Keep in mind I'm approaching jazz from the standpoint of loving stuff like krautrock, psych rock, "weird" folky stuff that gets a bit drone-y at times. enthusiastically second In A Silent Way! (also Filles de Kilimanjaro)although Herbie Hancock's Sextant is a great and logical recommendation, the Headhunters record might be a better place to start (SO many people love this record upon first listen)Weather Report's Mysterious Traveller (if only for "Cucumber Slumber")Sun Ra's Languitity (mentioned already?)Dave Douglas (interesting mix of tradition and experimental electronics on "Freak In"...)Ornette's "Dancing in Your Head", "Of Human Feelings", and "Body Meta" (those last two will be tough to find, but worth the search)
― Sanford, Friday, 21 January 2011 19:33 (thirteen years ago) link
Black & Tan Fantasy is one record.
― earnest goes to camp, ironic goes to ilm (pixel farmer), Friday, 21 January 2011 19:37 (thirteen years ago) link
If you're trying to invent a line from Sun Ra to Sonic Youth and non-jazz improvised music (beyond philosophical inspiration), Strange Strings might make sense as a waypoint:
After finishing a series of concerts of New York State colleges sponsored by ESP, Sun Ra decided to assemble a number of stringed instruments bought from curio shops and music stores. Ukuleles, Mandolins, Kotos, Koras, Chinese Lutes and 'Moon Guitars' were handed out to his reed and horn players in the belief that 'strings could touch people in a special way, different from other instruments [3].' The point was that the Arkestra didn't know how to play them - Sun Ra called it 'a study in ignorance.' [3]'Next they prepared a number of homemade instruments, including a large piece of tempered sheet metal with an "X" chiseled on it. Then they miked the Sun Columns.'Marshall Allen said that when they began to record the musicians asked Sun Ra what they should play, and he answered only that he would point to them when he wanted them to start. The result is an astonishing achievement, a musical event which seems independent of all other musical traditions and histories.... The piece is all texture, with no sense of tonality except where Art Jenkins sings through a metal megaphone with a tunnel voice. But to say that the instruments seem out of tune misses the point, since there is no "tune", and in any case the Arkestra did not know how to tune most of the instruments...'
'Next they prepared a number of homemade instruments, including a large piece of tempered sheet metal with an "X" chiseled on it. Then they miked the Sun Columns.
'Marshall Allen said that when they began to record the musicians asked Sun Ra what they should play, and he answered only that he would point to them when he wanted them to start. The result is an astonishing achievement, a musical event which seems independent of all other musical traditions and histories.... The piece is all texture, with no sense of tonality except where Art Jenkins sings through a metal megaphone with a tunnel voice. But to say that the instruments seem out of tune misses the point, since there is no "tune", and in any case the Arkestra did not know how to tune most of the instruments...'
It's surprisingly listenable.
― Can your monkey do the Bot? (seandalai), Friday, 21 January 2011 19:40 (thirteen years ago) link
Sun Ra --> Parliament/Funkadelic --> Sonic Youth --> OutKast (or something similar)
deej gave me shit for doing this on some other thread fwiw
― ex-heroin addict tricycle (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, January 21, 2011 1:28 PM (20 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
i know there's a strain of listener who likes all of these things but Shakey Mo's Black People Should Get Off This Planet mix doesnt per se outline influence or significance to anyone but shakey mo & the niche of similar listeners
― *gets the power* (deej), Friday, 21 January 2011 19:50 (thirteen years ago) link
... aaaaaand let's cut the Sun Ra influences discussion there, before we derail this thread completely. :)
― ilxor, Friday, 21 January 2011 19:52 (thirteen years ago) link
btw i haven't seen it mentioned in this thread, so i will mention it (because it completely blew my mind in high school):
john coltrane - live at birdland
― bows don't kill people, arrows do (Jordan), Friday, 21 January 2011 18:25 (1 hour ago)
Yeah same. This was another one of those less "essential" records I heard first and loved. Oh, btw, MY FAVORITE THINGS -- great, great jazz record for a jazz noob.
Similarly, I heard Milestones way before Kind of Blue and I still think I may like it better.
― hey boys, suppers on me, our video just went bacterial (Hurting 2), Friday, 21 January 2011 19:58 (thirteen years ago) link
Birdland has that awesome sounding slightly out of tune piano.
yeah my favorite things (the track, then the whole album) was probably the jazz gateway drug for me. never ever gets old.
― tylerw, Friday, 21 January 2011 19:59 (thirteen years ago) link
I mean I'm going to troll a little here, but given the choice between Sun Ra's entire discography and just My Favorite Things as the only music I have to listen to, I would unquestionably take the latter
― hey boys, suppers on me, our video just went bacterial (Hurting 2), Friday, 21 January 2011 20:01 (thirteen years ago) link
ill cosign 'live at birdland,' anythin w/ afro blue x alabama is gonna be unstoppable
― *gets the power* (deej), Friday, 21 January 2011 20:02 (thirteen years ago) link
I also like Coltrane's Sound better than Giant Steps
― hey boys, suppers on me, our video just went bacterial (Hurting 2), Friday, 21 January 2011 20:03 (thirteen years ago) link
Shakey Mo's Black People Should Get Off This Planet mix ...
― *gets the power* (deej), Friday, January 21, 2011 11:50 AM (11 minutes ago) Bookmark
ffs, dude
― normal_fantasy-unicorns (contenderizer), Friday, 21 January 2011 20:04 (thirteen years ago) link
ha thats a play on an old shakey mo post
― *gets the power* (deej), Friday, 21 January 2011 20:04 (thirteen years ago) link
duh, okay. scanned more aggro than necessary.
― normal_fantasy-unicorns (contenderizer), Friday, 21 January 2011 20:05 (thirteen years ago) link
(seriously I would totally flip my shit right now if there were some rap act saying "black people got to get off this fuckin planet and into space - and here's the music to go along with it")
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, April 12, 2006 5:58 PM (4 years ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
― *gets the power* (deej), Friday, 21 January 2011 20:06 (thirteen years ago) link
i think significance (or maybe i should say relevance) changes depending on context and audience. like it's reasonable here to tailor recommendations and discussion to the musical world of the admittedly krautrockin ilxor. like more sun ra & coltrane, less art tatum.
― normal_fantasy-unicorns (contenderizer), Friday, 21 January 2011 20:10 (thirteen years ago) link
I would totally flip my shit right now if there were some rap act saying "black people got to get off this fuckin planet and into space - and here's the music to go along with it"
plus shut the fuck up, me, cuz that's obviously what sun ra was saying, and just as obviously what you were referring to. i can't think sometimes...
― normal_fantasy-unicorns (contenderizer), Friday, 21 January 2011 20:12 (thirteen years ago) link
Skimming through here: just chip in that giving Ascension a go as a first record by Coltrane is completely fine as you pretty much know he did lots of different things. Just as Ra making singles isn't at all strange.
― xyzzzz__, Friday, 21 January 2011 21:52 (thirteen years ago) link
Good stuff. I've noted that it's probably not the best entry point to Coltrane, but may give it a whirl anyway if it's the first record of his I happen to stumble onto for a fair price. And anyway, I don't plan to hear any one record, say Ascenion by Coltrane, and flip the "off" switch on exploring his other stuff if I don't enjoy it. I'm in this for the long haul, and it goes without saying that most of the musicians mentioned here did lots of different albums that may sound vastly different from one another.
― ilxor, Friday, 21 January 2011 21:57 (thirteen years ago) link
I agree Duke Ellington has been under-represented on the thread so far. Armstrong too, but that's a pretty big leap back in the time machine for somebody starting from krautrock and psych.
I was trying to remember how I got from Bitches Brew (the first jazz album I bought) to '30s, '40s, and '50s jazz. I think maybe Miles' records with Gil Evans, Sketches of Spain in particular, made it easier for me to appreciate Ellington's big band sound. I got the Ken Burns Ellington compilation, wore that out for while, then started getting more Ellington. After that I was able to get more out of Armstrong, Parker, Monk, Coltrane, etc. than I had before.
― Brad C., Friday, 21 January 2011 21:58 (thirteen years ago) link
Did you like Bitches Brew at first? I remember coming at it from jazz, I found it hard to listen to. There may also have been something flat about the remaster I had. Then one night I was driving around with a friend and he put on one of those Complete Bitches Brew Sessions discs, and the whole thing totally opened up for me. The non-BB material kind of helped me enjoy the BB stuff more. But the whole thing also sounded more open and had more sonic depth than I remembered.
― hey boys, suppers on me, our video just went bacterial (Hurting 2), Friday, 21 January 2011 22:05 (thirteen years ago) link
Duke Ellington and Johnny Hodges - side by sideget this for the sweets edison solo on 'stompy jones'
― *gets the power* (deej), Friday, 21 January 2011 22:05 (thirteen years ago) link
Re Miles, I'd suggest In a Silent Way (xpost -- more ambient) and Jack Johnson (more rocking) as really accessible points of entry.
100% cosign.
― Daniel, Esq., Friday, 21 January 2011 22:07 (thirteen years ago) link
Did you like Bitches Brew at first?
I didn't. I bought it and Kind of Blue on cassette, in close proximity, when I was about 14-15, and hated BB. Didn't "get it" until years later.
― that's not funny. (unperson), Friday, 21 January 2011 22:13 (thirteen years ago) link
i finally found 'tribute to jack johnson' on vinyl and omg mclaughlin's dirty dirty guitar!!!!
― "crut" copy (diamonddave85), Friday, 21 January 2011 22:18 (thirteen years ago) link
also davis was late to the recording and mclaughlin and the bassist were just jamming and about two minutes in, he shows up and just throws down an amazing solo. the best part is that you can totally 'hear' davis entering the studio by what the musicians are playing. a++++ would recommend
― "crut" copy (diamonddave85), Friday, 21 January 2011 22:21 (thirteen years ago) link
I liked it okay but not as much as I'd hoped. It wasn't quite what I expected -- I was probably looking for something more like Jack Johnson or Agharta.
― Brad C., Friday, 21 January 2011 23:53 (thirteen years ago) link
the ellington/mingus/roach trio record might be a good entryway to duke if yr not ready for big band stuff.
― tylerw, Friday, 21 January 2011 23:54 (thirteen years ago) link
big band like 30's big band or big band like Jazz Composer's Orchestra, Globe Unity, etc.?
― sarahel, Saturday, 22 January 2011 00:00 (thirteen years ago) link
sorry - missed the word "duke" in your post, Tyler
― sarahel, Saturday, 22 January 2011 00:07 (thirteen years ago) link
but the thing is, the phrase "if yr not ready for big band stuff" just strikes me as weird, because that stuff is what pop music used to be, what dance music used to be, and now we have software and samples to replace all those instruments, but i have trouble understanding how ellington's big band music would be something that's hard to get into, that you have to get ready in some way to appreciate.
― sarahel, Saturday, 22 January 2011 00:12 (thirteen years ago) link
Keep in mind I'm approaching jazz from the standpoint of loving stuff like krautrock, psych rock, "weird" folky stuff that gets a bit drone-y at times.
this makes it really easy to understand how big band wouldnt be immediate...
― 69, Saturday, 22 January 2011 00:13 (thirteen years ago) link
yeah, but presumably ilxor has heard pop music and seen old movies?
― sarahel, Saturday, 22 January 2011 00:15 (thirteen years ago) link
man i just spotted this thread
hey dude
this thread shall be rad
― HOOS the master?? STEEN NUFF (BIG HOOS aka the steendriver), Saturday, 22 January 2011 00:16 (thirteen years ago) link
i know you've already got a list of recs a mile long but if i can just toss some pennies in the hat
-Giant Steps: this is the first jazz record that really got me by the throat, and in retrospect I think it's because the music was so fast & complex that it kind of melted all the harmonic information into gibberish and I just heard these bright luminous noises like dude was blowing sparks out of his horn
-Meditations: Easily my favorite jazz record. iirc I'm in the minority for even noticing it, but McCoy Tyner's piano playing on this record totally opened up piano jazz for me.
-Complete Art Tatum: See Giant Steps
I see Mats & The Thing have already been mentioned, I just wanted to shout out "Fire!," a collabo Mats was involved with that is suuuuuuuuper krautrocky at points. One of my fave records of the last few years, have a feeling it's right up yr alley.
― HOOS the master?? STEEN NUFF (BIG HOOS aka the steendriver), Saturday, 22 January 2011 00:24 (thirteen years ago) link
so this is sorta a ridiculous deal if you don't have this: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000FBHCQO/ref=s9_simh_gw_p15_d1_i4?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-5&pf_rd_r=116E9TAM4WERR3FHKPMN&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=470939291&pf_rd_i=507846$3.99 for two CDs of monk/coltrane
― tylerw, Saturday, 22 January 2011 20:20 (thirteen years ago) link
man i just spotted this threadhey dudethis thread shall be rad― HOOS the master?? STEEN NUFF (BIG HOOS aka the steendriver), Saturday, January 22, 2011 2:16 AM (20 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
― HOOS the master?? STEEN NUFF (BIG HOOS aka the steendriver), Saturday, January 22, 2011 2:16 AM (20 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
yeah, man, i second that emotion.
― Ioannis, Saturday, 22 January 2011 21:13 (thirteen years ago) link
Cheers everyone, I took a breather from this thread but I've been listening to lots of jazz, including several recommendations in this thread that I picked up yesterday (in exchange for, oh, $50 less in my wallet...).
HOOS, I picked up Giant Steps used for $4 -- definitely will play soon. I saw Meditations, I think the CD issue on Impulse but in a jewel case. Is there a new, remastered version I should watch for instead? I've seen a lot of Impulse stuff in digipaks...
Seriously thinking about picking up that $3.99 Amazon recommendation, I have an order to place there today regardless. Anyone else heard it?
― ilxor, Saturday, 22 January 2011 21:38 (thirteen years ago) link
Btw, the description of Coltrane blowing sparks out of his horn is the BEST possible recommendation ever. Sounds incredible!
― ilxor, Saturday, 22 January 2011 21:39 (thirteen years ago) link
the monk/coltrane 2 cd is a great deal - only real issue is that it's one of those things where multiple takes are sequenced together, which always kinda bugs me. but you could get it and sequence a playlist yourself so that it followed this album: http://www.amazon.com/Monks-Music-Thelonious-Monk/dp/B000000Y52/ref=pd_sim_m_35, which is great.
― tylerw, Saturday, 22 January 2011 21:42 (thirteen years ago) link
Well thanks for telling me after I placed the order. ;)
j/k
― ilxor, Saturday, 22 January 2011 21:59 (thirteen years ago) link
what tylerw said
you'd want to refer to the sequence on this album too: http://www.amazon.com/Thelonious-Monk-John-Coltrane/dp/B0038M61B4/ref=pd_sim_m_59
hard to beat getting both plus alternative takes for $3.99
― Brad C., Saturday, 22 January 2011 21:59 (thirteen years ago) link
ilxor, you need this. now!:
http://www.amazon.com/Journey-In-Satchidananda/dp/B000W06V6A/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1295733577&sr=8-1
― Ioannis, Saturday, 22 January 2011 22:00 (thirteen years ago) link
I'm definitely keeping an eye out for Alice. Saw a used one the other day... not Journey, though; let me look up the name.
― ilxor, Saturday, 22 January 2011 22:06 (thirteen years ago) link
Ptah the El Daoud -- think it was on Impulse.
― ilxor, Saturday, 22 January 2011 22:07 (thirteen years ago) link
That one's great too-- as are Universal Consciousness & World Galaxy.
― President Keyes, Saturday, 22 January 2011 22:09 (thirteen years ago) link
THat's a great one too plus awesome sleeve
ha xp
― seminal fuiud (NickB), Saturday, 22 January 2011 22:10 (thirteen years ago) link
my recommendations:
in a silent wayget up with itcreator has a master planpangaea/agarthalet my children hear music
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Saturday, 22 January 2011 22:21 (thirteen years ago) link
"he loved him madly" is an incredible piece of music
― the Chinese firewall of the heart (Michael B), Saturday, 22 January 2011 22:27 (thirteen years ago) link
yeah so fucking good...crazily intense.
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Saturday, 22 January 2011 22:31 (thirteen years ago) link