Sonic Youth: Classic or Dud/S&D?

when wasn't this a careerist strategy ? and apathy about what ?

that's true. i keep forgetting that, imagining (as many old 'british punk' fans did) that punk was a musical reaction against establishment rather than the then-demonised establishment music (eg the Sex Pistols 'anarchy', Thatcher), although of course, the british punks put myriad different fans' grievances on the front page as expressions of anger/ frustration about something -- whichever, even protrayal of apathy/nihilism, it won't be misconstrued as guidance in america, misconstrued as advocacy of free expression,
ie these rock stars' apathy won't be misconstrued in the role model way that it has been for countless 'tough' rock bands

so in the "year that punk broke" in the US economy, you had to be apathetic about achieving any sort of mob manifestation of youthful anger/ frustration in the dominant media -- does this sound right ? you had to be cynical that things would be taken anywhere by any of this musical activity anyway ?

sy in their public appearances did always appear pessimistic about achieving anything beyond teenage rebellion, and that as if it was some sort of joke

the british punks -- well there were years of rock re-thinks in the '80s, with all sorts of splinters, coups and failures, and some of this oi yob stuff even, all with politics emblazened to suit their various ambitions

and so sonic youth, recognising the futility of changing minds, had their 'broken' or 'american punk' 'punk year', their MTV time, and now they're revivalist .. for whom ? bob dylan, or "new weird america", or musical heroes (idols) who haven't had a fair go because of the notorious commercial jazz industry (for example)

is it because the economies were different or because you can forget about trying to change anything in america anyway (given what happened to the hippies who at least had vietnam to complain about) ?

so it's as though they predicted the apathy and even presented as apathetic -- happy to be a music journalist's cult band ?

so "kill y'r idols" -- who were the idols ? was this just competitive or posturing, not aesthetic ? careerist-punk ? a catchy original punk slogan now abandoned, i reckon

but now we have another vietnam, with nyc the only smoking gun -- i'm curious to see where sy will go now, with nyc trilogy part3 beckoning, and with the media focus of Murray Street speaking for itself

sonic youth _is_ a catchy punk slogan, and finally people particularly younger people in the US have plenty to complain about again, so it's like full circle to a proper fit this time for the call-to-arms, and nyc pt3 will be as big as you's, your disillusion

maybe i should give it a break,
a thread "top 20 sonic youth songs and why" thread would interest me

i don't want to block others talking about sonic youth around here and i may have been a bit impolite,
but i'm real curious as to what various sy songs mean to different people

someone start a positive sonic youth thread and i promise i won't interupt, i'll do something else

it would be better if it wasn't me that started that new sy thread i want to,
but someone else is reading this hopefully

(b.t.w. i think i've made (incomplete) perfect sense, i might not be at all correct but i've left out some of the connections i'd thought of suggesting later on -- it is interesting to discuss this band -- people do seem to have a hesitancy to discuss the many aspects to sonic youth -- nah, it's just me)

Search songs: Schizophrenia, Genetic, Cotton Crown, Hey Joni, Providence, Skip Tracer, Brave Men Run, Brother James, Inhuman, Becuz, Sympathy For the Strawberry, Rain on Tin, Expressway To Yr Skull, Shadow of a Doubt, Hoarfrost, Eric's Trip, Free City Rhymes, Anagrama

Keep in mind that there's also a huge amount of shitty SY material out there. Be warned.

Oddly enough, I had a conversation this morning with a co-worker who said he used to like SY but thinks they took a major nosedive with those two albums. For him, SY was never better than the five-year period between Daydream Nation and Dirty. Of course, he's five years older than me and I think those were probably the first three SY albums he ever heard, back when he was a teenager.

(And meanwhile, though I like Dirty and Goo okay, I hardly ever listen to them.)

Evol
Confusion is Sex
Sister
Bad Moon Rising
Experimental Jet Set
Daydream Nation
A Thousand Leaves
Dirty
Goo
NYC Ghosts & Flowers
Washing Machine

(Note: I don't think Sonic Youth has yet released a truly bad album so even the last five on my list have some great moments.)

AHEM:

http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/drd800/d808/d80872xi202.jpg

http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/drd200/d284/d28473xgh9r.jpg

my favorite SY albums are dirty and confusion is sex, weirdly enough. i still can't sit through daydream nation without falling asleep.

I'm deadly serious in this opinion by the way. She's not so totally stoopid that she sings *that* badly. It's a cool druggy "i don't care, gimme what i want" attitude. Dirty's 'Swimsuit Issue' is a brilliant example; her vocals are so atrociously bad it's obvious that it's part of a style she's aware of & in attempting to achieve.

But, I love almost all of their albums.

http://www.mp3search.ru/album.html?id=19676

Here, Matts off-key jazz accompanies her off-key verbal meanderings..

http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/upcoming_releases/sonic_youth_-_sonic_life.html

I wasn't so hot on the EP when I first heard it (just post Confusion Is Sex) but it's aged nicely. Will be interesting to see how it's received the 3rd time around.

Hi dlp!

http://rateyourmusic.com/album_images/s409133.jpg

i'm having an argument with a friend who says he doesn't like sy - his argument basically consists of "how many of their songs can you sing? i bet not any" (he is not a luddite, he's into lots of good stuff, but has a real block with certain bands, artier ones i guess). i seem to spend half my life wandering around singing sy songs under my breath but i think i'm a bit too close to it and half the time i'm singing the texture not the tune, if that makes any sense. so... request suggestions for a melody-based sy comp?

i'm not sure if i've already commented somewhere on this thread, but of course classic.

and search pretty much the whole catalogue. at the very least, there's something interesting going on in all the records. don't really bother with the nyc ghosts and flowers thing though