I think the real story of Season 5 is that the Sun didn't post one story about anything that actually mattered in the entire season! They looked out the window and saw that the ghetto was on fire; they didn't know who Prop Joe was; etc.
― real bears playing hockey (polyphonic), Tuesday, 29 December 2009 04:03 (fourteen years ago) link
I think the reason that Season 5 feels the weakest - and this is tied in to what others have said - is that it violates the ethos of the rest of the series. It's less about damage done by heavy blows and more about that done by "a thousand tiny cuts." It's the apathy, the bureaucracy, the mediocrity, conventions and routines - rather than gross incompetence or neglicence - the incompetence and neglicence are all routine and seen as "part of the game."
― sarahel, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 04:13 (fourteen years ago) link
man marlo's flatness is almost made up for by that final shot standing on the corner in his gold suit, bleeding from his cut
I also love the way he goes 'yeah' under his breath like he's convincing himself that he's the best
― =皿= (dyao), Tuesday, 29 December 2009 06:14 (fourteen years ago) link
I called it the last word on the '00s, which I don't think is pushing it:
http://www.vita.mn/story.php?id=80419047
― Pete Scholtes, Saturday, 2 January 2010 23:14 (fourteen years ago) link
IRL Wire-type shit:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB126213528444809699.html?mod=article-outset-box
(lol @ the ridiculously outdated photos)
― pithfork (Hurting 2), Sunday, 3 January 2010 15:34 (fourteen years ago) link
One Los Angeles-area Latino gang, Barrio Hawaiian Gardens
lol, scary sounding
― =皿= (dyao), Monday, 4 January 2010 03:54 (fourteen years ago) link
feel like a lame for catching onto this so late, but season one was fucking mindblowing, wow. just went out and bought the next two today, and judging from the poll results everyone pretty much agrees the nest three seasons are better? what???? really looking forward to watching
― the bait vs. radrake david (k3vin k.), Monday, 4 January 2010 06:52 (fourteen years ago) link
also SPOILER and i'm sure everyone feels the same way but wallace getting shot really fucked me up, that shit is giving me nightmares
― the bait vs. radrake david (k3vin k.), Monday, 4 January 2010 06:54 (fourteen years ago) link
Sometimes I actually say to myself "Wallace didn't really die! He's an actor!"
― pithfork (Hurting 2), Monday, 4 January 2010 07:05 (fourteen years ago) link
yeah when I first saw it I was like "no way, there's no way they're gonna kill him"
helps prepare you for the rest of the deaths in the show, though
― =皿= (dyao), Monday, 4 January 2010 07:08 (fourteen years ago) link
yeah really, i mean i cried like a bitch when it happened but it makes me sad just to think about it
i saw it like 3 days ago tho, i'll get over it
― the bait vs. radrake david (k3vin k.), Monday, 4 January 2010 07:09 (fourteen years ago) link
The realism thing is a bit of a red herring, yeah. The characters and institutions generally behave in realistic (or at least convincing) ways, but the dialogue and acting is definitely stylised. It's not a Ken Loach film.
― Communi-Bear Silo State (chap), Monday, December 28, 2009 2:48 PM (1 week ago) Bookmark
yes, ken loach's films are so much more realistic. ahahaha.
― the shart of noise (history mayne), Monday, 4 January 2010 09:57 (fourteen years ago) link
love this show and all that, but one scene that people seem to really love is omar in court, where he grandstands and says he's basically the same as the lawyer. the line is something like "i have a gun, you have a briefcase."
why do people like this, or agree with it? it would make a bit of sense if omar knew that levy was involved in killing people (which he is iirc? he not-so-tacitly recommends a murder?) but he doesn't know that, does he? levy's a lawyer who acts for criminals.
any road, despite the fact that the writers saw what was happening with the omar cult and had bunk call him on his shit, this scene bugs me.
― the shart of noise (history mayne), Monday, 4 January 2010 16:42 (fourteen years ago) link
he's talking about robbing drug dealers. they both leech off them.
― ♖♕♖ (am0n), Monday, 4 January 2010 16:48 (fourteen years ago) link
bit of a difference between being paid by drug dealers to represent them in court, and robbing drug dealers at gunpoint.
maybeit would be a better dramatic conflict if the dealer had a court-appointed lawyer (im unfamiliar with the US legal system but i guess you have these?).
― the shart of noise (history mayne), Monday, 4 January 2010 16:52 (fourteen years ago) link
if he had a court-appointed lawyer it would make less sense, they don't get money from the defendants. i think you're just taking his zing too literally :/. i mean if they really were the same it wouldn't be that shocking for him to say that.
― jortin shartgent (harbl), Monday, 4 January 2010 16:53 (fourteen years ago) link
its implied that he at least knows levy is on the take from that crew. levys not helping him out of the good of his heart. of course there's a difference but theres also a similarity in that they both leech off of them.
― ♖♕♖ (am0n), Monday, 4 January 2010 16:58 (fourteen years ago) link
helping them
and the scene is pretty hamfisted in the way its written, i'll give u that
― ♖♕♖ (am0n), Monday, 4 January 2010 16:59 (fourteen years ago) link
It seems like in the world of the show Levy would be known as a somewhat sleazy lawyer who makes his business helping drug dealers in semi-unsavory ways as well as legit legal ways. I agree it's not the show's sharpest point though - if Omar just means it about the kind of lawyer Levy is, it's so obvious that it hardly needs to be said. Levy is already pretty much the most detestable character on the show at point, whereas Omar is practically Robin Hood. There's nothing subversive about suggesting that a sleazy lawyer is sleazy. But if the show is making a comment about criminal defense lawyers in general, then it's a cheap zing and not a very thoughtful commentary.
― pithfork (Hurting 2), Monday, 4 January 2010 17:02 (fourteen years ago) link
It made sense to me. They both profit off the drug trade, whether people know it or not. Just as Omar "leeches off the violence of the drug trade" (by robbing them), Levy leeches of it too (maybe it becomes more clear later that Levy is a bit more than a guy that just represents them in court - which in itself is a still a job that is based around keeping violent drug dealers in business, so to speak).
I think a lot of it is made for affect. the face Levy makes, etc. And it ties into the whole idea that develops later about how the money goes everyone, and in some ways, everyone is complicit, so says Lester Freamon at least.
― EDB, Monday, 4 January 2010 17:02 (fourteen years ago) link
they have no choice but to pay him if they want to continue doing what they do so it's like extortion, and their money (which they get from selling drugs) goes to him. if people stopped doing crimes he would stop making money. he is therefore a bad man. xposts
― jortin shartgent (harbl), Monday, 4 January 2010 17:02 (fourteen years ago) link
it's a valuable zing imo
― jortin shartgent (harbl), Monday, 4 January 2010 17:03 (fourteen years ago) link
actually, that part about drug lawyers isn't exactly right...
I should also have read the other messages have been posted part
― EDB, Monday, 4 January 2010 17:04 (fourteen years ago) link
oh I meant that part about representing drug dealers being based on keeping violent drug dealers off the street isn't a matter of fact point.
― EDB, Monday, 4 January 2010 17:05 (fourteen years ago) link
"your honor, motion to strike omar's zing from the record""sustained"
― ♖♕♖ (am0n), Monday, 4 January 2010 17:05 (fourteen years ago) link
which in itself is a still a job that is based around keeping violent drug dealers in business, so to speak
ahhh... this is the bit i can't rly get behind. even rapers and pedos get to have legal representation.
i don't mind the scene *that* much, it's just that it crops up regularly in lists of best 'wire' quotes.
― the shart of noise (history mayne), Monday, 4 January 2010 17:07 (fourteen years ago) link
it's not an attack on the right to have representation, it's just pointing out that he benefits from crime. which is true of all paid defense lawyers but that doesn't undercut the criticism.
― jortin shartgent (harbl), Monday, 4 January 2010 17:09 (fourteen years ago) link
I think the reason people like it is because the "aaaah in your face Levy" element is funny.
― Space Battle Rothko (Matt DC), Monday, 4 January 2010 17:10 (fourteen years ago) link
Levy also advises them on ways to launder money, unless I'm mistaken?
― Space Battle Rothko (Matt DC), Monday, 4 January 2010 17:13 (fourteen years ago) link
what is so hard to understand about this
― dome plow (gbx), Monday, 4 January 2010 17:13 (fourteen years ago) link
not everyone is as smart as u
― jortin shartgent (harbl), Monday, 4 January 2010 17:13 (fourteen years ago) link
well the context is levy is trying to cast aspersions on omar's testimony because he profits off drug dealers and omar's like pfffft, who are you to talk? i agree the scene is kind of hokey but williams sells it.
― horseshoe, Monday, 4 January 2010 17:14 (fourteen years ago) link
yeah plus Omar knows that Levy isn't some public defender, but someone kept on retainer by Avon and his crew.
― Roz, Monday, 4 January 2010 17:17 (fourteen years ago) link
the wesley snipes in the courtroom scene in new jack city is better imo
― max, Monday, 4 January 2010 17:22 (fourteen years ago) link
this is BIGGER than nino brown! this is BIG BUSINESS!!
Nino Brown: I'm not guilty. *You're* the one that's guilty. The lawmakers, the politicians, the Columbian drug lords, all you who lobby against making drugs legal. Just like you did with alcohol during the prohibition. You're the one who's guilty. I mean, c'mon, let's kick the ballistics here: Ain't no Uzi's made in Harlem. Not one of us in here owns a poppy field. This thing is bigger than Nino Brown. This is big business. This is the American way.
― max, Monday, 4 January 2010 17:23 (fourteen years ago) link
LET'S KICK THE BALLISTICS HERE
otm
― ♖♕♖ (am0n), Monday, 4 January 2010 17:25 (fourteen years ago) link
ain't no UZIS made in HAAARLEM
― max, Monday, 4 January 2010 17:27 (fourteen years ago) link
the director's cut has the lawmakers, politicians and colombian drug lords all put on trial and found guilty.
― ♖♕♖ (am0n), Monday, 4 January 2010 17:34 (fourteen years ago) link
awesome
― the shart of noise (history mayne), Monday, 4 January 2010 17:49 (fourteen years ago) link
― ♖♕♖ (am0n), Monday, January 4, 2010 12:34 PM (38 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
we the jury find the ballistics kicked
― max, Monday, 4 January 2010 18:14 (fourteen years ago) link
there was some discussion here a while ago of the chess scene and why it's held as emblematic of how sharp the show is or whatever - with that, and with omar in court, i don't think it's so much that they're considered the best moments of the show, but that they're reasonably rare moments which epitomise what the show's about, that step back and summarise the dynamic of what's going on. they stand out from the text for being fully formed, quotable and standalone, compared to other moments which might be more niftily constructed, but are more specific in what they're dealing with.
maybe applies with chess more than omar in court, i don't know, but i can see why omar leveling the playing field and making broad transcendental comparisons would be popular.
― high-five machine (schlump), Monday, 4 January 2010 18:29 (fourteen years ago) link
eh the chess scene is too writerly and on-the-nose
omar-in-court is pretty clearly the writers just letting rip and having fun with a character they love. they do return to it thematically with clay-davis-in-court. the point, i think, is that the courts (or "the system" as a whole) grinds on with its boring mixture of corruption, incompetence and inertia, but every now and again there are moments of really flagrant and charismatic corruption that are a) interesting and b) might even bring about "just" ends in a perverse way.
― goole, Monday, 4 January 2010 18:35 (fourteen years ago) link
well yeah - it's fairly rare in the show for someone to have the opportunity to "speak truth to power" - so when it happens, like in that courtroom scene, it's refreshing.
― sarahel, Monday, 4 January 2010 18:39 (fourteen years ago) link
^^ argh this is what i mean. he isn't speaking truth to power.
― the shart of noise (history mayne), Monday, 4 January 2010 18:41 (fourteen years ago) link
but that's how it's presented in the context of the show!
― sarahel, Monday, 4 January 2010 18:41 (fourteen years ago) link
exactly!
― the shart of noise (history mayne), Monday, 4 January 2010 18:42 (fourteen years ago) link
the scene and omar himself argue pretty strongly against the possibility of justice.
― goole, Monday, 4 January 2010 18:43 (fourteen years ago) link