yeah gbx, I'm with you there - that's about as reasonable a compromise as can be hoped for in a country where the right to own guns is built into its foundational document
still doesn't stop me from thinking of guns as being totally fucking barbaric, get real dudes you're not traveling the oregon trail anymore
― dayo, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:03 (thirteen years ago) link
By someone I mean the manufacturer
― boots get knocked from here to czechoslovakier (milo z), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:04 (thirteen years ago) link
'Silencers' are a bogeyman in the US, much like assault rifles and so on - oh, criminals use them to stay undetected, etc.. Getting one requires a great deal of ATF paperwork and a $200 tax stamp.But they generally don't even bring firearm noise down to a level that won't damage your hearing without protection, except for some .22s. They don't in any way silence a gun.But in these countries we're talking about without the Wild West gun culture of the US (or whatever), they're widely available and their use is encouraged.
― boots get knocked from here to czechoslovakier (milo z), Monday, January 10, 2011 11:02 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark
and this is relevant how
― dayo, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:04 (thirteen years ago) link
lol otm
xpost to dayo
― got electrolytes (The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:04 (thirteen years ago) link
why does everything need 2 have a 'point' - why cant he just bring up some interesting little factoids huh - u guys are way too aggro, my least fav kind of ilx discussion thread is where u guys are all like YEAH BRO?? YEAH BRO???? like bullying milo into thinking guns are bad is the fulcrum on which world peace rests - just chill out testosterbros
― Princess TamTam, Sunday, January 9, 2011 10:02 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
ur lucky i dont have a gun
― max, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:05 (thirteen years ago) link
I'm pretty sure it's relevant to a discussion of gun laws in Scandinavian countries and their gun cultures.
Yeeeeesh.
― boots get knocked from here to czechoslovakier (milo z), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:05 (thirteen years ago) link
― Princess TamTam, Monday, January 10, 2011 11:02 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark
sorry that you're being forced to read this thread at gunpoint, what if I were to tell you that by outlawing guns you would no longer be forced to read this thread at gunpoint, would that interest you
― dayo, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:05 (thirteen years ago) link
now ur tolkein
― Princess TamTam, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:06 (thirteen years ago) link
only outlaws will force you to read this thread at gunpoint
― Kerm, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:07 (thirteen years ago) link
sweden makes it easy to buy silencers and the US doesnt and that demonstrates....― max, Sunday, January 9, 2011 8:59 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark
― max, Sunday, January 9, 2011 8:59 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark
well it demonstrates that sweden has a more sane appraisal of how/why guns are used to kill ppl, probs. outlawing silencers is precisely the sorta law that seeks to score hollow political points (heyo) with a base w/o meaningfully effecting crime or w/e. the only ppl that are ~really~ going to want a silencer are gun nuts who want cool shit, professional criminals who need it for their job (and will get one anyway), and amateur criminals who want them to be badass (and then miss anything they shoot at). making it hard to get a silencer addresses a public health problem that literally doesn't exist (ppl getting iced by guns w/silencers at a rate higher than oh i don't know lightning strikes).
anyway, ad nauseum, but i will suggest again that maybe the reason that places like norway/switz/et al seem to manage their guns better is because their populations are.....well fed? not in desperate poverty? have access to state services that actually make their lives better?
xps oh whatever
― ullr saves (gbx), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:08 (thirteen years ago) link
how expensive is an illegal handgun? is the market price insensitive because if you need a gun, you need a gun?
― Philip Nunez, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:08 (thirteen years ago) link
― ullr saves (gbx), Sunday, January 9, 2011 10:08 PM (38 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
omg someone is talking sense
― call all destroyer, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:09 (thirteen years ago) link
yeah i dont know i feel like people are arguing about totally different things on this thread--im not actually defending current gun control laws like "oh its a good thing silencers are outlawed"? i dont give a shit about silencers. i want to take guns away from all americans because we dont know how to use them properly.
― max, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:09 (thirteen years ago) link
ok max
― ullr saves (gbx), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:10 (thirteen years ago) link
i think this is very otm. but only half of it. US culture just seems to worship guns.
― got electrolytes (The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:10 (thirteen years ago) link
Westerns and action movies would be so boring if everyone used silencers. Better to keep those things hard to get, for the sake of our entertainment industry.
― Josh in Chicago, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:11 (thirteen years ago) link
i want to take guns away from all americans because we dont know how to use them properly.
― max, Sunday, January 9, 2011 10:09 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark
most of them do :/ also rifles are a legitimate tool of popular resistance and u would be neutering the inevitable uprising of the working class
― Princess TamTam, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:12 (thirteen years ago) link
― max, Sunday, January 9, 2011 10:09 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
and i'm interested in talking about things that actually have a chance of happening, so we're both going to wind up disappointed
― call all destroyer, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:12 (thirteen years ago) link
right, agreed that there is a definite cultural thing at work here. it's just that you guys are obsessed with the fringe elements of that culture (gun shows!! militias!! the oregon trail!!! the mentally ill!!!! lol at these rednecks!!!) and are totally willing to ignore, like, all these boring midwesterners that shoot grouse on the weekend and keep their shit under lock and key 24/7
― ullr saves (gbx), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:15 (thirteen years ago) link
no we're not
― goldenarsehat.jpg (Schlafsack), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:16 (thirteen years ago) link
oddly enough by your definition it's the fringe elements that are the problem here
― goldenarsehat.jpg (Schlafsack), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:17 (thirteen years ago) link
(I am not attacki8ng you gbx, just saying)
likewise the boring midwesterners don't have to give a shit about inner city shootings, cause, I mean, they don't live there
― iatee, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:17 (thirteen years ago) link
it just so happens though that those fringe elements like gun shows are how guns make their ways into areas w/ a high crime rate gbx
like I said above, as a comprormise I'm fine with responsible midwest dudes practicing responsible gun ownership! it's all the dudes who aren't, and trying to figure out why and what's going wrong w/ the current system that's enabling them, that's what I'm interested in
― dayo, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:17 (thirteen years ago) link
cause there are no inner cities in the midwest
― mookieproof, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:17 (thirteen years ago) link
forgot about minneapolis
― iatee, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:19 (thirteen years ago) link
iatee see the thing is that you have actually demonstrated, in this very thread, that you dont give a shit about ppl doing something you happen to dislike in a safe and responsible manner. whereas, this boring midwesterner that hunts on the weekend that doesn't give a shit about inner city shootings is something you have literally made up.
― ullr saves (gbx), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:19 (thirteen years ago) link
yeah i mean i feel for the guys who shoot grouse on the weekend but someones gotta lose out, id rather it be them than 9-year-olds trying to meet congresswomen
― max, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:20 (thirteen years ago) link
i shoot grouse in the inner city
― positive reflection is the key (harbl), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:20 (thirteen years ago) link
I think the point is that gun control laws as they exist now make it easy for the responsible gun owning midwesterner to buy guns, but it also makes it easy for people with less-noble-purposes than shooting quail to buy guns, and that's the problem
― dayo, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:20 (thirteen years ago) link
need a venn diagram of the midwestern grouse shooter/inner-city gangbanger/loan psycho and how they got access to their guns
― call all destroyer, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:21 (thirteen years ago) link
scuse me "lone"
― call all destroyer, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:22 (thirteen years ago) link
oh i thought you really meant loan psycho! like a loan shark
― positive reflection is the key (harbl), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:22 (thirteen years ago) link
right, sure! and i'm totally in favor of doing what is possible (and legal, we will not see any changes to the 2nd amendment in any of our lifetimes) to sew those loopholes up, tout de suite. i guess what i meant was not so much the substantive dangers that gun shows represent, but the easily clownable stereotypes they offer up for strawmanning. that is, the idea that "gun show culture" is somehow more culturally influential than it really is. i dunno maybe no one actually suggested that, i can't keep up
― ullr saves (gbx), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:22 (thirteen years ago) link
i grouse at shooters in the inner city
― all i gotta do is akh nachivly (darraghmac), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:22 (thirteen years ago) link
― positive reflection is the key (harbl), Sunday, January 9, 2011 10:22 PM (10 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
what the hell throw him in too! we do need to solve every problem at once after all
― call all destroyer, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:23 (thirteen years ago) link
yeah i mean i feel for the guys who shoot grouse on the weekend but someones gotta lose out, id rather it be them than 9-year-olds trying to meet congresswomen― max, Sunday, January 9, 2011 9:20 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark
― max, Sunday, January 9, 2011 9:20 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark
dude for real? like i "get" what yr saying, it's just....whatever. go fucking blog something
― ullr saves (gbx), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:26 (thirteen years ago) link
i don't see anything wrong with what he's saying.
― got electrolytes (The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:27 (thirteen years ago) link
more people are allowed to own guns -> more guns are made -> more guns exist -> more guns are available for making crime
fewer people are allowed to own guns -> fewer guns are made -> fewer guns exist -> fewer guns are available for making crime
― goldenarsehat.jpg (Schlafsack), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:27 (thirteen years ago) link
sorry if that's simplistic but
so, you know, that trade show that's full of guns, if guns ownership laws were tighter there wouldn't be as many trade shows full of guns (which aligns with the point dayo was making iirc)
― goldenarsehat.jpg (Schlafsack), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:28 (thirteen years ago) link
fewer people are allowed -> fewer people exist -> fewer people make crime
― Kerm, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:29 (thirteen years ago) link
it's not that there's anything "wrong" with it, it's just intellectually lazy, and kinda offensive if you read it to suggest that saying "hey wait banning guns isn't really feasible and/or likely to stop nine year olds getting killed" is equivalent to saying that "i would prefer that a nine year old get killed than ppl in the midwest not be allowed to shoot turkey"
― ullr saves (gbx), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:30 (thirteen years ago) link
I'm kind of less sympathetic to people having guns legally to shoot birds than them having gotten one illegally because they fear for their lives.
― Philip Nunez, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:30 (thirteen years ago) link
― ullr saves (gbx), Monday, 10 January 2011 14:30 (36 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
wow, is that really how you read that?
― goldenarsehat.jpg (Schlafsack), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:31 (thirteen years ago) link
u.s. gun cultural contains vast multitudes--we best deal with it in pithy one-liners
― call all destroyer, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:31 (thirteen years ago) link
oh no i was being intellectually lazy in the great ilx gun control debate
― max, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:31 (thirteen years ago) link
gbx you can only be disingenuous in drawing that conclusion. max was clearly saying he'd rather grouse-shooters be disarmed than 9yo girls be killed.
― goldenarsehat.jpg (Schlafsack), Monday, 10 January 2011 03:32 (thirteen years ago) link
xp the penalty is....getting shot
― call all destroyer, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:32 (thirteen years ago) link
right but banning hunting has never been a national debate and never will be, whereas banning guns in inner cities *is* a political issue that the gun lobby and most people who support 'the right to bear arms' fight against viciously. it's ridiculous to pretend that the boring midwesterner's right to go hunting has ever been in question.
― iatee, Monday, 10 January 2011 03:32 (thirteen years ago) link