Herbie Hancock

Mike: How much do you practice a day?
Herbie: Maybe 3 or 4 hours
Mike: Really, that's all?
Herbie: I had this piano student once, and the kid used to practice like 10 hours a day, but he STUNK!
Mike: Even practicing 10 hours a day huh?
Herbie: No, I mean he STUNK! The kid never took showers!

Survival of the Fittest (Arista, 1975). Essential as oxygen.

I wonder if Magic Windows is worth checking out, it seems to be in the same mold as this one.

I finally got Mwandishi, and I'm enjoying it a lot. The first track has a killer complex groove, whereas the second two are more slow and floaty, ambient even, kinda reminiscent of the Eddie Henderson albums where the Mwandishi band played. I realized that the reason I don't like Henderson albums as much as the Herbie ones, even though the players are mostly the same, is that Julian Priester is missing on the Henderson albums. His trombones gave the Mwandishi band the sonic deep end without which it doesn't sound quite as good.

Not into any pre-"Head Hunters" stuff, but I have been digging into some of his later 70s albums and there is some great underrated stuff there. "Thrust", "Man-Child", "Secrets", "Sunlight", "Direct Step". And, yes, "Mr. Hands" too. And the stuff from "Rock It" until "Perfect Machine" is of course ace, and his best ever. He has seemed to lose it afterwards though.

Btw. does anyone know if "Mr. Hands" (the title) was influenced by "Weather Report's "Mr. Gone" from a couple years before?

man...i really hated herbies last few albums....but i do love his 60s and 70s work. used to have manchild on a cassette and listen all the time. his solo on chameleon is so good

The newest one is pretty good I think.

Has anyone heard the hip-hop album he made in 1993, Dis Is Da Drum? Some friend of mine had it back in the 90s, and I remember liking it, but I haven't heard it since.

I'm sitting at home with a flu, and I just put on Lite Me Up, and today it's sounding really good to me. So well-mannered and smooth and nice. I guess some people would say it's lacking an edge, but why should all music sound edgy? I've been listening to a lot of early 80s R&B/urban contemporary exactly because it's often decidedly non-edgy and non-raw, and I think that's a perfectly valid and often interesting approach to R&B. As Lite Me Up proves.

Nice live version of Chameleon over at Destination Out.

http://www.destination-out.com/media/tracks/Hancock_Chameleon.mp3

Well then.

Let's talk about Lord Xenu, Ned.

A vision!

(I am rather glad I was wrong about him being a Scientologist, that had depressed me.)

He was/is a Buddhist, I think. But unlike many of his jazz contemporaries, I don't see that big a sprititual or religious influence in his music, he's always seemed rather down-to-earth.

Oh, I just read he won the Best Album Grammy this year. Congrats for him! Has anyone actually heard the new album, is it good? It seems to have gotten quite good reviews, but since I have little interest in Joni Mitchell, I hadn't really thought of buying it.

The River is close to great. It deserves a million grammys. or not, i don't know what makes an album the best album of the year ... but it is good -- even if you're not super into Joni, there's some great playing from Hancock and Wayne Shorter ... And the guest appearances are actually pretty solid -- Tina Turner brings it! It's certainly better than a lot of the latter day Hancock I've heard.

We really need to do a thread on his post-Headhunters, pre-Laswell electronici funk records with the vocoders and shit. It's like a whole world exists there.

Out of those albums, I think only Sunlight and Mr. Hands are really essential. (And even with Mr. Hands you have to be able to like its rather, er, soft 80s sound in order to appreciate it.) The rest of them usually have one or two great tracks, but the rest is not spectacular. I think Herbie was trying a bit too hard to appeal to the popular taste of that era, so the sound and the arrangements on those albums are often kinda too polished and neat.

the death wish soundtrack is pretty amazing, isn't it?

Mr. Hands is really amazing.

Recently got "Feets Don't Fail Me Now", and it's wonderful.

Barely a mention of Sextant? It's such a spectacular album that every so often I just put it on, sit down and go "wow" for 40 minutes. Back in school many years ago, I structured an essay on Macbeth around the opening track (I'd been reading the Wire too much and thought that tenuous connections were the basis for art criticism). My English teacher didn't like it much.

pretty sure if you look around ilx, there has been about a fuck-ton of sextant love

tenuous connections are the basis for artmaking
(xpost)

Death Wish SNDTRK rules, no doubt
(xxxpost)

Yeah, there's plenty of Sextant love on other threads. It won the Herbie album poll we had:

Best Herbie Hancock (As Leader) Album Poll of 1960s/70s/80s era.

And it was the only Herbie album to place in the ILM alternate 1970s poll:

TURN THIS MUTHA OUT! It's the Alternate 1970s Albums Poll on ILX — Results Thread

For me, it's pretty much favourite album of all time.

"my favourite album of all time"

blecch, this sounds awful (and I liked the river)
The Imagine Project
An all-star effort from Herbie Hancock -- like his previous record, a set that's filled with guest appearances from really dynamic range of talents! This collaborative change in Herbie's later years is a real surprise, and it's definitely helped him explore music with the sort of freedom to genre-step that he had back in the 70s -- maybe not as cutting edge as in those days, but still surprisingly strong at the core. India Arie sings on a version of "Imagine", which also features Konono and Jeff Beck; John Legend and Pink sing on "Don't Give Up"; Ceu is on "Tempo De Amor"; The Chieftains play on "The Times They Are A Changing"; Los Lobos and Tinariwen are on "Tamatant Tilay/Exodus", Dave Matthews sings and plays on "Tomorrow Never Knows"; James Morrison guests on "A Change Is Gonna Come", and Chaka Khan, Wayne Shorter, and Anoushka Shankar all appear on "The Song Goes On"

That sounds made up.

Yeah, sounds pretty terrible. I'm not sure why Herbie has been so keen on making these kind of "eclectic" all-star albums during the last years - is it just for the cash, or does he genuinely believe they're musically worthy? The tune he made with Chaka Khan on Future 2 Future was dope though, maybe their new collab is worth listening too...

yeah, you wonder how these things are put together? does his manager just say, oh yeah, Pink, she's like the new janis joplin and herbie's like "whatever"?

Btw, why hasn't anyone written a proper biography of Herbie? Or at least I've never come across one. You'd think such an important and controversial figure in jazz would deserve his own book? The only Herbie book I know of is the one that's about Head Hunters only; it's okay, but kinda overtly theoretic.

is his life not very interesting, at least aside from music? (not that that would stop a bio from being written ...)

Maybe so. Its just that I realized he's one of my favourite musicians ever, but I know hardly anything about him as a person, except that he's is/was a Buddhist... and apparently he's quite nice in real life? I dunno, even if he hasn't lived a rock star life, it'd be nice to read about his thoughts and experiences.

Another musician I really love who has apparently never had a biography written about him is Curtis Mayfield... Who, from what I've gathered, was also a nice and gentle person. Is it so that nice musicians are not good book material?

i dunno, i'm sure there's a good book about both of those dudes somewhere in there, even if they weren't crazy/drunk/high, etc. I mean, I'd love a good analysis of herbie's various stages/phases, along with maybe how each phase fit into the music of the time/pop culture of the time. might not be a straight bio, but his career overall is a pretty fascinating one.

Yeah, I'd definitely read a book like that. The Head Hunters book was trying to do something like what you're describing, but it was only about that one album.

Another musician I really love who has apparently never had a biography written about him is Curtis Mayfield...

i read a pretty dreadful curtis biog a few years back - the extent to which the author dwelled on differences between labels on specific pressings of curtis LPs was intolerable. would love to read a great one too.

That sounds made up.

― _Rudipherous_, Monday, June 21, 2010 3:58 PM Bookmark

We should have an invent-the-next-Herbie-Collabo-album thread.

Apparently Sony is putting together a 35-disc box of Herbie's entire Columbia output. I don't think I need that, but maybe someone here does.

hey looks like there *is* a book coming out about the mwandishi years: http://www.electricsongs.com/mwandishimusic/

That sounds interesting! I's still like someone to write an overall look of Herbie's career and life though, not just one phase of it.

There was a great article about the Mwandishi group in the Wire many years ago, all I can remember of it is that they were constantly broke and they played some epic live jams. Must dig it out again if I can find it.

I always thought Herbie was kind of under-lionized, probably just because his life story doesn't have the drama or weirdness of a Trane/Miles/Mingus/Monk/Bird type figure.

Thanks for the link Stevie! And yes, absolutely - I saw him a few years ago and kept thinking "he's the same age as some people I know back home and the difference in physical health and appearance couldn't be more different."

I genuinely think it's the Buddhism!

Apparently that all started with Buster Williams. They asked him how he managed to keep his energy up so high after long shows, touring etc. and that’s what he told them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AE-EabHu0U

This track is hot af

otm

As is this one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ttlYJeva7w

Came across this brutal takedown by Peter Margasak.

Gary Giddins's criticism is no surprise - he's always been very open about how much he hates fusion, whether it involves rock, R&B and/or funk elements. I didn't realize how much Margasak hated Hancock's post-Blue Note work. He doesn't mention Head Hunters by name, but I was stunned that he lumped that album into "the drop-off" after Sextant that is "so dramatic, so absolute" - personally, it's easily the '70s Hancock album that I hold in highest regard. (In fairness, outside of Head Hunters, I'm much more partial towards Hancock's '60s work as well. Between everything he did for Blue Note and Miles Davis, it would've been extremely difficult to surpass.)

One minor point - he doesn't go too much into detail about Hancock's work on Round Midnight for which Hancock won an Oscar (not a Grammy as Margasak writes), but nobody should mistake that as dilettantism, especially one driven by calculated marketability. For starters, it's an art film directed by a French arthouse auteur (Bertrand Tavernier) rather than anyone known for commercial work. The budget was $3 million which even in 1986 wasn't a lot for an international period piece. More importantly, there were NO film stars - Tavernier had to push hard to cast real-life jazz great Dexter Gordon in the lead role, and regardless of his accomplishments and talents, that didn't mean he was a box office draw, especially when he had very little experience acting in films. And Hancock knew Gordon - he even played on Hancock's debut album (by which point Gordon was already an established jazz great). In addition to Hancock's background in film scoring - going back to the '60s! - it was natural and more than logical for Tavernier to consider Hancock as the film composer. The fact that both Gordon and Hancock would be up for Oscars was kind of a fluke - nobody predicted that when they signed on for the movie.

I love Mwandishi and Crossings, like Sextant a lot, but something about the sound of Head Hunters repels me. Everything is now flanged and phased and the synth tones are nearly as bad as Zawinul's. I mean to listen to his next couple of records but my hopes aren't high, but not because "Herbie abandoned jazz" or whatever these sorts of critics say.

very offtm, you should go get that checked out

Like I said upthread I think the Bennie Maupin solo albums are better explorations of a more commercial sort of electric jazz.

Head Hunters’ version of “Watermelon Man” was on the jazz station when my clock radio went off yesterday. What a weird, funky way to wake up.

lol Margasak. When he was the Reader's music critic, and Rosenbaum the film critic, that was some peak '90s snobbery (bless em both).

I don't love Head Hunters either. That band improved on Thrust and Man-Child and especially Flood.

Head Hunters is incredible and I love how it sounds (so spacious even with everything that's going on, probably because everything is so dry), but it's a bit hard to hear after countless jam session versions of Chameleon and Watermelon Man. Still, Thrust >>>>>

Has anyone caught the current tour? I know I should go, I mean it's probably our last chance to see him.

Btw I just happened to read this about Round Midnight recently, a blog from Kirk Lightsey, who played piano for Dexter Gordon for a number of years:

Back in New York when Dexter was working on the movie “Round Midnight,” he didn’t call me for the gig. There was a pecking order and a placement in NY at the time. There were people in line for that gig before me. Herbie Hancock and Cedar Walton . . .. So many fingers. For the movie, of course, I had been playing for five years with Dexter, so I was on the list. But I wasn’t high enough up in the pecking order. For the movie or the pecking order.
https://www.coming-and-going.com/post/how-it-all-ended-with-dexter

His performance at Big Ears was full of energy and the band killed it (esp Lionel Loueke on guitar). The set was on the 70s fusion-y side. He even played "Come Running to Me"!

I can definitely see why some might find the Headhunters era sound offputting. There's something a bit shrill or nasal bout it btw the soprano sax and wah guitar and clavinet type tones. I'm only in the right mood for it sometimes.

In my experience Headhunters is one of those recs that ppl with no jazz experience REALLY enjoy (as opposed to say Kind of Blue where the response is much more dutiful). It’s got some bangin’ tunes and is v funky, I can understand why it’s a hit, I love it too.

it's news to me that anybody doesn't like the Head Hunters LP

seriously

It's definitely news to me that anyone doesn't like that record but likes Thrust and Man-Child. A take I haven't heard.

Hip-hop songs that sample tracks from Head Hunters > Head Hunters

smdh

some of you do not own any corduroy sportscoats and it shows

xps My partner's in grad school and sometimes gets student discount offers for various events around NYC. Hancock's Lincoln Center/David Geffen Hall show popped up as one last fall. I almost forgot about it until this past week when it showed up on our calendar and I forgot we maximized the deal by getting front row seats. I've never seen Hancock this close and it was REALLY close - the guy next to me joked it was like sitting in coach on an airplane because the stage was inches from our feet. So good - the only downside was they were allotted just 90 minutes and they've been playing a full two hours everywhere else, so the set did feel a bit truncated. (Hancock actually wrapped up the penultimate number after checking his watch and telling us through his vocoder that "I'm sorry but we only have five minutes left!") Regardless, if you've never seen them before (and my partner hadn't) definitely go, but FWIW, the setlist covers a lot of the same ground as their recent tours. At this point, I'd love to see an all-acoustic show partly to change things up.

synth tones are nearly as bad as Zawinul's

You should ask yourself if this is the genre for you tbh

Came across this brutal takedown by Peter Margasak🕸.

synth tones are nearly as bad as Zawinul's

You should ask yourself if this is the genre for you tbh

I'd venture that all the big fusion keyboard players sounded better on organs and electric pianos than synths, at least for a few years, which is one reason why I like the Mwandishi stuff best.
I don't feel the same about the big name prog keyboardists, who tended to be equally tasteful or tasteless whatever instrument they played.