2004 I Love Baseball All Star Thread: Cast Your Votes

for some reason i always thought you had to pass some really hard test to gain membership (which would be cool) but it turns out all you need do is give them money: http://store.sabr.org/sabrstore.cfm?page=list.cfm&cat=0&man=&mem_ID=30478&afid=&criteria=1001&action=list&startrow=1&maxrows=10&. oh well.

(nomar is a more talented player, and i'm a yankees fan)(though he was worse last year, offensively)

Figuring out "how to win ballgames" is kind of a waste of time to me. I'm not a player, coach or in any way involved with a professional baseball team at a decision-making level. I don't think anyone else at ILB is either.

My only problem with the whole SABR-nerd phenomenon remains the aura of elitism about it, as you've illustrated. "My way of enjoying the game is the right way, the One True Path, yours sucks."

(Oh, and my seat-of-the-pants/"When It Was A Game"-fucking-rules response to SABR-disciple superiority would be: "You've turned an occasionally beautiful, poetic, mythological and mystical game into a calculus class, fuck a bunch of that.")

I'd just like to say, for the record, that I can swing & miss with the best of 'em (amateurs). Unfortunately, my pops thought that being big-boned from the waist down = nascent power hitter, when what it really meant = I NEED PLEATS.

I'd also like to note the subtext in Milo's "how to win ballgames" comments - that is, "only professionals shd be concerned with how to win ballgames", which is the same sort of (IN MY OPINION) floofy hoohah that taints all "why do you music critics bother to write about music?" discussions on ILM.

But, as noted before, there's plenty of room for stat whores and fuddy-duddy luddites here, and there ain't no need to fuck washing hats over it.

I don't even know anymore. http://i.imdb.com/Photos/CMSIcons/emoticons/basic2/sigh.gif

Of course there's room for both - I took a potshot at one segment because a potshot was taken at another. (also: I'm in second place in a league that will pay ~$1200 for first, this is inherently less of a waste of time for me than calculating win shares.)

I respect the concept of the new(er) stats and way of looking at them, but I'll never consider them to be the most important factor in how I look at baseball. There are too many variables that no mathematical formula can ever account for.

ILM analogy time again, and this is just random thoughts - sometimes stat-geekery reminds me of people claim there's a specific formula or necessary quality to 'good' music, singer has to have a great voice, three power chords aren't enough, etc.. That focuses on one aspect, which can be great and enlightening and fun, but excludes all the other things that people love about music. I'll take the solo from "Boredom" over the guy who knows all his scales any day of the week, y'know?

I AM a member; I said I'm not a sabermetrician -- unless being a consumer of the info counts. I touched no math in college, and was happy.

Again, there are arguments on meaningful issues all the time *within* SABR. And a huge portion of the membership, me included, blanch at the mention of a regression analysis.

And of course I'm not thinking about VORP all the time.

as i've said before, my intro to baseball more or less WAS statistics (sad as it is to say), so they are and always have been the most important factor in how i look at the game. but it's not just that: as a fan, the most important thing my team can do for me is win games - in general, i don't care how - and that's the case with most fans, so that's what these 100M dollar franchises are built to do. that's what the players are paid to do: you can talk about entertainment value and all that, but the bottom line is they're out there to win, because that's what people want and that's what makes people come. so understanding the hows and the whys of winning, and valuing it very highly, as it's ultimately the goal of (excuse me as i generalize) everyone involved - players, teams, and fans alike - is vastly important. and that, of course, is what sabermetrics is all about.

[spoken like a true yankee fan etc]

(correct me if i'm wrong milo, but you don't follow any specific team, right? that might explain the difference in perception here)

I'd take him this year
over all your fancy boys,
breaking out like zits

Winning is low on my list of reasons (never a very competitive person when it came to things I wasn't directly involved in).

My introduction to baseball was half historical - playing dice-based games of my own making, reading the old Baseball Encyclopedias, Field of Dreams, etc. - and playing rotisserie.

NL
1B T. Helton, COL
2B J. Kent, HOU
3B S. Rolen, STL
SS J. Wilson, PIT
C J. Kendall, PIT
OF L. Berkman, HOU
OF B. Bonds, SF
OF C. Wilson, PIT

*Stop Jeter (with Nomar)

*Stop Adam Everett (with Renteria)

I really can't quibble with Sheffield, God knows he's a better starting OF choice than Damon.

Godzilla and Ichiro vault over Sheffield ... late precincts from overseas.

Oh, don't worry. I just voted and Everett should be back on top.

If Renteria did win by 6, it would literally be the only election I've ever personally decided.