TS: R.E.M.'s "Life's Rich Pageant" vs "Document"

there is some mythical construction wherein this album is the breaking point for early fans. but i'm not sure if it's true.

No, because Fables was so damn slow and boring. It was good that they started rocking again.

TS: "Rain On The Scarecrow" vs "I Believe"

All that said, it was Lifes that I listened to over and over this year. Although "King of Birds" is awful compelling.

green is the record that broke the spirit of a lot of "older" fans, but it's actually fantastic and they are crazy.

Mitya, Green is my favorite! (xxxpost, ;)

Also, I will fight for "End of the World as We Know It" any day of the week!

I've always loved 'Disturbance At The Heron House' .. and yes.. Oddfellows - something perverse about it.. The album has held up better than I might have expected.. I only have patience for about 12 REM songs anymore, and two or three of them are from Document, which is a pretty good record.

(xposts .. Fables .. I'll save that for another thread...)

No, no, this is totally OTM. It would be even more OTM if you could swap Monster for Out of Time.

And it's LRP 6-4 + whatever credit attaches to Underneath the Bunker. Very gratified to see so much love here for "Just a Touch" -- the one song I'd really have liked to see them play.

LRP and Document were probably my two favorite R.E.M. records in 1991, but "The One I Love" and "End of the World" haven't aged as well as some of the other hitzzzz (though the great ending of EotW sneaks it past Amanita still.) I think Murmur beats both of these.

But with time, I came to see it as what it is: a - may I say this? - tour de force of R.E.M.'s strengths. It's like a showcase of their considerable powers. "Fall on Me" (Michael's favorite, as you may know) is essence of R.E.M., with Mike Mills harmonies and jangling (I'm a rock critic!) guitars. And the rest of the songs already cited showed how R.E.M. could swing from folk to rock and back again.

So yeah, it's an odd little album. It's weird, because its perfection somehow, oddly, makes it forgotten. It seems like it's universally acclaimed, yet rarely discussed. Almost taken for granted.

But that may just be me.

it augurs a rather uneven period from which they didn't emerge until the release of Out of Time

green is better than both of these and out of time.

TS: "Rain On The Scarecrow" vs "I Believe"

"Rain on the Scarecrow" kicks just about any song's ass up, down and sideways.

I might agree with this. Actually, I think Fables WOULD HAVE been their best album if it had been produced better.

So Alfred are you saying it's only almost-great because some of the lyrics are opaque? Might have been full-on great if he'd been saying something more explicit?

I saw them do it live a couple of years ago and he was talking about how he never gets to catch his breath in the song and (goofing) fell down when it was over.

Do it sound to anyone like a different take punched in when he gets to the line "Trust in your calling?"

Lifes Rich Pageant, though I've burned out on bits of it a little, and NEVER liked What If We Give It Away, is just packed with great songs that SOUND great. No contest.

always thought it was "i believe the poles are shifting"

But yes, LRP is pretty much perfect - great songs, lots of variety, stellar lead and backing vox and a really punchy, garagey sound. No duff tracks, in comparison with the wretched 'It's the End Of The World', and the dull Fireplace and Lightnin' Hopkins. I'm not sure about Exhuming McCarthy either. I hated it at first, but now I think it's a half-written curio, perhaps not bad, but sub-standard definitely. I've always loved Welcome To The Occupation - great vocals on that, especially near the end : 'Listen To Meee, LISTEN to MEEE'.

I also think that Fables might be the best of the lot though.

It's his enunciation that's imprecise.

If you really stretch the idea, "Disturbance at the Heron House" has a subtle political message, though, even if it is (I agree) child-like (but not childish). It's somewhat of a cry against mindlessly obeying authority. And it has a nice opening riff from Peter Buck to coat the messsage.

That song was one of the ones where you knew that even if the production on their records was changing, they were still growing and getting better. They were like completely different on that tour!

turning in my True Distiple card

lol Andrew

Document" is my least fsvorite and "Pageant" my most favorite of the IRS years. But in reality my most played REM over the last decade or so is "Dead Letter Office"! Such fun, that one...

Fables is my favorite REM LP too.

"Man Ray kind of sky" may be corny, but it just sounds good and Stipe seemed to value that over anything

still, I'm in the vocal minority of fans that thinks Side 2 of Document is one of the weirdest, best and most pure (last?) distillations of the IRS-era band

idk about best/pure, but i like it a lot and it is indeed pretty weird

With hindsight I dont really understand why they needed to release an album every year?

Capitalising on momentum is one thing but not quite the same when you're short of original material

the custody battle over these albums is going to be complicated. a lot of claims out there.

i love LRP. there are plenty of lyrical moments that grab me on it, and plenty to beguile, as well. within the first few seconds of the album, he's already referencing the apostrophe-less title of the album, sort of, and cole porter's 'begin the beguine'

Austin, gah. Fall on Me, Swan Swan Hummingbird, Superman... and nothing memorable in there, lyrically speaking? Okay.

fuckin "cuyahoga" and "these days" too

when you're short of original material

not seeing it

It is remarkable how they released all those classic albums, one per year, from ‘83 – ‘88.

Sax solo on “Fireplace” is so good.

Document is a slight dip on the preceding 4 for me, and Fables is probly still my default favourite, but on the whole i think they're all great records that have a couple of duff tracks each maybe but people can't agree on which tracks those are

Murmur will always be my favourite R.E.M. album, hearing it after only knowing Automatic + Monster + various hits was such a revelation to me but LRP is a close second and probably the one I listen to the most. Lyric-wise it's definitely one of their most memorable for me (caveat: I'm not a huge lyrics person), lines like "I believe in coyotes and time as an abstract" pop into my head a lot. But yeah really none of the IRS records are less than great.

a mean idea to call my own
a hundred million birds fly away

a meager thing, recognition

I miss the days when there were so many R.E.M. threads we were bored of them.

fly to carry each his burden

that's great, it starts with

happy throngs, take this joy wherever
wherever the tax returns are

Offering the educated
Primitive and loyal

Our father's father's father tried
Erased the parts he didn't like

What the heck is going on at the beginning of “Superman”?

The scratchy spoken intro is attributed to a Japanese pull-string Godzilla doll.[3] Translated loosely from the Japanese, it says, "This is a special news report. Godzilla has been sighted in Tokyo Bay. The attack on it by the Self-Defense Force has been useless. He is heading towards the city. Aaaaaaaaagh...."

Oh yeah, I do hear the word “Gojira” now

I think 'Disturbance At The Heron House' might be one of his finest vocal melodies, I often wonder if it was difficult to replicate in a live setting because he always used a slightly lower, less vaulting melody.

Not my favourite R.E.M. era. Picking "Life's Right Pageant" because "Fall On Me".

Life's Rich Pageant is gorgeous, but I dunno it was a more vulnerable time for me and I can't listen to it. At the time I liked it more, but now that I'm a mean crusty old fart, I prefer Document 'cos it's louder and darker.

Fables > LRP > Document

I think. I love it all but Document seems a little... icy?

Icy? It's literally the one they told you to "File Under Fire"!

document has a hell of a side two cf. "fireplace". i prob prefer it to both fables and lrp at this point, it's so endearingly odd and transitional

I was actually just listening to Document straight through for the first time in a couple of years and "fire" is the right word for it. "Finest Worksong" sounds to me like a band that's just absolutely GOING for it, straining to throw every possible sound at the problem.

also forever thankful to r.e.m. for introducing me to wire. great cover too

That cover is probably the best representation in their official recorded output of the insanely great house party band they were in 1980-81

good point! you can hear a twisted version of that party on "Lightnin' Hopkins" too.

side 2 of Document is brittle spooky forest music, like let's rub ourselves in mud and run through the jungle, way past the Heron House

OTM Brad. I think side 2 of Document is a career highlight. If LRP was a tentative exploration of how they could pursue a more direct sound and remain eccentric, Document is a band fully at home in it's new sound, finding out it's still a pretty weird place anyway.

I adore Document.

you're not yet young
there's time to teach

Swan Swan H < King of Birds (close)

I no longer thing this is close, King of Birds by a wide margin (but both are great)