just listened to some clips... can't say I'm really drawn to it. as pastiche it seems a bit too straight/faithful to its sources and the one thing that sticks out as unusual/out of place is 9as noted by others) his voice. which is terrible.
― ex-heroin addict tricycle (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:30 (thirteen years ago) link
This is not pastiche.
― Rich Lolwry (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:33 (thirteen years ago) link
yr right, pastiche implies disparate elements - this is more like an homage I guess
― ex-heroin addict tricycle (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:33 (thirteen years ago) link
dunno if I'm gonna make it through all the songs tbh kinda wanna turn it off already and just listen to Katy Lied instead
― ex-heroin addict tricycle (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:34 (thirteen years ago) link
Listen to "Downtown."
― Rich Lolwry (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:35 (thirteen years ago) link
the sleeve is great, I'll give him that.
― ex-heroin addict tricycle (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:37 (thirteen years ago) link
this doesnt sound close enough to 'katy lied' (or anything else really) to be 'pastiche' ... its using certain instruments & production styles but doesnt sound structurally like the stuff ppl are comparing it to, like, at all
― challopian youtubes (deej), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:40 (thirteen years ago) link
certainly way too freeform to be steely dan esque
that's kinda what I don't like about it! Steely Dan had HOOKS and (at least up until Aja/Gaucho) some pretty weird/twisty song structures. this stuff just kinda floats along on two-chord changes and a lot of washed out textures - trying hard to be Babylon Sisters but lacking the chops
― ex-heroin addict tricycle (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:43 (thirteen years ago) link
i dont know babylon sisters but uhhh being freeform is the point, its not 'about' hooks
― challopian youtubes (deej), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:45 (thirteen years ago) link
dude I am agreeing with you
― ex-heroin addict tricycle (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:45 (thirteen years ago) link
re: Babylon Sisters - this is the opening track on Gaucho, the Dan's last album. it is noteworthy - sorta - for signalling a shift away from the complex structures and chordal interplay that were the band's usual stock in trade and toward a more free-form, groove-centered approach. even so, it has more changes/tonal shadings than this Destroyer stuff. even tho the underlying chord structure is simple, there are a whole bunch of melodies and weird harmonies and turnarounds in it. which don't really seem to be evident in Kaputt afaict.
― ex-heroin addict tricycle (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:49 (thirteen years ago) link
so maybe it's a bad comparison
― congratulations (n/a), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:49 (thirteen years ago) link
It only signaled what SD would do on that song! Have you heard Gaucho? The tile track, "Time Out of Mind," "Third World Man," "Hey Nineteen" -- lots of complex chordal interplay, and TIGHT.
― Rich Lolwry (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:50 (thirteen years ago) link
xp to shakes
oops, sorry, there is a vinyl-only track.
― Iago Galdston, Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:50 (thirteen years ago) link
eh, whatever. imho Kaputt cops the sound and the texture of late period Steely Dan, but doesn't bother with the song structures and hooks and uber-session musician chops. which is, I think, what deej was saying.
xp
― ex-heroin addict tricycle (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:51 (thirteen years ago) link
this is all correct. sorry if I implied otherwise that wasn't really my intention. I just ref'd Babylon Sisters cuz it seemed most analogous to what Kaputt is going for, except even Babylon Sisters has more going on in it than most of these Kaputt songs do.
― ex-heroin addict tricycle (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:53 (thirteen years ago) link
or is it more that you just take issue with my casual summation that late period Dan is more free-form/groove-centered than their earlier stuff...? I guess that's arguable (Do It Again has what, three chords?).
― ex-heroin addict tricycle (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 00:54 (thirteen years ago) link
Well, everything you've said really: about Steely Dan, their applicability to what Bejar's attempting, and Kaputt itself. I'm not going to offer a full review yet, but I hear very little Steely Dan here: it's closer to what a lot of Bejar's English faves from eighties, inspired by the Dan, attempted.
― Rich Lolwry (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:00 (thirteen years ago) link
*from the eighties
English faves: Scritti Politti, China Crisis (produced by Walter Becker, of course), Prefab Sprout.
― Rich Lolwry (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:05 (thirteen years ago) link
it's really weird how you guys feel the need to compare/contrast this with steely dan so much
― gr8080, Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:07 (thirteen years ago) link
yeah, stop that before you ruin it for me.
― kate78, Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:08 (thirteen years ago) link
"Complex" chords = "Steely Dan" for lots of people I know. It's not like they were the only band to play them.
― Rich Lolwry (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:12 (thirteen years ago) link
shakey at least listen to the record first
― fruit of the goon (k3vin k.), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:12 (thirteen years ago) link
Shakey it's not about the number of chords it's about the tertial harmonies
― ARP 2600 vs. Atari 2600 (Ówen P.), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:35 (thirteen years ago) link
Also, blehhhhhhh
― ARP 2600 vs. Atari 2600 (Ówen P.), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:36 (thirteen years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFUdMbYpPEs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8-m_tMw36A
― gr8080, Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:44 (thirteen years ago) link
lol those sound nothing alike
― challopian youtubes (deej), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:49 (thirteen years ago) link
avalon is the closest touchpoint for me still although it doesnt sound like a 'pastiche' of avalon as much as a 'similiar production style'
you gotta shake it baby
― Rich Lolwry (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:49 (thirteen years ago) link
I LOVE THIS ALBUM.
― wow...... hmmm.... crazy...... damn….. (diamonddave85), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:50 (thirteen years ago) link
how is it a touchpoint? Genuinely curious -- no snark.
― Rich Lolwry (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:50 (thirteen years ago) link
'similar production style'
― challopian youtubes (deej), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:51 (thirteen years ago) link
b/c Ferry was more direct vocally and chordally on Avalon than he ever was and would be again.
― Rich Lolwry (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:51 (thirteen years ago) link
& instrumentation, & the general svelte aesthetic
that's my point now can we move on
― gr8080, Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:51 (thirteen years ago) link
Man, if only Bejar had asked Ferry to play synths on Kaputt...
― Rich Lolwry (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 01:52 (thirteen years ago) link
that's kinda what I don't like about it! Steely Dan had HOOKS
this album has mad hooks, sometimes more than one in a song!
― wow...... hmmm.... crazy...... damn….. (diamonddave85), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 02:07 (thirteen years ago) link
OMGZ the LinnDrum on side 3!!
― wow...... hmmm.... crazy...... damn….. (diamonddave85), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 02:15 (thirteen years ago) link
so i picked up a shift last night at my bar on "college tuesday"...put this on and got surprising reactions. Lots of "who's this?" and to top it off Song for America actually had people dancing and sexy girl dancing. Although there were a few odd looks during the whole animals...deaths embrace thing. Meanwhile I was doing lots of pelvic thrusts behind the bar. Im sure this is exactly what Bejar was going for.
― Beardie you disappoint me (chrisv2010), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 14:14 (thirteen years ago) link
i don't hear steely dan in this at all really, there's more elements of like...fleetwood mac or something than the dan even
― ciderpress, Wednesday, 26 January 2011 14:29 (thirteen years ago) link
it reminds me of Gerry Rafferty
― Beardie you disappoint me (chrisv2010), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 14:30 (thirteen years ago) link
Picked this up yesterday and was listening on the way to work this morning. Definitely not seeing the Dan touchpoints. Actually, the first comparison I thought of was Spandau Ballet, which Dan gets a little tetchy about in his interview here. But on first listen, there's a lot to love here -- it seems to me that he never approaches these aesthetics, either here or on the Bowie-compared records, ironically or as pastiche. It's just a production/arranging choice, one of many he could make.
"Suicide Demo" is amazing.
Also, by weird coincidence, "Babylon Sisters" just popped up on my iPod.
― you think you're cool, but you read ick (Phil D.), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 14:59 (thirteen years ago) link
He should really get a haircut.
― Rich Lolwry (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 15:02 (thirteen years ago) link
I'm reading all of these 70s band references and getting annoyed. Please, no more smarmy 70s rip offs! Then I realize I'm in a Destroyer thread and I am probably going to buy this!
― university of, drunk off your butt, etc. (u s steel), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 15:42 (thirteen years ago) link
bay of pigs makes a lot more sense in context with the extra music on side3. half of this album is kosmische!!!
― wow...... hmmm.... crazy...... damn….. (diamonddave85), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 15:48 (thirteen years ago) link
listened to this album again this morning, it's really good but it's kind of intense to listen to the whole thing at once
i know there are cheesy signifiers like the sax and some of the guitar licks but for me it's all about the drums+bass, synthesizer washes, and vocals, none of which particularly signify cheesiness or "the 70s" (aside from the disco-y rhythms)
also as someone who hadn't heard bay of pigs at all before this album, it fits in well with the rest of the songs. i wouldn't recognize it as a "separate entity" if i didn't know it has been released earlier
― congratulations (n/a), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 16:01 (thirteen years ago) link
"blue eyes" is still the standout track for me but i generally have poppier tastes
― congratulations (n/a), Wednesday, 26 January 2011 16:02 (thirteen years ago) link
i get that people would call some of the sounds here "cheesy", but mainly this record is really beautiful. also, the guy is singing better than ever here -- his phrasing is really about as good as it gets.
― tylerw, Wednesday, 26 January 2011 16:05 (thirteen years ago) link