overplayed style

Haha I just wrote and deleted a couple of lines about how people who are actually FROM the North Country or whatever semi-fictional places this gear is supposed to be worn, those people are more likely to be found wearing local state university sweatshirts and probably a garish ski parka. Even at the most woodsman-ish end of the spectrum, LL Bean, maybe Woolrich are about the most "authentic" you're gonna find.

like this is the ll bean boot youre likely to see people wearing from where i type in n vermont

http://grab.by/8XHn

lol yes EXACTLY!

maybe in 30 years nyc ad agency employees will be obsessing over nascar tshirts and photo realistic camo gear

i guess the glib thing 2 say is that menswear is infatuated w/ any culture that signifies tradition/craft/heritage/permanence bcuz of the instability & uncertainty around men's identity 'in the modern world'. like these clothes were 1st worn by men w/an unthinking sort of command & mastery of their milieux or w/e. prep is less tiresome bcuz its still connected to its own essential nature & culture whereas the workwear thing is just gross now.

im p sick of both of these tho been torrenting old episodes of friends to jack chandler 95s style

otm re: statement of intent over style -- it's not so much the style that bugs me as how the garments are held as fetish objects of authenticity & masculinity. like if i have to read another graph about the naval origins & functional design of the peacoat then i will barf. yes it's a perennial classic look, it crops up every couple years, the only thing new this time is the emphasis on functionality when it is really no more or less functional than, say, a nylon parka

yeah were in a stage where men generally are getting more into clothes but there seems to be the need in order to maintain a comfort level to quantify the experience via stats and history as far as how well it withstands the elements or like the fact that this pocket could conceivably be used for something that youll never use it for - its the rei outdoor gortex wicking headlamp gear mentality which imo is a v low form of materialism - guys should just admit to themselves that they like beautiful things and want to look beautiful - i think at that point theres room for powers of discernment to go way up

i guess the glib thing 2 say is that menswear is infatuated w/ any culture that signifies tradition/craft/heritage/permanence bcuz of the instability & uncertainty around men's identity 'in the modern world'. like these clothes were 1st worn by men w/an unthinking sort of command & mastery of their milieux

Elephant in the room, totes obvious but hardly ever mentioned. And something I'm really conflicted about have v much appreciation for since that so-called "mastery" was at the expense of every group that wasn't Them.

hey it was a good time to be a white american male *lights cigar, gazes toward the setting sun*

spotted @ the ri antiques mall: watch cap, checked shirt, canvas work vest, selvedge, red wings; dropping $$$$ on a midcentury teak sideboard like it wasn't even a thing

ballin

guys should just admit to themselves that they like beautiful things and want to look beautiful

yah theres a definite need in menswear for a 'narrative' - you can pay a grand for a pair of shoes if you know the detailed history of not only the wizened englishman who handcrafted them but the cattle that gave their lives too - whereas a girl can pay a grand for a pair of heels bcuz they make her ass look good

haha last fall i got an amazing midcentury teak credenza for $170 bucks

this is like the time i saw pants i own on fuckyeahmenswear isnt it?

I rly like a lot of boy's adventure stories from the turn of the cent through the mid-cent, plus lots of light adult fic, esp exciting now that so much of it is avail as ebooks in public domain, for FREE, and I gotta say, the modern analog of the 1920s woodsman or whatever is totally not who or what Filson customers think it is.

spotted @ the ri antiques mall: watch cap, checked shirt, canvas work vest, selvedge, red wings; dropping $$$$ on a midcentury teak sideboard like it wasn't even a thing

Must have read this 5x as "teak skateboard" for some reason and that still didn't even surprise me.

with prep style, tho -- i always thought one of the keys to the look was a privileged indifference to trad rules of formality -- eg sockless loafers or like showing up to luncheon in tennis whites or w/e -- but now i see bloggers wearing blue blazers over long sleeve rugbys over a collared shirt w/ the repp tie peeking out -- too much, dudes

teak skateboard, hand foraged steel trucks nbd

http://www.proteak.com/images/skateboard.jpg

are we bagging on midcentury furniture now too!!! my lifestyle is under attack/dont h8 the player h8 the game

yah theres a definite need in menswear for a 'narrative' - you can pay a grand for a pair of shoes if you know the detailed history of not only the wizened englishman who handcrafted them but the cattle that gave their lives too - whereas a girl can pay a grand for a pair of heels bcuz they make her ass look good

I have gotten into discussions with women over this and I come down on the side of expensive menswear being somewhat more reasonable. A couple of girls cracked up about me wearing $400 White's boots. But I wear them 15 hours a day, every day (and I can't even buy good-looking boots in my size from RW or w/e) - I'm paying for craftsmanship (they'll last forever with resoling) and for the fact I need custom. Contrast that with designer heels that are functionally no different from cheap heels, sometimes down to appearance, and aren't worn as often.

Ditto jeans, but in unisex - expensive selvage from Japan or the US are generally of higher quality (materials, craftsmanship) than designer brands that cost nearly the same. I'd rather pay for material and because on guy in Oakland is sewing than buy Diesel sewn in the developing world.

Compared to thrifting or buying cheap jeans from Wal-Mart, it's all frivolous of course. But the menswear aesthetic of focusing on craft and history (if not real world function) is not without its merits compared to fashion as a whole.

pfft midcentry furniture so 00s

milo i feel you on valuing craftsmanship, i guess from my pov it so easily goes over board into gross conceptuality which is actually imo an impediment to appreciation

yeah see i stuff my shotgun shell pockets with d cell batteries so i can get that real authentic look

― tangelo amour (elmo argonaut), Tuesday, February 15, 2011 9:20 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark

this just reminds me of a time in 7th grade study hall when my discman was out of batteries so i leaned over and jokingly asked this one D&D/gamer lookin dude if he happened to have any batteries and he did. his pockets were full of fucking batteries. it was totally weird

nah teak is cool w/ me

maybe just don't dress like a woodsman as you politely ask the dude in the reeboks & wranglers to load the credenza into yr mercedes van

Contrast that with designer heels that are functionally no different from cheap heels, sometimes down to appearance

This not actually true, but w/e, not germane to thread.

craftsmanship will not save u from the yawning abyss of technology fyi

mercedes van

You mean your Dodge Sprinter, right?

But you paid xtra for the Merc branding kit to be installed at the dealership.

Because of, u know, craftsmanship.

speaking of technology how abt this new term for craftsmanship where there is no craftsman 'build quality'

laurel: that's the one

I love this thread so much, it's all about how 20-sthing hipsters want to my life or something??? Hilarious!

you know what i always thought were awesome these amc eagle if a truck was a car units - feel like the urban woodsman should get into it

http://grab.by/8XMW

But the menswear aesthetic of focusing on craft and history (if not real world function) is not without its merits compared to fashion as a whole.

'craft' has its merits - i mean im wearing edward green oxfords atm - but my point was more about how menswear almost needs to come pacakged w/ this kind of narrative in order for dudes to pay $$$$. the totemic qualities of 'craft' and 'quality' are p easily coopted imo & its a helpful & less self-deluding to admit that we dress for others n/h

My midwestern, woodworking, auto-repairing, LL Bean flannel and Carhartt-wearing dad has a Sprinter. Dodge logo package, because it cost extra for the Merc one and he just laughed.

feel like the 'well I'm never gonna have to replace this because it's SO WELL MADE' argument is often made just to justify having to pay a ridiculous amount for something you really wanted for other reasons - like, if you do the math, replacing it 10 times could be cheaper.

Seriously it's like you/they all want to be my dad. He has like EEE-wide feet, btw, but has never even for a second considered $400 custom work boots, I can promise you that. I can picture the face he would make right now if I even mentioned it.

lol did not know abt the dodge/benz premium pricing van scam, my god

you know what i always thought were awesome these amc eagle if a truck was a car units - feel like the urban woodsman should get into it

totes mcgotes. i wanted one of these so bad as a kid

it looks like a donk right out the box!

ok also if mercedes made their militaristic jeep in the shape of a car itd be so rad

http://grab.by/8XNv

feel like the 'well I'm never gonna have to replace this because it's SO WELL MADE' argument is often made just to justify having to pay a ridiculous amount for something you really wanted for other reasons - like, if you do the math, replacing it 10 times could be cheaper.

― iatee, Tuesday, February 15, 2011 12:02 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

otm. even though i can be a 'well-made' fetishist (p common among bike jerks) the simple fact is that cheap disposable jobs are likely cheaper. plus, the ppl that actually ~do the manly stuff~ that yr urban lumberjack just use whatever's close to hand. a friend of mine built his own house in rural NH and i can assure you that he wasn't using heirloom woodworking tools and wearing filson tincloth pants. it was cheap-end power tools and jeans and sneakers and tshirts all the way

xp driving those merc jeeps is sort of an experience, tbh. like the doors are just so fucking heavy and close with this solemn, teutonic "clunk". they're just so ~well-made~

Yeah, I think the Sprinters ship from the factory as Freightliner/Dodge Sprinter even though really everything about them is Mercedes-engineered. But to have all the places where there are logos changed costs some token amount, I don't remember the number. And by "token", I'm thinking it was like some thousands of dollars?

also fwiw the prep/lumberjack thing go pretty hand in hand, imo. i mean, the lumbery fashion ppl are pretty explicitly emulating an archetypical American Country Gentleman that is only rugged and handsome when he happens to be at the "cottage" in upstate NY or VT or ME or w/e. i have met these people. when they're in the city (or at the beach or w/e), they dress preppy. when they're antiquing in woodstock, vt, they're in flannel and $500 boots. they're not fashionable, they're just ~rich~. that's why these two currents are perennial styles, imo, ppl like to look expensive.

it'd be like if ppl in england started fetishizing what wealthy english "farmers" wore as they tramped around the property with a shotgun broken over their arm....oh wait

Yeah, I could find 13EE or 14EE boots that look like the LL Beans above. Or beige Timbs. But they look like crap and would cost about as much over six or seven years (I kill those kind of trail hikers in a year, easily). If I could still buy DM 1460s that fit comfortably, it would be great.

(one exception - LL Bean Katahdin Engineer Boots - ~$150, and I had a pair of them before the White's. But they're still expensive and much less comfortable)

I'm not saying they aren't a luxury or that I didn't buy them in part on looks (same reason I always loved Docs - they were suitable for all occasions). But their construction was also a legit selling point for me.

tl;dr -- both of these styles in their purest form just scream "old money" to me.

Well duh.

I'm not saying they aren't a luxury or that I didn't buy them in part on looks (same reason I always loved Docs - they were suitable for all occasions). But their construction was also a legit selling point for me.

yeah I think this is a fine way to put it...I just dislike when someone tries to argue that by buying expensive shit they're actually being very pragmatic people who are saving money. I mean there are probably some cases when this is true (when the $ margin between expensive and cheap isn't huge but the quality margin is) but it's realllly not a universal truth.

ugh i should just figure out how to make $$$ on the cult of authenticity, then i wouldn't sound like such a hater

selling thrifted brooks bros makers ties @ $40 a pop (i have been considering this tbh)

Kind of disagree about what real-world people do. If you work construction for a living, you buy the best tools you can afford. Ridgid, for instance, costs more but they're robust and when we do manage to jack one up I've got a lifetime warranty from any Home Depot.