Batman carries on beginning in ... The Dark Knight

so then how could you like it if Ledger was the only good thing in it?

― Gucci Mane hermeneuticist (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, September 2, 2010 3:21 AM (47 seconds ago) Bookmark

Cuz he's in a lot of it?

http://media.bigoo.ws/content/gif/music/music_139.gif

i don't know why i don't like the prestige, but i don't. i like the novel, but only kinda. i mean, of christopher priest i've only read that and inverted world, and i like christopher priest, but it's not my favorite book or anything. and it succeeds by virtue of its ideas more than its storytelling. in the movie, the ideas get refined (streamlined and improved, frankly), but the characters become even more two-dimensional, and for some reason it just doesn't work. i loved thinking about the movie after the fact, but watching it did nothing for me. and (can i say this?) i fucking loathe christian bale in this visceral way that is 100% unfair, i'm sure, but is nonetheless unavoidable. i just do not like looking at or listening to him.

have yes to see inception. in spite of everything, i'm looking forward to it...

never mind 'in spite of everything' it's awesome.

i don't know why i don't like the prestige, but i don't.

i fucking loathe christian bale in this visceral way that is 100% unfair

also I mean this in nicest way possible but gtfo.

don't get me wrong, i liked the last batman movie. but ledger's joker was the only good thing about it.

― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, September 1, 2010 11:09 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I dunno I really kinda liked Eckhart as Harvey Dent before he turns into Two-Face. I thought he made him a very dynamic character and it was cool that the first two-thirds of the movie was a sort of Joker/Dent binary with Batman being a sort of combination Dent henchman/looney third-wheel (that voice!)

I still have a soft spot for Bale because of Empire of the Sun, despite increasingly weird behaviour and acting.

many xposts but er if 'inception' is based on 'a dream of wessex' it is veeeeeerrrrrrrry loosely based

i mean, total recall is about as close to that book as inception is

'based' is not the right work--'a possible source for' might be a little better...still gonna read it before seeing the movie.

the connection is pretty much just DUDE WHAT IF WE COULD PLUG OURSELVES INTO STUFF AND SHARE DREAMS DUDE. n.b. not a spoiler

HOW DARE YOU SPOIL DARK KNIGHT BY TELLING ME BATMAN WAS IN IT

whatev: Dream of Wessex then Inception.

also I mean this in nicest way possible but gtfo.

― rotting-month story (Drugs A. Money), Thursday, September 2, 2010 7:55 AM (7 hours ago) Bookmark

yeah okay, point taken. but i loved him in empire of the sun, and liked him in american psycho. even though i think he's horrible, horrible can work in the right role. i.e., "i just do not like looking at or listening to him," was overstated cuz unpleasantness is sometimes a cool character trait. eric roberts did some great work in the 80s while seeming at all times like a complete asshole, and i've liked ray liotta in certain roles, despite the fact that he creeps me the fuck out.

...trying to defend the idea that there's something more to my disappointment in the prestige than a visceral loathing of the bale. not sure i'm pulling it off though.

I wish we'd seen more of Bruce Wayne's pecs and poon-chasing side.

but it's not on the comic book, yeah, whatever, blah

*in

i wish there'd been some "Secretary" type scenes w/ Maggie

yumz

ok so gyllenhall & holmes look alike because they're playing the same character, but how far back does this female lead resemblance go?
who was the lead in that movie before memento?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8UiJmCN_K4&feature=player_embedded

Jim Emerson takes down the chase sequence in this video.

I found this sequence utterly baffling the first time I saw it, and every subsequent time. At last, I now know exactly why.

... You're an idiot?

I mean, it's not like this is a Transformers movie with two vaguely humanoid gunmetal grey robots wrapped around each other so tightly you can't tell where one ends and the other begins, or which one is the good guy and which one is the bad guy.

I wasn't quite as harsh but...yeah.

I think he took down himself, not any chase scenes.

I thought that Christopher Nolan was a pretty poor director of action sequences was commonly accepted.

Funny that he does a shot-by-shot breakdown of what doesn't work in the sequence and he's still called an idiot.

action sequences /= chase sequences

he's not so good with the hand to hand combat stuff imho. but he is VERY good with the car chase-y stuff.

two vaguely humanoid gunmetal grey robots wrapped around each other so tightly you can't tell where one ends and the other begins

seriously bummed that i can't find gr8080's transformers porn thread to link to here

I agree with Shakes. Interesting thing I found out recently about Nolan is that he shoots his own second unit stuff. or I guess more accurately, his movies are entirely first unit. could probably use that as evidence that he's either doing something massively right, or massively wrong.

Funny that he does a shot-by-shot breakdown of what doesn't work in the sequence and he's still called an idiot.

In fairness, the video is blocked by my work so I can't watch it

However, I didn't think there was anything the least bit baffling or confusing about that chase sequence so I don't really expect to be enlightened as to all the ways it was confusing or didn't since, for me, it did.

I don't think it's a question of whether the sequence works for you or not, but there are significant issues if you're looking for them. Or more accurately, if something about it didn't work for you, the video might be a good explanation of why. The SWAT van has always bothered me, and I was never sure why. Even if you don't care about where Dent is sitting in the police van or where the cop cars are positioned, that fall into the river really makes no sense at all.

there are significant issues if you're looking for them

this seems like a critical statement to consider

I mean, we're not really talking about Rob Liefeld and his tenuous grasp of human physiology here, we're talking about minor continuity gaffes that happen in every single movie ever made.

Shut up man Jango Fett was just clumsy

i don't know much about comics but damn ppl must really hate this rob liefeld guy, his name comes up all the time, always negative context

he is the worst

The SWAT van is a pretty major continuity gaffe, but I take your point. He mentions in the essay that this isn't about a car being put back together for a few frames after it's been exploded, or a headlight is out in shot and on the next, it's a cumulative effect of shot composition and editing being spatially confusing. Ronin's chase sequences are rightly lauded because Frankenheimer got all those little things right, and when they get put together they add up to a very satisfying, sensible chase scene when your'e watching it, even if you're not aware of exactly why.

There's a good bit in the video where he talks about the scene in the script where the Batmobile charges down the lane and runs underneath the garbage truck, and he talks about how the shots as filmed could have made sense and fit in but they added some confusing inserts (the Joker looking forward as though the Batmobile was in his lane, a shot of the cop driver swerving, etc).

the Joker looking forward as though the Batmobile was in his lane

rmde

re: Liefeld, I can't verify that this link works because my job blocks it, but: http://progressiveboink.com/archive/robliefeld.html

more to the point, here is his infamous Captain America and a rendition of the necessary anatomy for the pic to make any goddamn sense:

http://27.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_li1bbyY9AC1qgl2lfo1_400.jpg

sigh xpost

Okay, I watched the video. It's actually pretty good and gives you a lot to chew on - anyone who hates how little clarity is prized in today's action movies should get something out of it. He walks you through some of the technical aspects that are treated differently in an action scene versus say a dialogue scene, aspects of blocking and composition like the 180 rule. I think he makes a mistake in not attempting to understand why Nolan was crossing the line wrt stuff like the truck t-boning the SWAT van - the disorienting effect there is clearly intentional! And some of the nitpicks don't hold up, like 4 minutes in he clamors for an interior two-shot to establish the geography of the scene, but the reverse shot has already established that the SWAT guy is sitting across from Harvey, and the movie never contradicts that by revealing that he's sitting next to him or anything like that. He's right that the way the truck recovers is clearly impossible, but I can chalk that up to movie magic. And some of the information that the scene fails to convey with visual storytelling is still present for the audience via context. The scene still works.

But this is all technical stuff - the truck chase works because he understands that the things that make for a good action scene are the same things that make for any other kind of good scene - the audience understanding and caring about what's happening, what's at stake, why characters are doing what they're doing, and the scene serving some narrative purpose in moving things from the scene before it to the scene after it. This is why crystal clear visual storytelling should be an action filmmaker's best friend - it's just a physical dramatization of the movie's conflicts! If you had some epic verbal confrontation in a script you were shooting, you wouldn't have the actors mumble the whole thing and then blare techno music over it to make it even more confusing, would you? OK, some directors would. But it'd be a bad idea if what you want is for the audience to care about what's happening.

Wrt Nolan I'm not sure what to think. I'll take it in good faith that in certain instances he's breaking rules he's familiar with to achieve a certain effect. But I do sorta wonder if shooting his own action means he stretches himself too thin, because in Inception there's a lot of papering over of geographical incoherence with nonsense cutting. Avid is seriously the worst thing to ever happen to action movies. I really think most directors are just lazy and this new school of action directing - handheld, tight close-ups, constant cutting - is a way for them to dispense with putting effort into staging interesting scenes. Great scenes have been done in this style, but it takes effort to set yourself apart.

i really love this pinefox post btw:

- I just really liked Batman! with his great virtue, realiability, proficiency, infinite skill, Batmobile, motorbike, incorrigibility - he was terrific to watch! and every time he shows up in a scene (including suddenly the one where Jokes is interrogated), it's really exciting!

― the pinefox, Monday, July 21, 2008 8:23 PM (3 years ago) Bookmark

tamtam otm as usual

Joseph Kahn (Torque - yeah, I know...) offers a rebuttal.

So that and the original piece cancel each other out and the rest of us can just enjoy shit crashing into each other as it stands, yes?

no you're enjoying it wrong

lol Ned OTM

also that second piece seems to be a long, drawn out riff on my "You're an idiot?" question

on TNT right now

just watched heathers and j.d. kinda reminded me of ledger as the joker