overplayed style

tl;dr -- both of these styles in their purest form just scream "old money" to me.

Well duh.

I'm not saying they aren't a luxury or that I didn't buy them in part on looks (same reason I always loved Docs - they were suitable for all occasions). But their construction was also a legit selling point for me.

yeah I think this is a fine way to put it...I just dislike when someone tries to argue that by buying expensive shit they're actually being very pragmatic people who are saving money. I mean there are probably some cases when this is true (when the $ margin between expensive and cheap isn't huge but the quality margin is) but it's realllly not a universal truth.

ugh i should just figure out how to make $$$ on the cult of authenticity, then i wouldn't sound like such a hater

selling thrifted brooks bros makers ties @ $40 a pop (i have been considering this tbh)

Kind of disagree about what real-world people do. If you work construction for a living, you buy the best tools you can afford. Ridgid, for instance, costs more but they're robust and when we do manage to jack one up I've got a lifetime warranty from any Home Depot.

teak credenza

can I just

just figure out what the next in line value to be considered authentic is elmo

ugh i should just figure out how to make $$$ on the cult of authenticity, then i wouldn't sound like such a hater

Style blog, duh.

I'd never heard of Filson before this thread and I don't know any of these boot manufacturers, really I am not up on what constitutes the trendy or super high-end parts of this trend at all.

xp to milo: I'm not meaning to hate on your style, but you didn't buy those boots to drip motor oil all over them. Yes, people whose lives or livelihoods depend on their clothing or equipment are going to buy the best they can reasonably afford but WHAT THEY CAN AFFORD IS STILL SEVERAL RUNGS DOWN from all these luxury woodsman goods.

maybe we just need to settle this with a credenza build-off

ugh i should just figure out how to make $$$ on the cult of authenticity, then i wouldn't sound like such a hater

just start a line repurposing mid 90s menswear - pleats volume prominent belts - i wld def be into it. u can call it 'Bohemian Softwear' itll be so rad

Laurel, I wear them every day to work. Which is construction. When I paint, I put on footies, but I do that with any shoe.
White's main demo is actual honest to God working people - primarily firefighters, loggers and western ranchers.

*forest firefighters.

Sorry, milo -- I meant to post that with more uncertainty, since actually I had no idea what you do for a living or a hobby or anything, but with emails coming in and other distractions, I just dashed off the post.

lol lamp i'm feeling this -- thinking broad camel blazers -- silk shirts -- oxblood monks -- autumnal palettes w/ cobalt accents -- kinda mizrahi

yeah I think this is a fine way to put it...I just dislike when someone tries to argue that by buying expensive shit they're actually being very pragmatic people who are saving money. I mean there are probably some cases when this is true (when the $ margin between expensive and cheap isn't huge but the quality margin is) but it's realllly not a universal truth.

― iatee, Tuesday, February 15, 2011 10:20 AM (37 minutes ago)

but replacing the object isn't just about the replacement cost - it's also the time spent replacing the object, deciding what to replace it with in case the design has changed. And it is also about being faced with failure -- the failure of the object to endure. Maybe the grief is very minor, like coping with the death of a $1 goldfish, but still - this thing you treasured is now dead, and it can be kinda sad. What do you do with its corpse?

good advice lamp 4 sure, luv it

just start a line repurposing mid 90s menswear - pleats volume prominent belts - i wld def be into it. u can call it 'Bohemian Softwear' itll be so rad

― Kabutt (Lamp), Tuesday, February 15, 2011 1:31 PM (30 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

btw this is kind of a toronto vibe isnt it

Sarahel: clearly that's not it, because Real men don't grieve for their utilitarian objects.

sometimes they blame others for the untimely demise

so glad I don't live on the east coast

I thought Real Dudes were more likely to grieve over utilitarian items. Their high-school baseball glove, favorite fishing pole, etc.

it took one of my "Real Man" friends several years to stop blaming his ex-wife for the death of his AMC Pacer, and just accept the fact that things die, and that car wasn't particularly well-made.

xp Yes but in those cases they must do it secretly and/or sheepishly, a little emotional moment that they're allowing themselves but which they believe to be out of character for themselves and all other Real Men. If someone else were to, say, walk into the room while they were crooning over a broken ax handle or something, they would have to pretend to be looking at the flaw really closely and put it down right away.

it is a manly kind of grief

an informal moment of silence for the irreparably damaged Dewalt

Are we all returning to the artisanal qualities of our grandfathers' worlds because we hate our fathers and everything they've done to us?

um yea idk if a dude's dedication to his vehicle is comparable to how he feels abt his jeans or boots or w/e

true - it's a matter of degree - like the death of a dog vs. the death of a goldfish

ftr, my grandfather has had the same leather tool belt and nail pouch for as long as I've been alive. It has a bitching patina and I will appropriate it for myself when he dies.

The Pacer is the goldfish in this story and boots are the dog, right?

he loved that Pacer like a dog

an old, farty, kinda senile dog, but he loved it all the same

like the archetypal working outdoorsman this trend evokes -- his attitude towards clothes is functional, practical, and disdainful of fashion -- if he wears his boots out, or his shirt tears and the wife can't mend it, well he just reorders the same thing from the supply catalog

the problem arises when they change the design/manufacture of that thing -- and i think that's what this trend speaks to -- "they don't make it like they used to" syndrome

Haha I just wrote and deleted a couple of lines about how people who are actually FROM the North Country or whatever semi-fictional places this gear is supposed to be worn, those people are more likely to be found wearing local state university sweatshirts and probably a garish ski parka. Even at the most woodsman-ish end of the spectrum, LL Bean, maybe Woolrich are about the most "authentic" you're gonna find.

my dad actually is from the north country & I used to steal his old wool sweaters and jackets and plaid shirts back in the 90s. wish I still had some of them. but I've always liked tweeds and plaids for this reason - he was a really sharp dresser. college professor from lumberjack/mining country I guess. but I feel like it's OK if that's actually what you are? it's a shame that everyone looks so sloppy now.

And while yuppie loggers are an easy target for scorn, a little less that's disposable in our culture is a perfectly fine thing. Even if it all just gets shunted to thrift stores and flea markets, someone will use it. It's a variation on a look that's been seen as a good look pretty continuously since the '50s, from James Dean to Neil Young to Cobain, etc.

from a global economic pov distain for cheap/disposable dovetails nicely w/distain for the rise of the developing world - whats viewed as cheap by privileged people is almost always actually more efficient - making a big irl difference in many peoples lives - tho obvs environmental impact is the big unaccounted for variable

just to be clear im not accusing anyone of anything

okay milo except you're confusing 'workwear' with 'durable clothes' -- a well-made suit in sturdy wool will last for years, too -- quality bluchers can be polished & re-soled for a lifetime -- imho 'durability' is just coded ruggedness / masculinity wrt this trend

from a global economic pov distain for cheap/disposable dovetails nicely w/distain for the rise of the developing world - whats viewed as cheap by privileged people is almost always actually more efficient - making a big irl difference in many peoples lives - tho obvs environmental impact is the big unaccounted for variable

dovetails nicely sure, but the original arts and crafts movement occured more than 100 years ago and had nothing to do with the developing world - replace 'british people in factories' with 'chinese people in factories'. I don't think people who think this way have ever really cared about that side of the argument, so it's not disdain for the developing world in any sense except 'they don't care enough to think about the effects on the developing world'

cheap chinese crap *shakes head*

and while its a nice notion, it's ultimately kinda naive to think that our durable clothes will survive to inspire further generations of style -- just as likely it will get compacted into shipping containers and sent to the developing world to undermine local textile markets, or else dumped into landfills, or incinerated

like the archetypal working outdoorsman this trend evokes -- his attitude towards clothes is functional, practical, and disdainful of fashion -- if he wears his boots out, or his shirt tears and the wife can't mend it, well he just reorders the same thing from the supply catalog

fwiw this is an attitude I really appreciate. I have ordered many pairs of Dickies/jeans online. I am not disdainful of fashion, I am just lazy.

which is sorta what's dissonant about this whole trend---the whole thing about The Last ___ You'll Ever Need ("welp I've figured out my boot situation for the next decade") is totally at odds with the mutability of fashion and trends and w/e.

anyway I feel I should confess that my winter boots are 40+ yo leather Sorels that I will have repaired when they start to go. I love them.

I'm pretty specifically talking about durable workwear - suits seem kind of irrelevant since we haven't been talking about them. But even including suits, there's a lot of variations in 'well-made wool suits' that won't get worn today. '70s lapels, big-ass '80s shoulders, etc.

Workwear is a rather self-effacing aesthetic (inside of the margins) - that's the stuff that survives, becomes 'timeless' (like a simple gray wool suit) etc. And it's one reason, beyond the coding or whatever motives we want to assign to Real Dudes, that this stuff is seen as separate from 'fashion.'

You've got your Thom Brownes making suits look goofy and Brooklyn hipsters overdoing workwear, but the underlying elements never seem to die and when put together right appear fashionable.

I don't think people who think this way have ever really cared about that side of the argument, so it's not disdain for the developing world in any sense except 'they don't care enough to think about the effects on the developing world'

This reeks of 'people who are into local/organic/etc. agriculture don't care about billions of people who rely on GMO/pesticides/etc.'

We're all first-worlders who waste money (relative to the developing world) left and right, even when we're not even middle class for our society. Do beer drinkers and record collectors not care about the developing world either?

Demanding that everyone follow suit on your personal choices would be shitty, but it's also a strawman 99% of the time.

well i think to the extent that people think their sturdy/organic lyfestile is virtuous they are somewhat clueless and comically self involved, not villains or anything

Do beer drinkers and record collectors not care about the developing world either?

do you even have to ask???

but yeah ice cr?m otm