No, no, this is totally OTM. It would be even more OTM if you could swap Monster for Out of Time.
― rogermexico (rogermexico), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 02:45 (eighteen years ago) link
And it's LRP 6-4 + whatever credit attaches to Underneath the Bunker. Very gratified to see so much love here for "Just a Touch" -- the one song I'd really have liked to see them play.
LRP and Document were probably my two favorite R.E.M. records in 1991, but "The One I Love" and "End of the World" haven't aged as well as some of the other hitzzzz (though the great ending of EotW sneaks it past Amanita still.) I think Murmur beats both of these.
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 02:58 (eighteen years ago) link
But with time, I came to see it as what it is: a - may I say this? - tour de force of R.E.M.'s strengths. It's like a showcase of their considerable powers. "Fall on Me" (Michael's favorite, as you may know) is essence of R.E.M., with Mike Mills harmonies and jangling (I'm a rock critic!) guitars. And the rest of the songs already cited showed how R.E.M. could swing from folk to rock and back again.
So yeah, it's an odd little album. It's weird, because its perfection somehow, oddly, makes it forgotten. It seems like it's universally acclaimed, yet rarely discussed. Almost taken for granted.
But that may just be me.
― Justin, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 03:22 (eighteen years ago) link
― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 03:26 (eighteen years ago) link
it augurs a rather uneven period from which they didn't emerge until the release of Out of Time
green is better than both of these and out of time.
TS: "Rain On The Scarecrow" vs "I Believe"
"Rain on the Scarecrow" kicks just about any song's ass up, down and sideways.
― my name is john. i reside in chicago. (frankE), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 03:34 (eighteen years ago) link
I might agree with this. Actually, I think Fables WOULD HAVE been their best album if it had been produced better.
― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 03:46 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 03:52 (eighteen years ago) link
― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 03:57 (eighteen years ago) link
― Vinegar and Artichoke Hearts (Bimble...), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 03:59 (eighteen years ago) link
― rogermexico (rogermexico), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 04:07 (eighteen years ago) link
So Alfred are you saying it's only almost-great because some of the lyrics are opaque? Might have been full-on great if he'd been saying something more explicit?
I saw them do it live a couple of years ago and he was talking about how he never gets to catch his breath in the song and (goofing) fell down when it was over.
Do it sound to anyone like a different take punched in when he gets to the line "Trust in your calling?"
― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 04:14 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 04:15 (eighteen years ago) link
Lifes Rich Pageant, though I've burned out on bits of it a little, and NEVER liked What If We Give It Away, is just packed with great songs that SOUND great. No contest.
― Doctor Casino, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 04:38 (eighteen years ago) link
always thought it was "i believe the poles are shifting"
― hstencil (hstencil), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 04:39 (eighteen years ago) link
― clotpoll, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 06:56 (eighteen years ago) link
― Dr X O'Skeleton, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 10:26 (eighteen years ago) link
― Greig (treefell), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 10:35 (eighteen years ago) link
But yes, LRP is pretty much perfect - great songs, lots of variety, stellar lead and backing vox and a really punchy, garagey sound. No duff tracks, in comparison with the wretched 'It's the End Of The World', and the dull Fireplace and Lightnin' Hopkins. I'm not sure about Exhuming McCarthy either. I hated it at first, but now I think it's a half-written curio, perhaps not bad, but sub-standard definitely. I've always loved Welcome To The Occupation - great vocals on that, especially near the end : 'Listen To Meee, LISTEN to MEEE'.
I also think that Fables might be the best of the lot though.
― Dr.C, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 11:22 (eighteen years ago) link
― Dr XO'Skeleton, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 13:06 (eighteen years ago) link
― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 13:36 (eighteen years ago) link
― retrogurl, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 13:52 (eighteen years ago) link
It's his enunciation that's imprecise.
― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 13:55 (eighteen years ago) link
― Dr X O'Skeleton, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 14:29 (eighteen years ago) link
― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 14:33 (eighteen years ago) link
― Dr X O'Skeleton, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 14:57 (eighteen years ago) link
― kornrulez6969 (TCBeing), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 15:20 (eighteen years ago) link
― dan. (dan.), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 17:47 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 17:56 (eighteen years ago) link
― dan. (dan.), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 18:05 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 18:06 (eighteen years ago) link
― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 18:09 (eighteen years ago) link
― dan. (dan.), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 18:10 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 18:21 (eighteen years ago) link
If you really stretch the idea, "Disturbance at the Heron House" has a subtle political message, though, even if it is (I agree) child-like (but not childish). It's somewhat of a cry against mindlessly obeying authority. And it has a nice opening riff from Peter Buck to coat the messsage.
― James, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 18:24 (eighteen years ago) link
― mrjosh (mrjosh), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 19:07 (eighteen years ago) link
― mrjosh (mrjosh), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 19:08 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 19:15 (eighteen years ago) link
"You're sharpening stones, walking on coalsTo improve your business acumen."
and
"Vested interest united ties, landed gentry rationalizeLook who bought the myth, buy jingo, buy America"
I don't know, I think that's much more clear (and less subtle) than anything on LRP, though I like the song enough, anyway (just the sharp horn-break with the "McCarthy hearings" sound-bite is enough for me to like it).
― James, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 19:24 (eighteen years ago) link
― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 19:33 (eighteen years ago) link
― dan. (dan.), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 19:38 (eighteen years ago) link
― js (honestengine), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 19:56 (eighteen years ago) link
Put a gun to my head and demand I choose one over the other, I'd probably go with LRP. That being said, Document heads into some interesting sonic territory on side two, once you pass "The One I Love." I'm thinking of "Fireplace," "Lightning Hopkins" and "Oddfellows 151" in particular. The band cooked up some new studio ideas with percussion and guitar for those, leading to a new style for them, kind of a feeback laden, Mission of Burma/Gang of Four-ish style, with maybe even some Sonic Youth moves dropped in (I'm pretty sure Peter Buck was name dropping SY in the press by 1987).
― James, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 20:04 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 20:12 (eighteen years ago) link
― kyle (akmonday), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 20:24 (eighteen years ago) link
But, recently a friend gave me a dvd of an rem concert on some german show (the same show that wire dvd is from) and it was in support of fables and they played hyena and fall on me (with improvised verses), so they definitely wrote those themselves.
― josecanseco, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 20:59 (eighteen years ago) link
― James, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 21:16 (eighteen years ago) link
whoa! can anyone else substantiate this?
― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 21:26 (eighteen years ago) link
It's tough.
― the bellefox, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 21:29 (eighteen years ago) link
it was a secret supposedly to the public, but in athens people were like "oh yeah that guy just lives off of rem royalties because he wrote most of lifes rich pageant". and these were mutual friends saying this. i never knew him well enough to hear it from his mouth, but that's what his friends said. i remember thinking at the time it was weird that someone could just live off of songwriting royalties but now that i know more about bizzzzzzzzzzz it makes sense.
― josecanseco, Tuesday, 6 December 2005 21:53 (eighteen years ago) link
― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 22:39 (eighteen years ago) link
a mean idea to call my owna hundred million birds fly away
― reggie (qualmsley), Tuesday, 5 November 2019 21:41 (four years ago) link
a meager thing, recognition
― reggie (qualmsley), Tuesday, 5 November 2019 22:10 (four years ago) link
I miss the days when there were so many R.E.M. threads we were bored of them.
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Tuesday, 5 November 2019 22:10 (four years ago) link
fly to carry each his burden
― reggie (qualmsley), Tuesday, 14 July 2020 23:03 (three years ago) link
that's great, it starts with
― FAC 179 (morrisp), Tuesday, 14 July 2020 23:05 (three years ago) link
happy throngs, take this joy whereverwherever the tax returns are
― mookieproof, Tuesday, 14 July 2020 23:07 (three years ago) link
Offering the educatedPrimitive and loyal
― Mule, Wednesday, 15 July 2020 04:58 (three years ago) link
Our father's father's father triedErased the parts he didn't like
― the body of a spider... (scampering alpaca), Wednesday, 15 July 2020 13:10 (three years ago) link
What the heck is going on at the beginning of “Superman”?
― Robert Gotopieces (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 5 December 2020 21:02 (three years ago) link
The scratchy spoken intro is attributed to a Japanese pull-string Godzilla doll.[3] Translated loosely from the Japanese, it says, "This is a special news report. Godzilla has been sighted in Tokyo Bay. The attack on it by the Self-Defense Force has been useless. He is heading towards the city. Aaaaaaaaagh...."
― wet tip hen ax (egg drop mix) (morrisp), Saturday, 5 December 2020 21:15 (three years ago) link
Oh yeah, I do hear the word “Gojira” now
― Robert Gotopieces (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 5 December 2020 22:18 (three years ago) link
I think 'Disturbance At The Heron House' might be one of his finest vocal melodies, I often wonder if it was difficult to replicate in a live setting because he always used a slightly lower, less vaulting melody.
― Maresn3st, Sunday, 6 December 2020 09:26 (three years ago) link
Not my favourite R.E.M. era. Picking "Life's Right Pageant" because "Fall On Me".
― The GeirBot (Geir Hongro), Sunday, 6 December 2020 22:58 (three years ago) link
Life's Rich Pageant is gorgeous, but I dunno it was a more vulnerable time for me and I can't listen to it. At the time I liked it more, but now that I'm a mean crusty old fart, I prefer Document 'cos it's louder and darker.
― Totally Insane Police State, 90210 (I M Losted), Monday, 7 December 2020 12:15 (three years ago) link
Fables > LRP > Document
I think. I love it all but Document seems a little... icy?
― that is how it crumbles cookiewise (Ye Mad Puffin), Monday, 7 December 2020 15:34 (three years ago) link
Icy? It's literally the one they told you to "File Under Fire"!
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Monday, 7 December 2020 16:40 (three years ago) link
document has a hell of a side two cf. "fireplace". i prob prefer it to both fables and lrp at this point, it's so endearingly odd and transitional
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Monday, 7 December 2020 16:42 (three years ago) link
I was actually just listening to Document straight through for the first time in a couple of years and "fire" is the right word for it. "Finest Worksong" sounds to me like a band that's just absolutely GOING for it, straining to throw every possible sound at the problem.
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Monday, 7 December 2020 16:43 (three years ago) link
also forever thankful to r.e.m. for introducing me to wire. great cover too
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Monday, 7 December 2020 16:44 (three years ago) link
That cover is probably the best representation in their official recorded output of the insanely great house party band they were in 1980-81
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Monday, 7 December 2020 16:47 (three years ago) link
good point! you can hear a twisted version of that party on "Lightnin' Hopkins" too.
side 2 of Document is brittle spooky forest music, like let's rub ourselves in mud and run through the jungle, way past the Heron House
― All cars are bad (Euler), Monday, 7 December 2020 17:00 (three years ago) link
OTM Brad. I think side 2 of Document is a career highlight. If LRP was a tentative exploration of how they could pursue a more direct sound and remain eccentric, Document is a band fully at home in it's new sound, finding out it's still a pretty weird place anyway.
― campreverb, Monday, 7 December 2020 21:15 (three years ago) link
I adore Document.
― sctttnnnt (pgwp), Tuesday, 8 December 2020 00:51 (three years ago) link
you're not yet youngthere's time to teach
― reggie (qualmsley), Wednesday, 28 February 2024 22:07 (two months ago) link
Swan Swan H < King of Birds (close)
I no longer thing this is close, King of Birds by a wide margin (but both are great)
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Wednesday, 28 February 2024 22:58 (two months ago) link