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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqAZsoF-ghw

Brian Clough taking exactly the opposite view about analysis here. While I've got a bit of sympathy with where he in particular is coming from, there's a kind of anti-intellect bent to it (of the kind that often makes me feel I'm in love with the wrong sport)

Ismael Klata, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 13:46 (eight years ago) link

I mentioned it in another thread, but Alan Hansen's "Who gave you that one?" to Lee Dixon after he rolled off a stat about Stoke made my blood boil. Happened during the World Cup, too.

The Goal Of The Month music is shite an' all.

The referee was perfect (Chris), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 13:48 (eight years ago) link

happened the last night too

cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 13:53 (eight years ago) link

Think this came up elsewhere but maybe there's a problem with having the same old faces for so long. Hansen and Lineker have been there for over 15 years but it doesn't seem like they are any better at the job now than when they started, and maybe feel too safe and unchallenged.

sock lobster (blueski), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:41 (eight years ago) link

two key words at the end there.

cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:47 (eight years ago) link

I don't like the no clock thing too and have always wondered about it.

The Scottish football highlights are odd in that they don't even bother trying to offer any kind of drama or tension. I guess it makes sense since they aren't shown till long afterwards (which is bad enough itself), but having a highlights show where games are prefaced in the studio with comments like "now let's see how St Johnstone held Aberdeen to a draw" and the highlights themselves having commentary moments like "but Aberdeen didn't keep their lead for long" in the runup to the goal it's talking about doesn't help anything.

Antoine Bugleboy (Merdeyeux), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 18:01 (eight years ago) link

a clock that just faded on and off at regular intervals would be good

sock lobster (blueski), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 18:04 (eight years ago) link

Lineker is very, very good btw - you just don't notice so much because he's not particularly likeable. Lets the guests speak, knows his stuff, generally steers things in the right direction and only occasionally lets himself down by getting involved with the crap. It's not his fault the guests are usually terrible - he shows appropriate respect to the good ones.

Ismael Klata, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 18:39 (eight years ago) link

lineker deserves a better panel than shearer or lawrenson, and i think it's widely accepted that hansen would quite clearly be fit to up his game were he challenged to actually debate or analyze anything whatsoever. he's settled into the easy contempt of the bright kid in the remedial class for so long now.

john giles would have him for breakfast.

cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 19:13 (eight years ago) link

Hansen used to be really good and much more angry/critical. I actually think if they gave Lawro a bit of a kick up the hole he's at least got a brain, you can tell he's capable of analysing a game to some level. Shearer is just a tragedy though, the man is just a huge wanker.

Would love to see Shearer with Giles and Dunphy....god that'd be amazing.

I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 19:48 (eight years ago) link

they should try and give o'neill a permanent role for a while...

I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 19:49 (eight years ago) link

Shearer is just a tragedy though, the man is just a huge wanker.

for some reason this is my favourite sentence of prose I've read today

acoleuthic, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 19:50 (eight years ago) link

In an earlier time I think Ronan might have used the word "brutal"

I agree about Lineker, he's very good at what he does. No idea how much is left on the cutting room floor of course.

progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 19:53 (eight years ago) link

On Lineker's 'what's wrong with English football' thing when they showed footage of them watching Klose's goal, I was a bit shocked that Shearer was the one ranting and raving while everyone else just looked glum and deathly quiet. I guess I think of him as having so little personality that seeing him caring about something was a surprise.

Ismael Klata, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 19:55 (eight years ago) link

just hates foreigners imo

cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 19:59 (eight years ago) link

and no lawrenson is a brainless gobshite, i don't think there's anything he's got in reserve or anything. his other media work just backs that up

cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 19:59 (eight years ago) link

Lineker is very, very good btw - you just don't notice so much because he's not particularly likeable. Lets the guests speak, knows his stuff, generally steers things in the right direction and only occasionally lets himself down by getting involved with the crap. It's not his fault the guests are usually terrible - he shows appropriate respect to the good ones.

― Ismael Klata, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 18:39 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

lineker deserves a better panel than shearer or lawrenson, and i think it's widely accepted that hansen would quite clearly be fit to up his game were he challenged to actually debate or analyze anything whatsoever. he's settled into the easy contempt of the bright kid in the remedial class for so long now.

both of these posts otm.

another problem to list - saying teams have scored on the live updates when they haven't. jeez is it that hard to only type goal updates and score changes WHEN SOMEONE ACTUALLY SCORES?

gazza bale flame (a hoy hoy), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 20:42 (eight years ago) link

the live updates are terrible, if you compare the bbc one to the guardian one you see loads of incidents are missed, not to mention the fact that they sometimes leave huge gaps before updating it...

I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 21:06 (eight years ago) link

they are pretty much illiterate too. i mean i know it's live, but the guardian manages to remain coherent. and they're the guardian.

caek, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 21:10 (eight years ago) link

mind you that bloke doing bolton liverpool on saturday, that was all over the place, errors everywhere. they have a sub working with them as well at bbc so it's two people fucking up...i think they have it completely arseways tbh, they want newspaper experience for the people who do that job. all they need is people who are used to watching matches and feverishly typing on facebook/forums...

I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 21:15 (eight years ago) link

hot damn

cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 21:16 (eight years ago) link

haha, did your sky interview already happen? any news?xp

caek, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 21:17 (eight years ago) link

haha it's true tho, why on earth would you seek old media people to do such a colloquial and fun job. prob explains why most of them are like if that old beepy thing on grandscreen could form sentences.

interview is friday...i'm fucked with a chest infection but it might be breaking a bit hopefully, i haven't been able to think about it much cos of that but now that it's easing feeling quite confident. actually heard today got an interview with the guardian as well (just to ensure i've slagged off every potential employer here) in a few weeks, but it's not a sport related role.

I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 21:20 (eight years ago) link

well good luck!

there is a thread for slagging the guardian off more generally on ILE if that would be useful?

caek, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 21:22 (eight years ago) link

yeah i'm there plenty, i'm scared they'll ask if i use comment is free, i might delete my account beforehand so they don't see me making endless juvenile remarks about articles...

I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 21:24 (eight years ago) link

actually thinking about the updates thing...it's probably as slow it as it is because the first guy writes it, the second guy checks it, he then sends a copy to the bbc lawyers who forward it to text rights, then it is filtered through the bip system and must be signed off manually by tvc security.

I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 21:27 (eight years ago) link

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/scotland/9156977.stm

the headline for this on the main page "managerial greats, are they a dying breed."

real clever there.

I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 22:29 (eight years ago) link

http://news.bbc.co.uk/cbbcnews/hi/newsid_9160000/newsid_9162600/9162687.stm

lawro out of his comfort zone. not actually as funny as it could have been (since everyone funny has been fired) but still funny seeing lawro in this mode...

I see what this is (Local Garda), Friday, 5 November 2010 15:18 (eight years ago) link

how'd it go ronan?

gazza bale flame (a hoy hoy), Saturday, 6 November 2010 07:38 (eight years ago) link

Yo sam thanks for asking, i posted a tiny bit of this on ile, it went largely well but was really weird.

I expected a full on interrogation type deal like you'd get in BBC but it was really informal and nice. Made me worry they'd already given the job away except they spent ages talking about what it's like to work there etc. Loads of it was them selling/reassuring me about the job.

Then I had to do a subbing test in the middle with a sports news script and I cut it down a lot and removed all the kerrazy mistakes. There was one about cricket tho where I knew it was a mistake but didn't know the exact right year.

I mean overall it went great in that I was well able to answer everything they asked. I guess personally I'd rather if they'd been harsher as I'd have had more chance to show my skills. I guess maybe they are happier to take your cv at face value than the beeb.

They did show me around the office too at the end. I guess the relaxed feel either means they've already decided I can do the job or as I said, already given it away!

There's two jobs going, one permanent and one freelance. Permanent would be pretty amazing and would avoid what happened to me at BBC ever happening again.

I see what this is (Local Garda), Saturday, 6 November 2010 09:16 (eight years ago) link

I've noticed there's a kind of MOTD hierarchy of importance - Chelsea, Man U and Arsenal all get lengthy, above-the-fold treatment; the stage is set with a narrative introduction beforehand and highlights are followed by video playback and analysis. Then a fourth club gets a half-hearted version of this. Then you get an absolutely peremptory, moronic intro to the next match ("X have won two in a row..... while Y are unbeaten at home this year!" FFS); the remaining matches are shown with no intro, no analysis, only goals or shots on goal.

Is it just because I is American, or does it strike anyone else as strange that the pan-UK BBC dedicates the lion's share of each MOTD to the same three or four teams every single show? Would it be heresy to suggest trimming the top four condensed games by a minute or so each, so as to offer better highlights from ALL the games and a bit more analysis of them? Sure, Wigan's not a big-market team but it's a show about the Premier League - they need to be in there properly surely!

progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Monday, 8 November 2010 11:04 (eight years ago) link

dude you've forgotten basic capitalism 101

acoleuthic, Monday, 8 November 2010 11:06 (eight years ago) link

it's the BBC! they don't have the same pressures! there are LEAGUE games (in the following five-hour League show) that get more attention than many Premier League games

progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Monday, 8 November 2010 11:16 (eight years ago) link

It's funny, but I never used to notice the hierarchy until a couple of years back when somebody made a big thing of their team always being on last. Now any suspense the show had is totally ruined for me - if Chelsea-Fulham is on before Man Utd-Everton it's obvious Chelsea must've had a shock defeat. At least if Blackburn-Wolves is up first it gives due notice that there must've been a death, so you can look away if squeamish.

Ismael Klata, Monday, 8 November 2010 11:17 (eight years ago) link

it's at least 7 and a half hours long

acoleuthic, Monday, 8 November 2010 11:17 (eight years ago) link

also lol klata

acoleuthic, Monday, 8 November 2010 11:18 (eight years ago) link

the consequence of MOTD's top-heaviness is that when any of the Big Clubs play any of the other clubs (which is all the time) there's no narrative there. Lineker and others need to tell the story of the smaller clubs, build a narrative beyond "beset by injuries of late" or "best start to the season since 2001". in any given game there are at least 24 stories to be told.

progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Monday, 8 November 2010 11:19 (eight years ago) link

the football league show is even worse btw - they tend to give 20 minutes to a big championship game, 15 minutes to a big league one game, 20 minutes to claridge, manish + lizzie doing their vapid thing, and about 30 seconds to every other game

acoleuthic, Monday, 8 November 2010 11:21 (eight years ago) link

here's an idea: every game gets 3 good minutes, there is no presenter

acoleuthic, Monday, 8 November 2010 11:22 (eight years ago) link

in fact, slate ITV all you like but this ^^^ was kinda how they did the football league in the late 90s/early 00s

acoleuthic, Monday, 8 November 2010 11:23 (eight years ago) link

My favorite thing about the League show is Manish's tight black trousers and his incredibly awkward "just standing around" pose

progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Monday, 8 November 2010 11:27 (eight years ago) link

Also the inexplicable WALKS he takes down the motel corridors that line the upper section of whatever airplane hangar they're in. "Oh hello..." I half expect him to be zipping up his tight black trousers at the beginning of the shot. "Excuse me! Just popped in for a quickie"

progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Monday, 8 November 2010 11:30 (eight years ago) link

I still haven't forgiven him for his presentation of the 2007 Cricket World Cup. Yeah he's improved as a broadcaster since then but he's still a mudskipper clambering out of the marsh on the sports correspondent evolutionary chain.

acoleuthic, Monday, 8 November 2010 11:32 (eight years ago) link

When he, Lizzie and Steve converge at the end it is like they are waiting forthe cameras to stop rolling so that they can produce a young fowl from the folds of Steve's undergarments and sacrifice it to the director general

acoleuthic, Monday, 8 November 2010 11:33 (eight years ago) link

That's crazy!

That you made it to the end.

progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Monday, 8 November 2010 11:41 (eight years ago) link

league two is always reliable for batshit 9-goal thrillers

acoleuthic, Monday, 8 November 2010 11:43 (eight years ago) link

Had the misfortune to listen to Saturday's 606 podcast during my run this morning. Simon Jordan, what a fucking wind-up merchant scab knob end.

Had to skip to something else after 15 minutes. He was worse than Savage.

James Mitchell, Monday, 8 November 2010 11:47 (eight years ago) link

Martin Samuel tackling the same issue this morning:

It would appear this show exists to remind us of the genius of Danny Baker, because 18 minutes of his programme which ran for a year until October 1992 and sparkled with wit, irreverence and, on occasions, righteous anger, was worth 18 years of the sorry whinge fest that has followed in its name

Ismael Klata, Monday, 8 November 2010 11:50 (eight years ago) link

Heh. I thought someone refused to cross a picket line but I guess he was on because Savage had an evening game.

James Mitchell, Monday, 8 November 2010 11:58 (eight years ago) link

the consequence of MOTD's top-heaviness is that when any of the Big Clubs play any of the other clubs (which is all the time) there's no narrative there. Lineker and others need to tell the story of the smaller clubs, build a narrative beyond "beset by injuries of late" or "best start to the season since 2001". in any given game there are at least 24 stories to be told.

I actually think MOTD2 has been pretty good at doing this for a while, going round one club per week, talking to the fans in the buildup to the game and so forth. It works pretty well with yer Blackpools and West Broms and the like. The problems come when you try and say something exciting about yr perennial midtable cloggers, I can't honestly think of many interesting ways to cover Blackburn or Wigan at this stage.

Matt DC, Monday, 8 November 2010 13:41 (eight years ago) link

Think Tom's otm. An English player succeeding - or even just going - abroad always seems to create huge waves with yr press. Probably because so few succeeded.

But it's still clickbait that deserves to be called out imo.

Le Bateau Ivre, Wednesday, 1 November 2017 17:08 (one year ago) link

Count yerselves lucky you don't have to watch on rte. For twenty years George Hamilton has been a second ahead of the picture and it has spoiled every moment of football ever and is currently doing so for spurs madrid

Gary Synaesthesia (darraghmac), Wednesday, 1 November 2017 19:53 (one year ago) link

two months pass...

rip armfield, have fond memories of the man

#TeamHailing (imago), Monday, 22 January 2018 11:01 (one year ago) link

Ah, shame, good guy. RIP Jimmy.

Whiney Houston (Tom D.), Monday, 22 January 2018 11:51 (one year ago) link

LIVE FA Cup - De Bruyne with cheeky free-kick v Cardiff

FFS! If only he had attempted a deferential free-kick, cos I hate that word.

calzino, Sunday, 28 January 2018 16:34 (one year ago) link

six months pass...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-45194443

literally end the bbc here

imago, Wednesday, 15 August 2018 17:52 (one year ago) link

privatised, shut down, fucked off. over.

imago, Wednesday, 15 August 2018 17:53 (one year ago) link

three months pass...

AHAHAHA LOOK IT'S NOLE GALLAGER I WROTE A "JOEK" ABOUT DEFINITELY MAYBE THAT WAS WORTH EDITING IN

cunts

Mama Weer All Tankee Now (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 25 November 2018 09:12 (ten months ago) link

two months pass...

Oh, well, OK, Sutton was talking about the Premier League. But I refuse to recognise that backstop, which exists in these discussions simply to excuse people with no sense/knowledge of history.

— Richard Williams (@rwilliams1947) February 7, 2019

the former old grey whistle test presenter mugging off Chris Sutton goodstyle!

calzino, Thursday, 7 February 2019 16:03 (eight months ago) link

RW is a contributor to Mark S's book and was at the launch party a few weeks back. I regret not having a word with him. He seems like a righteous fellow.

Tim, Thursday, 7 February 2019 16:19 (eight months ago) link

Sutton doing the clod-hopping football shock jock thing is currently vying with zombie Humphrys as the worst thing about BBC radio.

Tim, Thursday, 7 February 2019 16:20 (eight months ago) link

I like him a lot, despite him stanning for Nicola Sturgeon! It's probably counter to everything ILM/ILX represents but I liked his music blog (that is currently on hiatus) as well. His knowledge of 70'/80's footballers is unfuckwithable and he seems to realise it actually existed before Murdoch. Yeah and that fucking high-octane talksport twat style of punditry that is so prevalent these days - he's about as far opposite of *that* as it gets.

calzino, Thursday, 7 February 2019 16:32 (eight months ago) link

Tim otm, out-Savaging Savage is no way to go thru life

Stephen Yakkety-Yaxley-Rosbif (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 7 February 2019 16:37 (eight months ago) link

we have this twat (ex-goalie matt glennon) as a summariser on local bbc radio, and he's done the same course I think.

calzino, Thursday, 7 February 2019 16:46 (eight months ago) link

god I just want make clear I was repping for RW in xxp in case it sounds like CS.

calzino, Thursday, 7 February 2019 16:52 (eight months ago) link

That was clear.

Tim, Thursday, 7 February 2019 16:58 (eight months ago) link

Though the idea that you're an avid reader of Chris Sutton's music blog is a happy one.

Tim, Thursday, 7 February 2019 16:59 (eight months ago) link

The only thing I don't like about RW's blog was that he kept reviewing great-sounding shows that happened within a mile of our flat and the first I heard of it would be his review.

Tim, Thursday, 7 February 2019 17:00 (eight months ago) link

virgil van dijk is great tho

( ͡☉ ͜ʖ ͡☉) (jim in vancouver), Thursday, 7 February 2019 17:19 (eight months ago) link


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