TS: "Every Breath You Take" vs. "With or Without You"

Normally I'd go for the bleak, sinister stalker-ballad but in this case I prefer the Police.

With Or Without You

The whole "a refrain is different from a chorus" thing is a relatively recent development.

and THANK YOU for not making this a fucking poll, bless

You could have had this same discussion in a poll thread, I don't get it.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_difference_between_a_chorus_and_a_refrain_in_a_song

Polls have mysterious discussion dumbening powers.

But what's with the "refrain not chorus" thing now? News to me. I always thought they were two ways to say the same thing. My dictionary sez a chorus IS the refrain of a song.

Strictly speaking, "chorus" and "refrain" are interchangeable.

In the context of discussing pop music, "chorus" and "refrain" are used as described in the link I posted.

yeah, that link says what I'd taken the difference to be. thanks, Dan.

Okay, got it. Not sure I buy it, entirely, but I got it.

Question for those who know things: Are there examples of pre-20-century songs with modern-style choruses? Musically distinct sections that alternate with verses and contain what we might call a hook?

Never heard of the difference between a chorus and a refrain before, but that article gives an explaination that makes sense and obviously there is a difference so it makes sense using two different definitions.

Are there examples of pre-20-century songs with modern-style choruses? Musically distinct sections that alternate with verses and contain what we might call a hook?

Christmas carols? (particularly things like "Ding Dong Merrily On High", "Angels We Have Heard On High", "Adeste Fidelis", "The First Noel", "There Is No Rose", "The Holly and the Ivy", etc)

Also by extension there are a lot of madrigals that do this type of thing as well (not that any leap to mind but many match the verse/chorus structure).

Thanks, HD. Was starting to dig through Christmas carols myself, since they're the oldest form of pop music I'm familiar with.

I definitely always preferred the "I'll be watching you" fadeout to U2's Rockstar Wail at the end of "With or Without You".

I'm fine with the verses of both songs but their choruses make me nauseous.

-- baaderonixx, Monday, 28 January 2008 19:00 (2 days ago) Link

Those songs have no choruses!

-- Myonga Vön Bontee, Monday, 28 January 2008 19:04 (2 days ago) Link

So to be more specific, I get nauseous at

U2: "I can't live with or withoooooout you, aaaa-ha"

Police: "Oh, cant you see
You belong to me
How my poor heart aches
With every step you take"

Every Breath With or Without You because U2 The Police are shit and The Police U2 were quite good.

-- chap, Monday, January 28, 2008 11:19 AM (2 days ago) Bookmark Link

lol fixed ^

I'd rather mainline mercury than listen to either of these two songs.

Big bill magill aside, ‘every breath you take’ sounds pretty good about now

These are both good songs frankly