frank kogan needs to know the diff between a pub and a bar

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Anxiety of WHAT?!?!

― Jerry the Nipper (Jerrynipper), Monday, 3 February 2003 16:17 (twenty-one years ago) link

!!!

It begins!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 3 February 2003 16:20 (twenty-one years ago) link

Ned, that's not what I meant at all! I meant that I only have one joke and I use it ad nauseum.

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Monday, 3 February 2003 16:21 (twenty-one years ago) link

Ah, understood. But it's such a fine joke!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 3 February 2003 16:22 (twenty-one years ago) link

The myth that Ali G was much loved by the Queen Mum was part of the Viz tribute to her last week which had an excellent illustration of this.

It is unfortunately untrue.

Though mention of Queen Mum brings up the spectre of Gin Palaces.

― Pete (Pete), Monday, 3 February 2003 16:32 (twenty-one years ago) link

launched into JB

I.e., called Julie Burchill penny dreadful and a dreck columnist, but when I first read your post, Mark, I thought you were saying that he launched into the writerly equivalent of "Please Please Please," complete with cloak routine.

― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Monday, 3 February 2003 16:37 (twenty-one years ago) link

Everyone around here, except for students, very much make out 'going to the bar' for a special occasion; friday nights, when the game is on, etc. Then there are the office workers who go down to their local T.G.I. Fridays after work (the worst thing about having to work in the suburbs, I'd imagine; only lame, suburby type bars available). I wouldn't mind having a local bar, but I don't really like drinking all that much. I've realized this lately, and I feel like a big wuss, but I just don't like it.

― Mandee, Monday, 3 February 2003 17:10 (twenty-one years ago) link

I think Jerry is on to something: in the US the faux English/Irish -style pubs mostly have booths -- they are very cozy!

What is the feminized pub again?

I had a bit of trouble distinguishing bars from clubs in England. Gareth: Was Mother a bar? And if so, why was there a line to get in?

Let us not foget the late '90s bar offshoot (US) -- the lounge!

― Mary (Mary), Monday, 3 February 2003 17:51 (twenty-one years ago) link

The one US English-style pub I was taken to, in San Diego, was horribly wrong, a bad pastiche rather than an authentic transcription.

I don't what Mother is or was, but if there was a queue I cann't accept it as a pub. People do queue for bars, as they can be trendy.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Monday, 3 February 2003 20:35 (twenty-one years ago) link

It was San Diego! You're supposed to go to a good local taco joint, not a pub!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 3 February 2003 20:45 (twenty-one years ago) link

Do pubs in England still have little windows through which you order your drinks, or is there typically a proper "bar" with seats, a bartender behind, and so on? When I think of "pub" I think of where the family meets in Distant Voices, Still Lives (which takes place in the '50s).

― Amateurist (amateurist), Monday, 3 February 2003 20:46 (twenty-one years ago) link

US: If there is a line it is a club. We would never line up to go to a bar.

The one US English-style pub I was taken to, in San Diego, was horribly wrong, a bad pastiche rather than an authentic transcription.

But that is right for us, I mean, I think you got the real thing, the real pastiche.

San Diego has lots of Blarney Stars, yes? Or is that just where I end up my relatives?

― Mary (Mary), Monday, 3 February 2003 20:49 (twenty-one years ago) link

mother is what is termed as a 'dj bar', its kind of a hybrid between a bar and a club. its free so doenst really count as a club. the queue was because it was full!

― gareth (gareth), Monday, 3 February 2003 20:52 (twenty-one years ago) link

So, what would you people say is the difference between a bar fight and a pub fight?

― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Monday, 3 February 2003 23:13 (twenty-one years ago) link

I'd beat you in a pub fight (cause I'd take you outside, or if you spilt my pint, I'd empty the glasses I have in either hand and then clap them around your ears), but in a bar fight, everyone's joining in (domino-style) so you might be able to take me.

― Cozen (Cozen), Monday, 3 February 2003 23:30 (twenty-one years ago) link

Wait, define 'lie'.

― Cozen (Cozen), Monday, 3 February 2003 23:33 (twenty-one years ago) link

I think a lot of misinformation is being offered here re: American nightlife. An establishment does not need "pub" in the name to be a pub, it just needs to want to be Irish, or Scottish, or English. And since white people in America have their panties up in a giant soggy bunch about the supposed beauty of Irish and Italian culture, as if these are the only two cultures on Earth out of which anything remotely interesting has ever arisen, there are a lot of aspiring pubs: if you look in the bar listings for any major city you will find a section that says "Irish Pubs" under which are consolidated loads of not-necessarily-Irish places with lots of dark wood and pictures of Kennedy on the walls and names like Tommy O'Flooperty's or Seamus McDinglesnot's or whatever the hell else (reasonable sorting-out of Irish vs. Scottish vs. English tropes is a plus but not at all necessary for success, meaning "the Kilted Haggis-Eating Leprechaun" could do just fine). The good thing about these places is that they are calm and pubby and they have those oatmeal stouts I love so much. These places are really easy to distinguish in the U.S. because they are basically going way out of their way to pretend they exist in another nation entirely.

Jerry's description of a pub-like Denver establishment sounds like a sports bar, which I don't see entering into the UK picture: I assume sports get watched at pubs? Sports bars are terrible. Absolutely terrible. They are like bars, not pubs (pubs, in their constant attempts to be like something out of Dubliners, only show European soccer) -- only they're not like bars, insofar as the point is mainly to serve people chicken wings and beer while they watch events.

― nabisco (nabisco), Monday, 3 February 2003 23:52 (twenty-one years ago) link

Actually scratch that: sports bars tend, decor-wise, to be something like Hooters.

― nabisco (nabisco), Monday, 3 February 2003 23:53 (twenty-one years ago) link

With lots of grown men yelling "FUCK!!!!" and pounding on their own legs.

In New York there's a place called "McSwiggin's"

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 3 February 2003 23:56 (twenty-one years ago) link

why nabisco whatever could you mean?

― Amateurist (amateurist), Monday, 3 February 2003 23:57 (twenty-one years ago) link

From my own brief experience on that little island off the coast of France there is absolutely no pressure about going to a pub. But if you know you're going to a bar the string tightens up a bit.

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 3 February 2003 23:59 (twenty-one years ago) link

No no no Nabitsuh, the Paddy McBoomerang phenomenon gives you pub-like spaces (to be sure) but I must put to you the whole concept of the Irish bar eg. McSorley's Ale House or the places like one run by friend of my dad's. There's not much food and a Moe's/No Woo-man Allowed vibe and you CANNOT get Scotch due to Protestant wrongness of same (and don't forget the discreet collection tin near the bar itself).

Sorry, had to point that out but otherwise the American 'pub' locator you suggest is flawless.

Urgh, Hooters. A pastiche of this has opened on Clerkenwell Road called HONKERS and it is morguishly empty every time I pass.

― suzy (suzy), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 00:03 (twenty-one years ago) link

Honkers! I am imagining ducks in tiny orange shorts shaking their tail-feathers!

(Ha, okay Amateurist, I have not been to Nevin's in years, but yes it used to be a fine example of a "pub" without the word "pub" in its name. But now they have, like, John Cale and Yo La Tengo bookings -- and where are they doing this stuff? did they take over the ex-Cajun place next door to put in a stage? -- so clearly they are trying hard to become a "bar" and not just a bar but a venue. Which sucks so far as I can tell because surely their oh-so-terrific shepherd's pie will eventually be a thing of the past.)

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 00:05 (twenty-one years ago) link

If they'd used the current slang here the bar would be called Baps (impossible, that should be a topless sandwich bar) or Chesticles or even Norks.

― suzy (suzy), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 00:13 (twenty-one years ago) link

(sound of me barfing)

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 00:14 (twenty-one years ago) link

Amateurist are you serious about us still having that hatch thing? I think that was only ever some places anyway.

― N. (nickdastoor), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 00:17 (twenty-one years ago) link

amateurist is thinking of star trek

― mark s (mark s), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 15:06 (twenty-one years ago) link

Suzy makes me glad I'm not there right now.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 15:53 (twenty-one years ago) link

Eh?

― suzy (suzy), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 17:22 (twenty-one years ago) link

Because that current slang sounds so atrocious! It's horrible enough having to read it, I don't want to accidentally hear it. (What I'm saying is, I'm on side with Nabisco.)

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 17:24 (twenty-one years ago) link

I think this is one of those days where nothing works right.

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 17:31 (twenty-one years ago) link

Aww, Tracer ::hugs::

― suzy (suzy), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 17:33 (twenty-one years ago) link

We should all just go directly home and go to sleep and agree that tomorrow will be Tuesday or something, seriously. My day has SUCKED so far.

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 17:37 (twenty-one years ago) link

:-( Take that day off, Tracer. If it's turning out bad, don't force yourself to deal with it further.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 17:54 (twenty-one years ago) link

Bleeeah. It's not that easy, Ned. Thanks for the good vibes though :) At least I'm not one of the seven poor fuckers who decided this was a good day to climb up the Brooklyn Bridge's suspension cables - I've been intermittently monitoring their progress; over the last half hour a huge fucking STORM has whipped up down here - and now I don't see them!

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 18:09 (twenty-one years ago) link

Erm. Is doing such a thing in winter a good idea anyway?

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 18:20 (twenty-one years ago) link

Right, like it wouldn't be equally dumb in summer?

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 18:24 (twenty-one years ago) link

If I had to climb something tall and the choice was between cold winds chafing yer butt and humid weather that you could at least drink water for...

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 18:38 (twenty-one years ago) link

Random girl I overheard: OMG I looooove Irish pubs, except I only like authentic ones--none of that Bennigans stuff. Ooh, you know, have you been to FADO before? It's SUPER realistic, like, you just stepped into Ireland.

This is only funny if you have been to Fado before, seeing as it's a CHAIN restaurant that serves dishes like baked brie and munster and pear quesadilla. Sounds really authentic, hm?

― Mandee, Tuesday, 4 February 2003 18:45 (twenty-one years ago) link

It's SUPER realistic, like, you just stepped into Ireland.

Kill people like this the next time you see them, please.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 18:47 (twenty-one years ago) link

Suzy, did you just make up those slang terms for breasts? I've never heard them before. We both live in East London, though we clearly move in different circles. Who uses these terms?

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 19:57 (twenty-one years ago) link

Also: SHOW US YR NORKS

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 20:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

I live in Central London ;-) but picked up a load of them through observatin' Popbitch.

― suzy (suzy), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 20:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

Martin, I don't believe you've never heard 'baps' before. That's been around forever.

― N. (nickdastoor), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 20:03 (twenty-one years ago) link

Does Halle Berry know that people in the UK think she starred in a movie called Knockers?

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 20:03 (twenty-one years ago) link

I'm not sure I have heard 'baps', other than referring to bread rolls. I am obviously not in enough conversations about breasts, which is certainly not by choice.

Sorry, Suzy - I have lost track of where you live. No offence was intended.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 20:10 (twenty-one years ago) link

Martin your man of the world image has been severely dented!

Our backward circle is still on 'puppies', I'm afraid.

― Tom (Groke), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 21:17 (twenty-one years ago) link

'baps' was definitely around in the south west 10 years ago.

― toby (tsg20), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 21:45 (twenty-one years ago) link

British American Princess?

― Mary (Mary), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 22:21 (twenty-one years ago) link

[censored] to thread!!

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Tuesday, 4 February 2003 22:22 (twenty-one years ago) link

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