early-90s alt-rock vs. late-90s alt rock

the whole nu-metal thing wasnt just rap + metal, it had something to do with specific tunings didnt it?

yeah, i think that's about right (plus the rhythms and distinctive nu-metal vocals) -- otherwise, you could back even further than Korn (or RATM) and say that either Faith No More or (God help us all) the Red Hot Chili Peppers were the first nu-metal bands.

yeah i wasn't conflating rap metal and nu-metal, just saying that RATM only ever got described as anything + metal when being lumped in with the biggest existing rap/rock trend.

I know FNM & Helmet kinda got blamed (unfairly) for nu-metal, but they definitely were not nu-metal.

a lot of the beefs against nu-metal, if i remember correctly, centered on (a) the whiny/juvenile/dumb lyrics (see especially Fred Durst) -- though emo/crabcore has taken over as the whipping boy in that regard nowadays; (b) the hip-hop influences were really badly executed (lyricists who couldn't rap to save their lives, shitty beats, etc.); and (c) the simple fact that this shit was inescapable.

D) and was shit

music aside, the early 90s (by which i mean 1990-1995) was more classic/exciting not just because i liked the alt-rock music better than the stuff that came out from 1996-1999. there was also the excitement of hearing stuff that my friends and i NEVER would've thought would make it onto mainstream radio end up precisely there -- and not just Nirvana. i was thrilled as a teen when stuff like the Cure and Depeche Mode finally got through to the mainstream in 1989-1990 (and wished that other favorites of that time like the Smiths or Echo and the Bunnymen would've stuck it out just a bit longer to enjoy the same kind of success) and they (along with Faith No More) kind of paved the way. i still remember the time when my friends and i were walking near Frat Row on our college campus circa 1992 and hearing Nirvana, the Pixies and Nine Inch Nails blasting therefrom. it seemed like it meant SOMETHING to us (esp. since in the not-too-distant-past all you'd hear from such quarters was either buttrock or dance-pop).

obviously, the thrill wore off when alt-rock became the NEW mainstream and you'd have to wade through the Stabbing Westwards, the Candleboxes, the Collective Souls etc. to get to the good stuff.

It's also no coincidence that the rise of the Internet happened at the same time as major labels lost interest in "alternative" (nicely chronicled in Dean Wareham's memoir) and returned to boy bands and hip-hop. In 1992 I would've heard The Raincoats on my local college station; in 2000 I had to download them through Napster.

can you explain the connection there?

i think he means that from Napster onwards you didn't have to rely on college/weirdo-commercial radio stations anymore to hear stuff like the Raincoats. i also imagine that there wasn't much (if any) profit to the record companies from stocking up on stuff like the Raincoats anyway (lol remember all of those cut-out bins full of the breeder's last splash?).

it's certainly no accident that it took a band like Metallica to take on Napster. who the hell would've bankrolled a legal challenge to Napster lead by the Raincoats or the Breeders (assuming that either band would've even wanted to sue in the first place)?!?

Eisbaer otm -- I was finishing my reply before you posted.

the real surprise is the age breakdown?

not w/r/t what they voted for, but that ilm is now majority 30+

I still feel like The Youngest ILXor sometimes and I'm almost 27 now.

ilm is ilxors who care enough about 90s alt-rock to click on a thread entitled "early-90s alt-rock vs. late-90s alt rock" are now majority 30+

(though I was surprised too)

i'm not surprised -- really, i've always kind of taken it as an article of faith that the first half of the 90s was the better one wr2 music than the second and not surprised about the age either. it is kind of interesting and shocking to be reminded that lots of us are now old folk, though.

you guys seem to be overlooking
early-90s alt rock (younger than 30) 35

So it's clearly not just 30+ ilxors who think it was better

Of course, an 80s alt-rock vs 90s alt-rock would almost definitely be a win for the 80s, since the 80s is ILM's canonic decade.

pfunk, was mostly talking about the #s of over 30s vs. under 30s, not their choices

it will be interesting to watch the 90s become more lionized over the course of the next decade or so. assuming that the 20-year lag still applies.

we already have a (rather great) ace of base sounding-ass song in the billboard top ten so

i wonder what would win early vs late 90s polls for pop, rnb, hip hop,metal etc

I'll do the metal one
Early 90s Metal Vs Mid 90s Metal Vs Late 90s Metal