should i give the grateful dead a chance?

You obviously never heard Branford Marsalis jam with them, then.

Nope, and although I'm sure he's, uh, "funkier" than his brother, I can't imagine his jams with the Dead approach the instrumental break of "Can You Hear Me Knocking" (which was, after all, used by many a black "urban" radio station in the 1970s as promo music). Anyway, the point was that the claim that "Can You Hear Me Knocking" sounds like the Dead is way, way off-base.

''I think that Deadheadism is caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain. If you have it, you will like them. If you do not have it, then no ammount of "Dude, no, you have to hear this most ultimate jam session that they did on this super-rare collectible live bootleg out- take from 1973..." in the world will ever convince you to find even a modicum of interest.''

it's bollocks! any band will have it's fans and haters but to dismiss it as 'chemical imbalance' is bullshit. Plus the 'annihalate' line (see dave q's ans).

Personally, the only song of theirs that I can instantly recognize is "Touch Of Grey". I'm fine with that.

If you're still hell bent on checking out the Dead, I'd start with any of the Dick's Picks live releases from 1972 or earlier. Even then, listening to them are like trying to dig for gold in a mine that's been completely played out. There's a lot of shovelling involved for very little payoff.

How is the Grateful Dead any different?

There must just be a neurotransmitter that makes people like SHIT, that is the explanation.

i so hope this is the guy i had a crush on at school

and how did you carry out yr study? was the sample large enough?

but seriously: yes I agree that by taking drugs you alter experiences to music. But i have never taken drugs and yet i enjoy the dead's music.

Anyway, which drug would make you like the dead? or is it a combination? Can you try it kate and give me some 'feedback'.

i'd also throw in Zappa and the Mothers, but they weren't really hippies

The jams. Yes, you often have to wade through a fair bit of aimless noodling (which still sounds OK, even if the attention does wander a bit). But that's the price you pay for when they're really ON, when the band really kick off, find a great groove or head off in some unexpected direction. It's because they take the risks that they're capable of producing such great stuff when it comes off.

The synthesis they reach of all strands of Amercian music. In a similar way to The Band, but if anything broader, they bring together blues, bluegrass, rock 'n' roll, r&b, country, jazz, folk and avant garde experimentation. They're the closest anyone's come to achieving Gram Parsons' concept of 'cosmic American music'.

The songs. As with the music, they've made a conscious attempt to create/embellish mythic American tales. Whether it's from their own history ('Truckin', 'The Other one'), classic myths ('Casey Jones', 'Staggerlee'), new tales ('Friend of the Devil') or well-chosen covers ('Mama tried').

And yes, they do sound good on drugs as well.

If anyone's not been put off by the 90% slagging they get above, then apart from the recent box set you'd get a good range of what they're about by getting 'Workingman's Dead', 'Live Dead', 'Hundred Year Hall' and the 'Grayfolded' collaboration with John Oswald as mentioned by Chris above.

(i'm usually not this irrational and flat-out dismissive, but if you can't already tell i see no redeeming qualities to the Grateful Dead's music whatsoever)

now you must die, then! ;-)

(that set is really down-home. nothing out or crazy long. old-fashioned.)

many difficult-to-identify sounds on "What's Become of the Baby"

all-time wiki writing tbh

The uncontroversial part of my take is that I agree with Scott, one drummer Dead before the hiatus in '75 was peak Dead. Kreutzmann was a better drummer and allowed the Dead to turn on a dime in the jazzier years.

The somewhat controversial part of my take is that the Dead would have been a far less interesting band in the '80s and '90s without Mickey back in the fold. Mickey was a worse drummer, but I think he was often the main one still pulling the psychedelic thread in the later years. "Drums > Space" was not everyone's cup of tea, but in those later years it was sometimes the only moment in the show where they dipped a toe in those cosmic waters.

i do agree with all that. having said that, i don't listen to 80s and 90s Dead much unless someone tells me its a truly great show.

dual drummer arrangement in the 70s lost all the ferocity they had in the late 60s. bludgeoning is not a word i'd often use for the dead but some of those 'other ones' are gnarly

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KE66xE2bk5M

however, most all drum 'solos' or features or whatever, first nine minutes of this included, are dire

again, without a net, ffs

that's what happens when you try to play triplets with four hands

this is what i'm talking about when i talk about how much i love the one drummer approach. i much prefer it. so good! well, they had the right one drummer for it. that helps. i mean i get that the mickey/bill combo is part of the mythos...and before 1972 i feel like i enjoy it more? i dunno. anyway, this is a really good show.

Europe 72 is among my favorite dead, and I also never felt like Mickey added much tbh. I mean sometimes he does, but a lot of my favorite stuff is one drummer.

there are euro 1972 shows where BK gives krautrock drummers a run for their money!

yes! The dude was a machine. I also sometimes think of krautrock when I hear those shows.

Riiight. Nothing evidences precision motorik quite like a double Bill / Mickey fill

no we are talking just bill. in europe. in 1972.

do keep up

Jon otm. Billy was better but Mickey preserved a lot of the psychedelic mysticism that defined them from the start. The freakin' beam is still a fixture of dead & co drums into space and it's still a bone rattling thrill to hear it live. Also, the best studio recording of playing in the band was on Mickey's solo album Rolling Thunder, horns and all: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZE7-2Qo9FTc

Listened to the Truckin'>Mind Left Body Jam>Spanish Jam>Wharf Rat on 07/31/74 during a night drive through the country. It's pretty sweet.

anyone know of any other good instances where they go hard, like the end of sunshine daydream's (1972-08-27) dark star?

early "The Other Ones" are the first one that comes to mind. can't name a particular show, unfortunately. i just know they could get pretty gnarly before Weir's vocals hit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0Sx0Li9gQs

I would like to apologize in this public forum to Michael Steven Hartman, aka Mickey Hart, for anything I might have said to disparage his involvement with the GD. I stayed up until 2 AM last night watching the closing of Winterland video and him and Bill are having so much fun together and Mickey is just bashing away like a kid and they sound really cool and the band sounds awesome and Donna's vibe is awesome and I just love hearing them like that and it reminded me of how great they could sound when they all play together in sync. or in Dead sync anyway. and i love that opening 1-2-3 punch of sugar magnolia/scarlet begonias/fire on the mountain and i love that not fade away with john cipollina. Sorry, Mickey!

I’ve written about my love for Dozin’ at the Knick, it was my gateway Dead record. I went to see a local band cover the whole show last night and had so much fun. “Terrapin” delivered all the spacy funky prog goodness.

someone brought stuff in to trade including cd sets of 12/10/71 fox theatre and june 10 1973 rfk stadium. that is my era. well, i do love the 60s dead too. gonna take them home. feel like 1970 to 1973 dead was the best american folk rock band in the land.

i've never read about the dead's impact around the world. who loved them? where did they hit big with people? were they beloved in japan? south america? they never went to those places. did the krautrockers listen to them? there should be a book about that. maybe there is one.

I think that 6/10/73 show is the longest ever and has part of the Allman Bros sitting in for the third set. It's a fun show.

yah i think its 4 discs.

It's 8LPs(!) because they try to avoid splitting the songs.

jam much?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VtJ8FIWx8og

i can't remember if i already posted this here. if i did its worth posting twice. so cool.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3H-CW12fBNA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8oV1mUEWlk

#onethread