Megadeth - Classic or Dud

I went through that. Countdown To Extinction gave me this problem more than most albums too. But I thought it was pretty damn good for being the "sell-out album".

Does the radial neuropathy prevent him from playing guitar? That's what this article said.

There's so much musically on this album I didn't quite grasp as a youngun. Back then, for a while, Megadeth was neck and neck with Metallica in my opinion and then drastically they fell below Slayer, then Anthrax and finally I considered them somewhat ridiculous.

Listening to Peace Sells now, I'm inclined to believe this one album is better than anything Metallica ever did. Sure, the immediate reaction is that I must be crazy. But why do I say this? It is more emotional and realer than anything Metallica ever did, the guitar sounding like a demon-possessed Buddy Guy rather than the one-dimensional soloing Kirk Hammett had "perfected," which was either sombre classical or soulless speed-taps up until that point. When Metallica made the big announcement they were going for a bluesier feel on the Black Album later on, they just ended up sounding typical. Megadeth, on the other hand, managed to sound genuinely creepy and Satanic, completely halloween and exorcist, with all the fiery rage of hell you would imagine appropriate. The phased-out vocals give a rippling "burnt offering" effect that pushes the atmosphere over the top, claustrophobic and smokey. The mix is bleeding and blownout, unlike the pristine chugga-chugga crunch everyone else seemed to be after to showcase "speed metal tightness." Awesome choral screams of "OBEY" in The Conjuring and the final note of the album: "YOU...DIE!!!" But those flaming blues accents of Mustaine's B.C. Rich between vocal lines works amazingly well to add more wicked emotion and depth where other bands opted for straight-ahead blazing speed up until the designated guitar soloing spot in the song. The dramatic and quirky turns of tempo, guitars which seem to delight in slamming you from wall to wall, truly remind me of a possessed body being thrashed about by a malevolent puppetmaster, especially at the break in "Wake Up Dead." Unfortunately, this is one of the three songs on the album that have nothing to do with supernatural forces, but no matter, as the only other subject matter on the album is murder. "Wake Up Dead," is probably more figurative than literal, but it certainly sounds like a surprise attack is being carried out, especially with the chants "YOU DIE", "AND BURIED" between the tortured screams of "Wake Up Dead." Great album: starts with "Wake Up Dead" and ends with "My Last Words," which just happen to be: "YOU DIE!"

"hello me, it's me again!"

is he? god what a 12-step pussy

If he was really serious about it, don't you think he should take all of his most popular albums out of print? They aren't very Christian, that's for sure.

Mustaine remastered the hell out of this. He also ruined So Far, So Good... So What?!

Bad, bad remastering choices. I hate that.

Oh, wait.

I still love these impossible-to-sing lyrics from Liar (off So Far, So Good):

Start trouble, spread pain
Piss and venom, in your veins
Talk nasty, breathe fire
Smell rotten, you’re a liar
Sweat liquor, breathe snot
Eat garbage, spit blood
Diseased, health hazard
Scum bag, filthy bastard
Greasy face, teeth decay
Hair matted, drunk all day
Abscessed, sunken veins
Rot gut, scrambled brain
Steal money, crash cars
Rob jewelry, hock guitars
Rot in hell, it’s time you know
To your master, off you go

There's no way he sang that live without taking a breath.

I sampled some of Cryptic Writings and I kind of liked it. The System Has Failed is supposed to be the mighty return of Megadeth, but I'm thinking it's just a return to the RIP/CTE days, which is like radio metal. Whoever said he was trying to sound like Alice Cooper nailed it, but he didn't sound anything like that before RIP. Are either of these worth grabbing used (Cryptic Writings and System Has Failed)?

Only a nineteen year old college freshman in 1992 could get away with that.

Classic--Killing Is My Business, Peace Sells...But Who's Buyin'?, So Far, So Good, So What, Rust In Peace, Countdown to Extinction, Youthanasia, Cryptic Writings (yea fuck you I like some of the songs, altho this is NOT a metal album by any means and I probably won't like it as much now as I did in high school)...

Destroy--Risk (don't even bring this one up for debate), The World Needs a Hero (zzzzzzzzzz)

Meh--The System Has Failed. seriously, this wasn't some big comeback album, it was heavier for sure, it was better than the two albums before it, but it was STILL WATERED DOWN.

I heard some of United Abominations live and it was boring, by the numbers Megadeth. But they still rock live. "Wake Up Dead" is a trip live.

Youthanasia's pretty lame as I remember. haven't heard anything beyond that.

Pure classic: Rust in Peace, particularly Holy Wars and Tornado of Souls (which is basically a pop song with kick-arse metal guitars ie amazing).

jesus, RIP as radio metal????? come on guitarzan, it's faster and more unrelenting than 'peace sells...' in parts.

yep, RIP is the band's defining moment as far as i can see, and my favourite thrash record ever. 'peace sells...' is arguably the second best - megadeth arriving unexpectedly fully formed on only their second outing. this one seems to feature very heavily in current live sets and with good reason. i just wish i got to hear 'good mourning/black friday' live - what an exhilerating, relentless centrepiece.

'countdown to extinction' is excellent. consistently good all the way through with some absolute scorchers. 'this was my life' is pulverising melodic riff after riff and 'ashes in your mouth' has air-guitar inducing trade-off solos to rival 'hangar 18'.

'killing is my business...' sounds pretty brash and is a bit casio-esque in sound quality. the re-mastering did a lot to amend this however, and shed light on the good material here. the hallmark of an extremely hungry, young band at the very least.

'so far...' by contrast sounds just plain fucking weird. elements of good songwriting comes across in some of the tunes ('hook in mouth', 'in my darkest hour', 'mary jane'), but the whole thing, production-wise, sounds like it's stuck in a 1988 time capsule, forever rendering it dated and frustrating to listen to. and oh yeah, wasn't chuck behler a waste of space?

'youthanasia' has 'addicted to chaos', 'a tout le monde', and 'elysian fields', which are all quality songs, but there's a sense of over-earnestness and a snail-pace metronome setting pervading the whole thing. almost decent.

hated 'cryptic writings'. i mean they're trying hard to slap something together at this point, but the creative fuse has lost its spark, and we're left with a hard-rock album with average songs.

'risk' is atrocious as anyone will tell you. and 'the world needs a hero' is also totally forgettable.

the last two outings were pretty solid, but certainly not a return to anything. just a band more comfortable in its own skin than it had been in a long time

jesus, RIP as radio metal????? come on guitarzan, it's faster and more unrelenting than 'peace sells...' in parts.

I agree, I was specifically talking about Tornado of Souls. You can't argue that there are tons of great catchy hooks littered all over the album as well.

i agree with your assertion too, chap :) i was responding to guitarzan, and his strange observation that 'the system has failed' recalls 'rust in peace'.

plenty of catchy moments on RIP, totally! even on faster tunes such as 'five magics' and 'poison was the cure'.

RIP is awesome, love the debut too (Chosen Ones esp.). After RIP it's over

they were classic of course, and like most people i regard 'rust in peace' and 'peace sells' to be their finest moments. weirdly though, it took me quite some time to warm up to 'peace sells'. i used to think of it as too patchy, i think in light of its short duration (what, 35 minutes?) and the version of 'i ain't superstitious'.

glad to hear others go on about 'tornado of souls' btw. god how i love that one.

I just read in The Encyclopedia of Heavy Metal that Mustaine has been in and out of rehab 15 times.

yeah i think vh1's 'behind the music' said 16 times. it's probably on youtube, and worth watching.

I saw Megadeth open for Dio Sabbath at Holmdel, NJ last spring and they were totally on their game. Totally smoking set.

Do they still play plenty of 80s stuff?

A shitload. Vast majority of the show, plus the usual suspects from RIP.

Yea, I was very surprised at how varied the setlist was.

Granted I learned from the Rude Awakening live album that they don't have tunnel vision with their set list, but pretty much no Risk songs, only one Cryptic Writings tune, and the rest PURE UNBRIDLED METAL

His stage banter was D- though.

I saw Megadeth open for Dio Sabbath at Holmdel, NJ last spring and they were totally on their game. Totally smoking set.

-- Bill Magill, Wednesday, January 9, 2008 5:19 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Link

yeah i went to that tour as well and both me and my friend (neither one the biggest megadeth fans or anything) were kinda blown away...esp. suprised that mustaine barely talked at all..they tore through the set like the ramones...really blazing actually....it was nice to see, esp. in contrast to what metallica has become.

Metallica's shows would probably barely hit 2 hours if you cut out all of the excess banter and soloing.

is it true that the 'i want to watch the news' dad in the Peace Sells video is jello biafra???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

http://www.megadeth.com/popups/christmascard2012winners.html

they were awesome last night at Fort Rock. the best thing about Megadeth either being an opening act or playing festivals = Dave has no time for stage banter.

setlist was predictable, but Dystopia songs sounded much better live than on disc (mostly cuz the production is so bad on the new album). I will never not enjoy "Holy Wars" live.

sounded like they were detuning a half step. kinda lol cos nobody cares how well Dave sings.

this dumb woman kept turning around and doing the Gladiator "thumbs down" every time I cheered during "Hangar 18". swallowed her soul.

Megadeth is a band I listened to back in the late 80s and 90s, but they were never a favorite and as they got popular, I didn't listen to them for years. Saw them live once with Slayer, Anthrax and Alice In Chains and that was an impressive show.

Few months back I got that 5 classic albums collection at a pretty good price on Amazon and returned back to listening to them really for the first time since the early/mid 90s. Rust in Peace has kind of blown my mind. That has to be one of the most technical but still balls out rock and roll records made. It's pretty damn impressive, far beyond Metallica. The new mix I think does help as it's more in your face and not clouded in a ton of reverb and delay. What is hilarious right around this time I was getting obsessed with Rust in Peace, the Onion published this article which gave me a good chuckle.

http://www.theonion.com/article/humanity-still-producing-new-art-though-megadeths--50983

Going on. Back when they came out, I really didn't even like Countdown to Extinction or Youthanasia at all, but they also held up much better than I remembered. Mustaine's singing got pretty good too. That version of the Megadeth with Menza and Friedman is really good, better than I remembered.

Rust In Peace is probably my all-time favourite metal record.

Just got Dystopia today, and so far it's surprisingly good. It does nothing new, but I like how it kind of cherrypicks the different styles within the Megadeth sound. Could lose a couple of songs though, it does run out of steam towards the end.

As far as prog-thrash goes, then Rust In Peace > ...And Justice For All for me any day of the week... and I like ...And Justice For All a lot.

I don't get the love for Rust in Peace myself. I like Peace Sells... and Countdown to Extinction a lot, but the other albums from Megadeth's peak years always seem to fall short for me - a few good moments, and a bunch of half-baked dross.

I was that way about Rust for yeaaaaaaaaars, and I dunno what it was, one day it went from sounding like the overrated sterile tech-wankfest I thought it was to sounding like an eargasm. almost every note on that album rings true for me now, tho Peace SElls is not far behind it.

I loooooooooove "Killing is My Business" because it's the type of album that Dave's pretentious ass would never have the balls to make. I'm not saying his other albums are Liquid Tension Experiment type efforts, but the first album is so raw and unhinged, like a train about to derail, and sloppy as fuck, the type of shit he wouldn't tolerate on a record now. and while the tunes aren't necessarily all memorable, I love teh energy of the thing - plus "Last Rites/Loved You to Death" and the title track are amazing.

So Far So Good So What suffers from a few things - one, that the title makes it sound like a greatest hits album (for years I didn't buy it cos that's what I thought it was), and two, it doesn't really maintain the high bar that "Into the Lungs of Hell" and "Set the World Afire" sets. The pointless "Anarchy" cover derails things a bit, "Mary Jane" is....good, but not great, and "502" is aight. I mean I like it a lot but it isn't essential like the album before it. Kinda amazes me that Rust came out after it.

Countdown is indeed great and I get that some consider it a 'sellout' album but IMO Megadeth sold out correctly (if you believe they did at all, which I don't) - the songs are leaner, but no less heavy. "Skin 'o my teeth" rocks ass, I love "Architecture of Aggression"'s esoteric vocal, "Ashes In Your Mouth" is seriously dope, ok I do love the cheese of "Sweating Bullets", "High Speed dirt" is fun. where Megadeth went awry in the 90s was selling out the wrong way - Megadeth were never good at writing fucking pop hooks (to this day I have no fucking idea why "Trust" is still on setlists - is there *anybody* who is dying to hear this song anymore?). felt like Youthanasia was almost a hair metal album yet in a good way - catchy as fuck, tho guitar-wise barely scans.

I think Dystopia is a letdown for me because I hate the production. Mustaine's vocal is so processed he sounds like a reverb-drenched cyborg, and why? it isn't like he ever sounded like Rob Halford and needs to mask deficiencies - dude sounds like a cartoon weasel, if anything his decaying voice enhances things. and the guitars lack bite - too polished and clean.

but the songs just aren't there, to me. the first three tunes are good, and I'd say most of the material is pleasant for sure, but like there's a lot that doesn't land. I relistened to 2009's Endgame the other night to see if maybe I was being kind to its memory and...nope, that shit still holds up, and sounds so much better in comparison. Not just cos it's 'faster' or 'more technical', no, cos it actually sounds like material that Dave believes in, whereas to me Dystopia sounds like an album Dave felt like he had to make out of obligation. not to mention, the heavy-arching concept shit is eye-rolling.

Every Megadeth album has 2 or 3 great songs - I like Endgame a lot, and Thirteen was really surprisingly good (though I can't trust my own judgment of it, since I was working for the label at the time).

Holy Wars is like the end of surf guitar. You really can't take it any further out. Hanger 18, Lucricia and Holy Wars are also really great. Marty Friedman is pretty much a guy using his jedi powers for good instead of evil, which is admirable.

Dave was always a terrible lyricist, but the lyrics on "Holy Wars" are fucking sweet

i literally just bought a bus ticket and a show ticket to see these guys again tomorrow cos it's not a festival so I get a full set.

I was drinking when I did this.

At the Tabernacle ATL seeing them now. Srsly. They will be onstage before 8. I dig

It's pretty damn impressive, far beyond Metallica.

In terms of technical prowess, yes, but classic era Metallica were much better songwriters imo. RiP is where Mustaine got closest.

I wouldn't say that. Metallica could write very catchy choruses and killer riffs, but especially in their longer songs like MoP or the Justice songs they show a real lack of knowledge how to build epic songs beyond repeating the same 2-3 riffs ad nauseam. I mean, the riffs are so good that they do pull it off, but there's not much else.

I disagree with that.

Yea me too. Feel like that describes KEA or AJFA but not RTL or MOP.

Metallica peaked earlier than Megadeth, who really never had a stable band lineup till Rust In Peace.

Even before the Black Album, Metallica had more variety in their tunes as they liked to use all sorts of segues and intros at different tempos. Megadeth had more groove and the bright bass was like Maiden up front in the mix.

they were so good last night. we got "Poison was the Cure" and "Tornado of Souls". i got drunk to the point of running back and forth across teh back of the Tabernacle and doing air guitar-cum-martial arts.

idk - I was expecting Dave to be irritating as fuck as he usually is during full, non-festival sets. he barely said two words all night. and even though I'm lukewarm on Dystopia, he really seems to believe in his music, still. Unlike many of the born-again musicians, he hasn't disowned large portions of his back catalog from live sets (a la Blackie from WASP, who changes words/omits specific songs from sets now) cos he recognizes they're an important part of 'Deth.

but c'mon - Dave's a tool. it's just, I hear those riffs, and solos, and cotdamn. his new band, well....they can fuckin' play.

but Dave...."A Tout Le Monde"? quit playing that shit live. nobody else likes it.

Last time I saw Megadeth they were touring with Lacuna Coil, so he had Cristina Scabbia sing that song with them. It didn't get any better.

hahaha I was at that tour, and yes....agreed.

I loved it when I was 15 and metal power ballads were my thing, but yeesh, hardly a "Fade to Black" it is...

Christ - Nick Menza died: http://www.theguardian.com/music/2016/may/22/nick-menza-megadeth-drummer-dies-collapsing-stage-los-angeles

51 is no age.

Wow. That's pretty terrible.

damn, RIP. he was definitely my favorite & the most distinctive Megadeth drummer.

and wow, his dad (Don Menza, who i knew of from the Buddy Rich records that i was listening to in high school at the same time as Megadeth) is still around.

RIP :(

Listening to Killing and Peace Sells this morning, what a weird fucking band, like how did they put this shit together, Mustaine's leads take shredding into avant garde territory

The remasters are maybe the worst remaster job in the history of music, thankfully the originals are up

Killing is such a weird album because it's kind of sloppy and all over the place (though the latest remaster cleaned it up significantly). songs have less melodic sensibility, and Dave sings like he's in a cave. yeah, it fuckin rules. first three songs are a helluva 1-2-3.

Peace Sells is probably my second favorite, still love that the album opens up with an intense thrash song about not wanting his girlfriend to know someone else is balling him.

Different thread, but some of the same characters. Listening to Yngwie a bit of late (yeah, I know) and one thing I noticed listening to some of his tunes this time around was that he never really had a good rhythm section at least on the records. Part of that is I think like much 80s metal it was all tracked a piece at a time with the drums and bass put on afterwards instead of played together like a band. But one thought I had listening to them was, I wonder what it would have sounded like if Yngwie had a kickass rhythm section like David Ellefson and Mick Menza behind him. Yngwie's keyboard player or at least the dude that plays on that fun video from Russia in 91 is fun, so I would keep him and Joe Lynn Turner in the band with the Megadeth rhythm section.

Mary Jane all day

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1EQbAs3Y5oQ

Great rehearsal video with a surprise guest