i mean, he is no john elway

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:30 (seventeen years ago) link

alisa, go buy some deodrant

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:30 (seventeen years ago) link

why is darkie toothpaste reminiscent of oppression? dude is just chillin in a top hat amirite

― and what, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:31 (seventeen years ago) link

Okay, okay, I get it. It's not so much that the makers of the opener don't mean it racially, or that a lot of people wouldn't interpret it racially, it's that some people could. In which case fair enough, best not to piss people off, I guess.

The next obvious question to ask is: since I didn't even consider it racist on 1st viewing, does it mean that a) I'm a blithering idiot who doesn't think of the perceived lineage of a joke when I see a joke, or b) I've come on enough (as have a lot of people) that I can see a joke about a black guy without thinking that the joke has anything to do with him being black?

It's c) both, I guess. Hmmm.

― The Wayward Johnny B, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:31 (seventeen years ago) link

(it makes me sad when y'all reference the Danish Muhammad cartoon thread because it makes me think all I have ever done on ILX is post 1 million times to the exact same types of thread)

― horseshoe, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:31 (seventeen years ago) link

i keep reading that as "i've been come on enough..." and laughing, like yeah that is why i don't see race anymore too!!

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:32 (seventeen years ago) link

Johnney B OTM (and far more concise and eloquent than I). Want to call him a smelly Britisher for it too?

― ailsa, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:32 (seventeen years ago) link

IT MEANS YOU ARE OH SO MUCH MORE ENLIGHTENED THAN US, OH BRAVE AND OPEN-MINDED BRITISH PERSON, PLEASE USE MORE BULLSHIT LANGUAGE ABOUT HAVING "COME ON ENOUGH" UNTIL WE SEE THE WISENESS OF YOUR HAPPY, POST-RACE, UNITED FEDERATION OF PLANETS WAYS

― ghost rider, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:33 (seventeen years ago) link

but i think it's so OBVIOUS to most that to not see beyond it would require ignoring it. and quietly ignoring a racist aspect to something tacitly approves it. i think that's part of it

I agree with that. Before I even read the rest of this thread, I saw the first image that Nick posted and was like "holy shit, racist much?"

― jaymc, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:33 (seventeen years ago) link

wait johnny b comes on soccer players?

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:33 (seventeen years ago) link

yay roasting

― unfished business, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:34 (seventeen years ago) link

no no they come on him :D

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:34 (seventeen years ago) link

johnny b comes on *black* soccer players

― kenan, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:35 (seventeen years ago) link

omg ashl3y c0l3 and jerma1n3 j3nas to thread

― unfished business, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:35 (seventeen years ago) link

Arf, yes, you guys have evolved into blissfully ignorance of the issues. I look forward to your evolving so far past class issues that you ask homeless people if they can give you some spare change.

― nabisco, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:36 (seventeen years ago) link

http://www.undertheradarmag.com/goldie_glcalbumcover.jpg

― Dimension 5ive, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:36 (seventeen years ago) link

hahaha YES LET'S TALK ABOUT CLASS NOW

― ghost rider, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:36 (seventeen years ago) link

the point with this particular caricature is that Ronaldinho is, in particular and above all else, physically associated with having big teeth. this is not just a British or even European thing, as you can tell by a quick google image search. it doesn't even matter if he actually has big teeth - this is the genral public perception of him, hence the caricature. it's not just that one man who happens to have big teeth - Ronaldinho IS big teeth. the fact that the resulting caricature ends up looking similar to some old racist caricatures is a valid reason for some people not to want to own one themselves. it does not make it as bad as those racist caricatures, unless you lack the mental faculty to discriminate* between things that looks the same but aren't.

*unfortunate, but apt, verb

― Roberto Spiralli, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:36 (seventeen years ago) link

he is like a tiny kitty and i guess i like that in my shortstops
he is like a tiny kitty and i guess i like that in my shortstops
he is like a tiny kitty and i guess i like that in my shortstops
he is like a tiny kitty and i guess i like that in my shortstops
he is like a tiny kitty and i guess i like that in my shortstops
he is like a tiny kitty and i guess i like that in my shortstops
he is like a tiny kitty and i guess i like that in my shortstops
he is like a tiny kitty and i guess i like that in my shortstops

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:36 (seventeen years ago) link

mr que otm

― ghost rider, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:37 (seventeen years ago) link

this thread was going somewhere when we were talking about ejaculate.

― kenan, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:37 (seventeen years ago) link

roberto, are you even a real person?

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:37 (seventeen years ago) link

i've evolved so much that i don't think twice about dropping N-bombs at naacp meetings because, hey, i just don't recognize race.

― chicago kevin, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:38 (seventeen years ago) link

KENAN WHY DO YOU ALWAYS WANT TO COME ON MY FACE

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:39 (seventeen years ago) link

i believe i am a real person, but who really knows for sure? what did happen at the end of Blade Runner?

― Roberto Spiralli, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:39 (seventeen years ago) link

in my country , "N-bombs" are a kind of tasty candy ! Nice try , American Kevin from Chicagoland !

― Dimension 5ive, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:39 (seventeen years ago) link

Hang on, are we in trouble now for *not* being racist?

Kevin, who the fuck on this thread has actually given any indication that they might do that?

― ailsa, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:39 (seventeen years ago) link

*moment of realisation* fucking hell this is one of the worst things on the internet ever EVER EVER.

it's been nice shitting with you guys

― unfished business, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:40 (seventeen years ago) link

i do not have to come on your face. go ahead, turn over.

― kenan, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:40 (seventeen years ago) link

i've evolved so much that i don't even have to call you limey retards, just retards

― pretzel walrus, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:40 (seventeen years ago) link

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/158/421226508_7e287c479e_o.png

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:40 (seventeen years ago) link

I'm British. I read the first post, didn't find it funny, but it never occurred to me that it was racist. My housemate is from LA. I showed it to her after reading the shitstorm upthread, and she immediately said, "are there white ones too?" and found it a troubling image. That was before I showed her the rest of the thread. As Johnny B said, it's not unreasonable for it genuinely not to occur to people that the image might be offensive to others. FWIW, I get the same feeling I think a lot of the Americans on this thread are getting when I see Jamaicans or Indians or Pakistanis portrayed in U.S. culture (dude in Van Wilder, Hermes from Futurama), etc. Equally, anyone claiming that they can't understand why people might find that bottle opener offensive, after they've had it explained to them, is being disingenuous.

So, what I take away from this thread: cultures be different, and thank god for the killfile. Post by unfished business deleted = mmmm.

― caek, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:41 (seventeen years ago) link

i lack the mental faculty to know where (and on whom) i'm dropping a load am i retarted y/n?

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:41 (seventeen years ago) link

Hang on, are we in trouble now for *not* being racist?

i don't think anyone is in *trouble* for anything. i think "being mocked" is closer to it. it's a logical extension of the "not seeing race" stance. do keep up.

― chicago kevin, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:42 (seventeen years ago) link

I get the same feeling I think a lot of the Americans on this thread are getting when I see Jamaicans or Indians or Pakistanis portrayed in U.S. culture (dude in Van Wilder, Hermes from Futurama), etc.

This is very otm.

― G00blar, Thursday, 22 March 2007 20:43 (seventeen years ago) link

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