― Barima (Barima), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 11:55 (nineteen years ago) link
― Super-Kate (kate), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 11:58 (nineteen years ago) link
It's three bars of 3/4 and one of 4/4 per verse, innit?
― Palomino (Palomino), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 12:01 (nineteen years ago) link
71 - James Brown, "It's a Man's Man's Man's World"
― Joseph McCombs, Tuesday, 4 May 2004 12:02 (nineteen years ago) link
― paulhw (paulhw), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 12:03 (nineteen years ago) link
predictable enough?
― umop apisdn (umop apisdn), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 12:07 (nineteen years ago) link
― Barima (Barima), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 12:22 (nineteen years ago) link
― mark grout (mark grout), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 12:25 (nineteen years ago) link
― gygax! (gygax!), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 13:12 (nineteen years ago) link
― Barima (Barima), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 13:21 (nineteen years ago) link
― mms (mms), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 13:23 (nineteen years ago) link
Anyway, 56. A Minor Forest - ...But the Pants Stay On
― Colin Meeder (Mert), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 13:32 (nineteen years ago) link
54. Eno - Back In Judy's Jungle
― Myonga Von Bontee (Myonga Von Bontee), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 13:40 (nineteen years ago) link
― Barima (Barima), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 13:48 (nineteen years ago) link
― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 13:50 (nineteen years ago) link
― Rush Rhees (Rush Rhees), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 13:57 (nineteen years ago) link
― Joseph McCombs, Tuesday, 4 May 2004 16:03 (nineteen years ago) link
― Jamie Fake (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 18:10 (nineteen years ago) link
― Marcel Post (Marcel Post), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 18:26 (nineteen years ago) link
― Jordan (Jordan), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 18:29 (nineteen years ago) link
― Mr. Snrub (Mr. Snrub), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 18:44 (nineteen years ago) link
― hstencil (hstencil), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 19:44 (nineteen years ago) link
― fact checking cuz (fcc), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 19:49 (nineteen years ago) link
― dave q, Tuesday, 4 May 2004 19:52 (nineteen years ago) link
― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 19:55 (nineteen years ago) link
― Barry Bruner (Barry Bruner), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 20:10 (nineteen years ago) link
― Barima (Barima), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 20:51 (nineteen years ago) link
― Atnevon (Atnevon), Tuesday, 4 May 2004 22:11 (nineteen years ago) link
― Nice Pete, Wednesday, 5 May 2004 05:13 (nineteen years ago) link
― Sasha (sgh), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 05:47 (nineteen years ago) link
(...30. it should be, perhaps? for Alex fired in, attention span-lessly, Stranglers' "Golden Brown" that had already been mentioned upthread)
― t\'\'t (t\'\'t), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 07:50 (nineteen years ago) link
29. Kantner/Slick/Freiberg, "Harp Tree Lament" (my favorite Robert Hunter lyric)
― Joseph McCombs, Wednesday, 5 May 2004 12:57 (nineteen years ago) link
― Huey (Huey), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 13:05 (nineteen years ago) link
― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 13:11 (nineteen years ago) link
― Donna Brown (Donna Brown), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 18:26 (nineteen years ago) link
― Barima (Barima), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 18:32 (nineteen years ago) link
― mookieproof (mookieproof), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 19:56 (nineteen years ago) link
― Donna Brown (Donna Brown), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 19:58 (nineteen years ago) link
― mei (mei), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 20:04 (nineteen years ago) link
21. Elvis Costello - "Sunday's Best"
― Nag! Nag! Nag! (Nag! Nag! Nag!), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 23:15 (nineteen years ago) link
― jazz odysseus (jazz odysseus), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 23:24 (nineteen years ago) link
― gygax! (gygax!), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 23:25 (nineteen years ago) link
― gygax! (gygax!), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 23:26 (nineteen years ago) link
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 5 May 2004 23:37 (nineteen years ago) link
― not Graham (Inuuu), Wednesday, 5 May 2004 23:48 (nineteen years ago) link
― Curt1s St3ph3ns, Thursday, 6 May 2004 00:36 (nineteen years ago) link
― Curt1s St3ph3ns, Thursday, 6 May 2004 00:38 (nineteen years ago) link
― Curt1s St3ph3ns, Thursday, 6 May 2004 00:39 (nineteen years ago) link
― ipsofacto (ipsofacto), Thursday, 6 May 2004 00:50 (nineteen years ago) link
― Trayce (trayce), Thursday, 6 May 2004 05:39 (nineteen years ago) link
"Has he got a friend for me"
― thomasintrouble, Saturday, 18 January 2020 16:08 (four years ago) link
Donovan - "Catch the Wind". "Norwegian Wood" is probably the best but it was nominated in the second post.
"Piano Man" and "Try Not to Breathe" are in 12/8 imo.
― One must put up barriers to keep oneself intact (Sund4r), Sunday, 19 January 2020 00:20 (four years ago) link
Ha, online sheet music seems to transcribe "Piano Man" in either 3/4 or 6/8 so. I can see how 6/8 makes sense but the drum beat doesn't support counting it in 3/4 imo.
― One must put up barriers to keep oneself intact (Sund4r), Sunday, 19 January 2020 00:27 (four years ago) link
Thread title says waltz time. I'm using the more expansive definition of waltz time as any triple meter.
― o. nate, Sunday, 19 January 2020 02:12 (four years ago) link
At least in standard classical theory, 6/8 = (compound) duple metre; 12/8 = (compound) quadruple metre.
― One must put up barriers to keep oneself intact (Sund4r), Sunday, 19 January 2020 02:38 (four years ago) link
I'm using the more expansive definition of triple meter as any meter with a waltz feel.
― o. nate, Sunday, 19 January 2020 02:43 (four years ago) link
"Try Not to Breathe" (is) in 12/8 imo.This article on the song suggests it may actually be 6/8:
The waltzing instrumental returned for the 1992 demo and recording sessions for Automatic, some of which took place at Woodstock, N.Y.’s Bearsville Sound Studios. At that point, the song was nicknamed “6/8 Sailor” for its time signature, then was marked “Passion” when the final touches were added at Bad Animals in Seattle.Read More: Michael Stipe Explores Life’s Last Moments with ‘Try Not to Breathe’: The Story Behind Every ‘Automatic for the People' Song | https://diffuser.fm/rem-try-not-to-breathe/?utm_source=tsmclip&utm_medium=referral
― stop creeping my instagram storiez (morrisp), Sunday, 19 January 2020 02:45 (four years ago) link
(sorry, don’t know that extra junk came along with the paragraph I pasted.)
― stop creeping my instagram storiez (morrisp), Sunday, 19 January 2020 02:46 (four years ago) link
I mean isn't "Norwegian Wood" more 6/8 too? I wouldn't be suprised if a lot of pop/rock songs with a waltz feel are 6/8 rather than 3/4.
― o. nate, Sunday, 19 January 2020 02:47 (four years ago) link
Apparently the official sheet music of "Norwegian Wood" has 12/8, and "Piano Man"'s has 3/4. I rest my case!
― o. nate, Sunday, 19 January 2020 02:54 (four years ago) link
The beat and phrasing in "Try Not to Breathe" suggest groupings of 4 to me but duple vs quadruple can get blurry with pop music.
I agree that 6/8 works with the phrasing of "Norwegian Wood", and I'm pretty sure I've actually used it as an example of 6/8 previously. I think I would still object to identifying a waltz feel in anything with an obvious backbeat.
xp
― One must put up barriers to keep oneself intact (Sund4r), Sunday, 19 January 2020 02:55 (four years ago) link
Where did you find the official sheet music?
― One must put up barriers to keep oneself intact (Sund4r), Sunday, 19 January 2020 02:58 (four years ago) link
Well, just looking at the first page of the most reputable looking sheet music that came up on the first page of Google results, with official looking copyright etc. I admit this may not be the dispositive finding.
― o. nate, Sunday, 19 January 2020 03:00 (four years ago) link
Even the 'scores' that get registered with copyright offices are often after-the-fact, sometimes sketched-out transcriptions and are not necessarily dispositive tbh. The Donovan song is actually one of the only rock-era songs I can think of that feels to be inarguably in triple metre to me, not counting songs with 3/4 passages juxtaposed with other metres (Rush - Limelight, Sonic Youth - Pipeline/Kill Time). "Get to You" is mostly 5/4, surely, except for the bridge.
― One must put up barriers to keep oneself intact (Sund4r), Sunday, 19 January 2020 03:08 (four years ago) link
"Cloudbusting" another example of a song that moves between 4 and 3.
― One must put up barriers to keep oneself intact (Sund4r), Sunday, 19 January 2020 03:09 (four years ago) link
I just noticed that the Byrds song I nominated in the first post all those years ago is actually 5/4 much of the time, only moving to 3/4 in certain sections. LOL. (Arguably making it *more* noteworthy, but not so great as an opening post re 3/4.)
― Nag! Nag! Nag!, Sunday, 19 January 2020 03:17 (four years ago) link
Haha XP!!
― Nag! Nag! Nag!, Sunday, 19 January 2020 03:20 (four years ago) link
xxxp I get you on the fuzziness of sheet music in this context. The canonical text for rock/pop is the recording, and different people can interpret it differently. Heck probably even different musicians who played on it interpreted it differently (such as the drummer vs the singer or guitarist).
― o. nate, Sunday, 19 January 2020 03:32 (four years ago) link
yeah most triple meter rock songs are in 6/8 (or use a shuffle beat in 12/8 a la everybody wants to rule the world or never tear us apart). 3/4 time is less driving, it can feel a little stilted in a rock context. 6/8 swings, sounds great in power ballads (we are the champions, nothing else matters)
― culture of mayordom (voodoo chili), Sunday, 19 January 2020 04:27 (four years ago) link
actually never tear us apart is def 6/8 isn't it?
― culture of mayordom (voodoo chili), Sunday, 19 January 2020 04:28 (four years ago) link
I'd definitely say 12/8. The chords change once every twelve eighth notes (four beats), the melodic phrases are built around the 12 (or 4) groupings, the guitar plays at the beginning of each grouping of 12 when it enters.
― One must put up barriers to keep oneself intact (Sund4r), Sunday, 19 January 2020 04:44 (four years ago) link
When there is a standard rock backbeat that would be analysed as 4/4 at any other time, it generally seems most logical/natural to me to continue counting it as quadruple metre even if it is subdivided into triplets, so I tend to default to 12/8 in these situations unless there is a really compelling reason to count 6/8.
― One must put up barriers to keep oneself intact (Sund4r), Sunday, 19 January 2020 04:49 (four years ago) link
Neil Young's "Only Love Can Break Your Heart" feels like an actual triple metre to me: the drums are actually playing groups of 3, the chords change once every three beats. Agree with "Manic Depression" upthread as well.
― One must put up barriers to keep oneself intact (Sund4r), Sunday, 19 January 2020 04:59 (four years ago) link
The canonical text for rock/pop is the recording, and different people can interpret it differently. Heck probably even different musicians who played on it interpreted it differently (such as the drummer vs the singer or guitarist).
(I agree with this 100%, to be clear. Obv there are wrong interpretations but there can definitely be multiple credible interpretations.)
― One must put up barriers to keep oneself intact (Sund4r), Sunday, 19 January 2020 05:02 (four years ago) link
"Cloudbusting" moves between 4/4 and 6/4, sorry. Remembered wrong.
― One must put up barriers to keep oneself intact (Sund4r), Sunday, 19 January 2020 05:12 (four years ago) link