The Great ILX Gun Control Debate

yah lets keep the violent crime/murder distinction clear

some Scandinavian countries encourage the use of suppressors ("silencers"), whereas getting one hear is a many-month process that's very expensive

lol wait, did I say Sweden, I meant switzerland :/

Man if that list was representative its saying 90% of americans have a gun

..I know it isnt true. but yike.

Australia's in the top 20, its worth noting.

some Scandinavian countries encourage the use of suppressors ("silencers"), whereas getting one hear is a many-month process that's very expensive

― boots get knocked from here to czechoslovakier (milo z), Sunday, January 9, 2011 9:52 PM (6 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

what does this even have to do with anything

jesus - Canada is 9th?!

xposts!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Switzerland

yeah canks iirc all americans are made to undergo a mandatory one year stint in the military, just like in sweden

― dayo, Sunday, January 9, 2011 8:51 PM (47 seconds ago) Bookmark

even tho my gut reaction is to balk, severely, at mandatory service, i can't help but think it would do the US a world of good in some ways

worked pretty well in starship troopers

lol i thought it was well-known that canada was gun fucking central

Australia's in the top 20, its worth noting.

Of violent crime?

Surely due to it being hugely rural/bears n shit, skewing the gun req's? xpost

Adam: no of that gun ownership per pop list

brazil's a good example for the low gun ownership, high gun crime rate

but comparing america to anything but a highly developed western country is pointless

hey - i spent Christmas morning sitting on a couch next to a fully stocked gun case, but 9th - i did not expect.

oh righto xp to trayce

even tho my gut reaction is to balk, severely, at mandatory service, i can't help but think it would do the US a world of good in some ways

― ullr saves (gbx), Monday, January 10, 2011 10:53 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

fwiw all ex-military guys I know have been very very responsible in gun ownership. lol my cousin is married to a dude who owns one of like 7 .50 caliber sniper rifles in the states. O_o

Heck that list says we hold more guns per capita than mexico or columbia o_0

thread needs tombot

what does this even have to do with anything

I smell a rat with that list. I would have expected Sth Africa to be well above Australia. Presuming that list is recorded gun ownership, as Australia's got pretty tight audits on that stuff and Sth Africa's is messy as hell.

Perhaps you're unaware that their restriction is part of the initial wave of modern gun control - and are found much more frequently in other 'more strict' countries (such as those now being discussed).
― boots get knocked from here to czechoslovakier (milo z), Monday, January 10, 2011 10:55 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

I'm not following you milo

lol my cousin is married to a dude who owns one of like 7 .50 caliber sniper rifles in the states.

what does this even have to do with anything

― max, Sunday, January 9, 2011 9:52 PM (39 seconds ago) Bookmark

i know this is your 'thing' max but could you not do it

i still dont get what the point is

There are a ton of .50BMG in the US. A single-shot bolt action runs ~$2500, the military Barrett semi-auto will run you about $9k.
― boots get knocked from here to czechoslovakier (milo z), Monday, January 10, 2011 10:57 AM (44 seconds ago) Bookmark

I should clarify - one of 7 of these http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steyr_HS_.50 allowed in the US

or so he told me, I know nothing about guns

As many people possess multiple weapons and many others possess none, this number is not a representation of the percentage of people who possess guns in each nation.

and so on

sweden makes it easy to buy silencers and the US doesnt and that demonstrates....

girls with dragon tattoos

fwiw all ex-military guys I know have been very very responsible in gun ownership. lol my cousin is married to a dude who owns one of like 7 .50 caliber sniper rifles in the states. O_o

― dayo, Sunday, January 9, 2011 8:55 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

well yeah! because, you know, someone showed them how to use them. like i am totally down with mandatory training, licensing recert, etc. imo legislation like that would do more* to bring down gun deaths in the states than any wholesale ban on them

*"do more" in the "per Calorie of congressional exertion" sense.

I'm not following you milo

But in these countries we're talking about without the Wild West gun culture of the US (or whatever), they're widely available and their use is encouraged.

why does everything need 2 have a 'point' - why cant he just bring up some interesting little factoids huh - u guys are way too aggro, my least fav kind of ilx discussion thread is where u guys are all like YEAH BRO?? YEAH BRO???? like bullying milo into thinking guns are bad is the fulcrum on which world peace rests - just chill out testosterbros

that seems logical considering that there seems to be less of a risk of getting assassinated there xp

Those Steyrs are available here, too. I think that's the model someone got busted for selling to Iran a couple of years back?

yeah gbx, I'm with you there - that's about as reasonable a compromise as can be hoped for in a country where the right to own guns is built into its foundational document

still doesn't stop me from thinking of guns as being totally fucking barbaric, get real dudes you're not traveling the oregon trail anymore

By someone I mean the manufacturer

'Silencers' are a bogeyman in the US, much like assault rifles and so on - oh, criminals use them to stay undetected, etc.. Getting one requires a great deal of ATF paperwork and a $200 tax stamp.
But they generally don't even bring firearm noise down to a level that won't damage your hearing without protection, except for some .22s. They don't in any way silence a gun.
But in these countries we're talking about without the Wild West gun culture of the US (or whatever), they're widely available and their use is encouraged.

― boots get knocked from here to czechoslovakier (milo z), Monday, January 10, 2011 11:02 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

and this is relevant how

lol otm

xpost to dayo

why does everything need 2 have a 'point' - why cant he just bring up some interesting little factoids huh - u guys are way too aggro, my least fav kind of ilx discussion thread is where u guys are all like YEAH BRO?? YEAH BRO???? like bullying milo into thinking guns are bad is the fulcrum on which world peace rests - just chill out testosterbros

― Princess TamTam, Sunday, January 9, 2011 10:02 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

ur lucky i dont have a gun

I'm pretty sure it's relevant to a discussion of gun laws in Scandinavian countries and their gun cultures.

Yeeeeesh.

why does everything need 2 have a 'point' - why cant he just bring up some interesting little factoids huh - u guys are way too aggro, my least fav kind of ilx discussion thread is where u guys are all like YEAH BRO?? YEAH BRO???? like bullying milo into thinking guns are bad is the fulcrum on which world peace rests - just chill out testosterbros

― Princess TamTam, Monday, January 10, 2011 11:02 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

sorry that you're being forced to read this thread at gunpoint, what if I were to tell you that by outlawing guns you would no longer be forced to read this thread at gunpoint, would that interest you

now ur tolkein

only outlaws will force you to read this thread at gunpoint

sweden makes it easy to buy silencers and the US doesnt and that demonstrates....

― max, Sunday, January 9, 2011 8:59 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark

well it demonstrates that sweden has a more sane appraisal of how/why guns are used to kill ppl, probs. outlawing silencers is precisely the sorta law that seeks to score hollow political points (heyo) with a base w/o meaningfully effecting crime or w/e. the only ppl that are ~really~ going to want a silencer are gun nuts who want cool shit, professional criminals who need it for their job (and will get one anyway), and amateur criminals who want them to be badass (and then miss anything they shoot at). making it hard to get a silencer addresses a public health problem that literally doesn't exist (ppl getting iced by guns w/silencers at a rate higher than oh i don't know lightning strikes).

anyway, ad nauseum, but i will suggest again that maybe the reason that places like norway/switz/et al seem to manage their guns better is because their populations are.....well fed? not in desperate poverty? have access to state services that actually make their lives better?

xps oh whatever

how expensive is an illegal handgun? is the market price insensitive because if you need a gun, you need a gun?

anyway, ad nauseum, but i will suggest again that maybe the reason that places like norway/switz/et al seem to manage their guns better is because their populations are.....well fed? not in desperate poverty? have access to state services that actually make their lives better?

xps oh whatever

― ullr saves (gbx), Sunday, January 9, 2011 10:08 PM (38 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

omg someone is talking sense

yeah i dont know i feel like people are arguing about totally different things on this thread--im not actually defending current gun control laws like "oh its a good thing silencers are outlawed"? i dont give a shit about silencers. i want to take guns away from all americans because we dont know how to use them properly.

ok max

anyway, ad nauseum, but i will suggest again that maybe the reason that places like norway/switz/et al seem to manage their guns better is because their populations are.....well fed? not in desperate poverty? have access to state services that actually make their lives better?

i think this is very otm. but only half of it. US culture just seems to worship guns.

Westerns and action movies would be so boring if everyone used silencers. Better to keep those things hard to get, for the sake of our entertainment industry.